NBA Stars getting foul calls?
 

I thought superstars got were supposed to get all the calls?

Did anyone see the last shot attempt made by Lebron James and no foul was called? :D

Peace

Consider score, time, and situation and also where the game was played at. As much as I am huge Pistons fan, that was a foul on Hamilton.

Actually John I am going to have to disagree with you. For full disclosure I am a Piston fan as well. But this was not a foul if you look at the replay that was basically floor level. Hamilton put his hand on the ball and there was incidental contact with the arms. If you get the ball first, incidental contact should be after. This is especially the truth when the shooter was not knocked down. I would not call that foul in a middle school game.

Peace

So what about the beginning of the drive, when Hamilton stuck his left hand in LeBron's chest and used it to slow him down...nothing there either?

I saw Lebron use his right arm to get space and Hamilton held his ground. If anything, the play with Wallace where he Wallace hit the winning basket was a bigger foul than anything that took place on that final play.

Peace

I assume you are referring to an offensive foul on Wallace, right? If so, I would agree..I didn't really think there was a foul at the end of LeBron's move, but they never really showed a replay of the beginning which - when I first saw it live - made me go "Hmmmm".

I will admit I did not see the entire play, but that looked like a clear push off. I wonder if the officials thought the Cleveland player flopped.

I think there was pushing on both of the players parts and the officials just let it go. I saw the play live and that was my first impression. I thought that Hamilton might have even fouled. When I saw the replay I think my first impression was at the very least wrong. I think it was a great no call all the way.

Peace

My wife asked me if I was going to watch the basketball game. I said "What basketball game? There's a wrestling match on that's gonna end up around 72-69." It sounds like I was right.

The NBA....unwaaaaaaatchable! And boring as hell......

I went to NBA.com to take a look at it. It's at:

http://www.nba.com/video/

Click on "Wallace's Big Fourth". Play it on "slow" speed.

Is that a foul under basketball rules? Definitely!

Is it a foul under NBA rules? Apparently not!

The last-second drive video by LeBron is on there too.

No thanks. Not worth sitting through a commercial to look at. I'll wait for the youtube version.

There's no commercial.

Either that was a commercial or Marv's taken up wearing women's clothes again and he really loves his Blackberry.

He looks good btw, lost a lot of weight.

Huh? I didn't get a commercial with that link. I clicked on the picture and it goes right into the video. Maybe your computer needs an exorcist?

And......when did Marv <b>stop</b> wearing wimmen's clothes?:confused:

<i>I'm a lumberjack and I'm OK.....</i>

Bee-yoo-tiful.......

I break out laughing ever time I see that. Never fails.

Thanks, Slappy.

Since this is the world wide web, here's another version that might appeal to the non-English speakers..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZR7RH...elated&search=

Yup, he was....<b>rugged</b>.....:D

<i>Danke</i>

I agree. The first time I saw it and afterwards. Hamilton had his hands straight up in the air, which is what we like to see from a defender. Good, good no-call.

The potential flop and throw-off by Wallace later. At first glance, I'm with you RUT, it looked like the defender over-reacted to the push off, in an attempt to get the call, even though Wallace is a big boy, I can't see him pushing another big man, that far, that hard on a move to the bucket. Perhaps a more subtle flop would have gotten him the call.

With all that being said, the first game where Lebron didn't go to the line at all, not one time. That game was very poorly officiated and there was one time, Lebron got crushed and there was no call! Even on the replay it was a foul. Coach should have went ballistic then and picked up a T. By letting that slide, made it worse for his young superstar who is definitely not getting the respect from the officials in this series, imho.

So, you think the coach making an azz of himself would help his player get better calls in the game later? Is that how it works in the games you officiate?

It helped Bill Laimbeer win a championship last year. I saw it, felt he was right, he mention it to the media (ala Larry Brown) and he got his point across. Misson accomplished, end result, championship! You just got to know when to push those buttons, and also when to keep your mouth shut. Last night was good defense. Crying about good defense is bad for your team and serves only to piss the referee's off...

Bill Laimbeer coaches? In what league? Don't tell me we are going to start talking about the WNBA?! I'm going to go read something about soccer instead...or maybe one of those "sports" with skateboards, bikes, and shorts hanging down around your ankles. :D

I cannot believe that you even compared the WNBA to what takes place in the NBA.

Peace

I can.:D <i></i>

Referee's can make a mistake no matter what the level or organization. The WNBA might even be a better comparison because they try to use the same rulesets. Coaching is coaching, a foul is a foul, no matter WNBA or NBA. I saw the same thing last year in the WNBA with the calls only going one way. It appears to me from afar that the Pistons is getting all the calls in this series and from someone who could care less who wins the series. It's so obvious. It was the same way when I watched the WNBA. I could care less who wins but I look for consistentcy on both ends of the court. That just doesn't happen that often in the WNBA but in the NBA, it realy stands out when you don't make obvious calls. I'll tell you something else, when the calls are consistent at both ends, and the teams are fairly even like in this series, it makes for a much better game to watch, imo. You take the ref's out the picture, the players will decide, and you don't know who's going to win. Makes for an exciting game to watch. Then all of a sudden, you get an obvious foul that's not called, here we go again with this star status system, new kid don't get calls he should get. Time to find something else to watch.

