80% Rule

[Larks]

Worked two 4th grade tourney games today with a 30+ yr Exp "Old Guy". Very good ref and good experience for me to work with him. He gave me some great insights on certain sitch's and clarified a couple mechanics for me. He did throw one "mechanic" at me though that was a new one on me.

A's ball coming out of a time out. Lead (not me) is ready to admin the throw in....we call for em...C'Mon A...you know the drill. A finally breaks huddle and 2 of A's players approach Lead but neither move up to throw the ball in. They argue about who is "supposed" to throw it in....you know the argument.....Lead finally sets the ball on the floor after asking them repeatedly to take the %$%$@ ball and throw it in! (Profanity was not spoken but definately thought!). 1.....2.....A2 FINALLY grabs ball....3.....4.....I hear A's coach yelling "time out" and I blow my whistle to grant it at roughly the same time as Lead blows his and calls 5 second throw in violation. A coach yells to lead "I called time out"....Lead says, no 5 secs occured first. Ok, I'm cool with this....He's the R and has 36 years more experience on me so I roll with it.

At half time R says to me, you know the 80% rule? I said no...he says that if he is on 4 of a 5 sec count and is about to or is in the process of swinging his arm for the count of 5, there can be no time out. Its the "80% rule".

This is not intented to rip on this guy because I really enjoyed working with him....but if it was me, I award the time out.

Comments?

Larks

[BktBallRef]

Has he been to a rules clinic lately?

He was wrong.

That's a very old rule that was changed several years ago.

It no longer exists.

If the request was made before the count reached 5, the TO must be granted.

[paulis]

No 80 rule. Decide which came first, the time out request or the violation and go with it. Simply inform the coach that the two of you (officials) determined that one occured just prior to the other.

[bigwhistle]

Larks,

Did your partner also invoke the "lack of action" rule too?

[williebfree]

Since I am relatively new to officiating, I ask: "What was the rationale of the 80% Rule?"

[BktBallRef]

How 'bout the jump ball after every basket?

[Kelvin green]

willie, the 80% rule was that....
old definition- "Change of status" was about to occur. You could not call time out when the lack of action count was to 4, the closely guarded count was 4, the throw-in count was 4, the BC count was 8. I think there was a rationale that officials knew something was about to happen so let it happen witout complicating it with a time out...
I'm glad we got rid of that rule!

[Larks]

Originally posted by bigwhistle
Larks,

Did your partner also invoke the "lack of action" rule too?

That one didnt come up. It is amazing how many different ideas on how a game is called are out there. There is the book and then there is how the game is really officiated.

They are close but there are differences.

[Mark Padgett]

Your partner who invoked the 80% rule was 100% wrong.

[williebfree]

I appreciate the interpretation. However, I am still at a loss... I think you are going to travel when you catch the pass, therefore I will call travel... Then again, maybe I DO understand it!....LOL

YES, Thank goodness it has been done away with.

Season's Greetings to all!

[bossref]

These types of bonehead mistakes will
continue to be made by lazy refs
whether they have 1 year or 40 years experience.
When it happens again, show some balls and
confront the dumbs*&%$. Tell him he's wrong
and take charge to right the mistake.
It's too bad that some guys never concentrate
enough or care enough to know that some rules
have been changed.
I got a call last night from a coach wanting a clarification
of the time remaining in backcourt after a timeout.
Seems the "veteran" ref would only give the team 3 seconds
to advance the ball since they were at a 7 count when
the TO was called.Duh!

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by bossref
I got a call last night from a coach wanting a clarification of the time remaining in backcourt after a timeout.
Seems the "veteran" ref would only give the team 3 seconds
to advance the ball since they were at a 7 count when
the TO was called. Duh!

Sad day.

[DanIvey]

Hey Lark...I think I saw your game...the ol' guy had the kids raising their hands after every foul to!

Ho Ho Ho!