I am doing this at my own peril, but he goes it.
 

Statements like this are the reason you have very little credibility on this site. JV is not the same as Varsity. Junior college is not the same as Division 3. And Men's basketball is certainly not the same as Women's basketball and that would not make the NBA and WNBA are not the same.

Once again you are not addressing the issue that I stated. This is not about consistency at all. The point is that a superstar did not "get a call." I thought the NBA always set it up so that the "superstars" would get the benefit of the doubt. When I listen to the pundits on the radio and on TV and then even that philosophy changes with the wind. Then I hear that Lebron has not earned it and if he was Magic, Bird or Jordan he would have gotten the call. The bottom line is all that is a bunch of crap. Since you mentioned the WNBA, many of the officials working that league are trying to get to the NBA. They are not likely to let their emotions get in the way of getting to the next level because a coach is an a-hole. That might be career suicide. Secondly anyone that officiates pro sports in this era is subject to more scrutiny and will be released if they screw up. Even one of the all-time best officials might not have a job now because he had a confrontation with a "superstar."

Why is everything based on a conspiracy? Why is this play with Lebron not just a block? I have not heard anyone say why it is a foul other than "it has to be a foul." Hamilton touched the ball on Lebron that was taking a very soft shot attempt to the basket. Was there contact? Of course there was, basketball is a contact sport. We do not just call fouls just based on contact, there has to be illegal contact involved. You have to have a better point of view then, "Well I think this took place because......." Two myths have been shattered this post season and the people that perpetuate them all the time come up with another theory to explain them. How about, the officials did not think it was a foul. And the officials called what they saw and there was no foul. I know I do not make decision based on all these dumb factors like who is at home, who has the star players or who is ranked higher. I am even hearing the pundants say, "Well in Jordan's 8th year he gets that call." It is clear to me that none of these people actually talk to officials that works in the NBA or that once worked in the NBA. If they actually had a conversation with officials, they might just learn we could give a damn. You really think someone is going to jeopardize their entire officiating career to give people who make millions the benefit of the doubt?

Peace

I am not here to win a popularity contest. Since you have no effect on what happens in my life, I really don’t care what you or the rest think. Just remember one thing, it’s not a one-way street. It’s more like a double edge sword, it’s cuts both ways. I going to speak for the moderators here. I’m sure they would rather you keep negative comments like this to yourself. It doesn’t help the forum, and it invites confrontation that makes them have to work harder. My credibility is not on trial here, but you and some of the others insist on making it a point of interest. One more thing, since you are so worried about what others think, how can you call a game fair?

Huh, english please????

Okay, the meat of your argument. Why didn’t you just come here right away instead of all the blah, blah, blah above and below this. If you recall what I originally stated, I agreed with you. However, a problem you are going to have to answer for yourself is. Why is this not a foul in Detroit but when the series returns to Cleveland it will be? LeBron will get these calls in Cleveland, you can believe that. This begs the question, do we have homer referee’s in the NBA? You say this is not about consistency. We’ll see when the series returns to Cleveland because if it’s a no-call in Detroit then it better be a no-call in Cleveland, otherwise the NBA officials are having some consistency issues.

For me, I’m just a fan looking for a good game. Don’t have a dog in either fight. I would love to see a good series without the attention switching to the officiating. Kind of like the Magic/Bird series, the Pistons/Lakers series or even the Portland (Bill Walton)/ 76ers series. I want the players to decide the game. I want bb to be the topic and not the officiating or conspiracy thinking. You fail to make obvious calls, then here we go. To me, if it’s a foul in the regular season, then it should be a foul in the playoff’s. It should not matter if it’s a superstar or the 10th player on the bench. Just call the freaking game.

Somebody needs to be suspended or fined for that push-off that Wallace got away with. Seeing that on replay and we should have had a whistle on that. Missing this is evidence that something is afoul in the association which I’m not going there. Maybe, the association needs to get Joey off the bench because we know he’s not afraid to call a foul on a superstar.

If your credibility was on trial, JMO, it woulda been hung months ago. This is just typical of your idiocy. Suspend an official for missing <b>one</b> call? Un-freaking- believable!

Silly monkey......:rolleyes:

[QUOTE=Old School]I am not here to win a popularity contest. Since you have no effect on what happens in my life, I really don’t care what you or the rest think. Just remember one thing, it’s not a one-way street. It’s more like a double edge sword, it’s cuts both ways. I going to speak for the moderators here. I’m sure they would rather you keep negative comments like this to yourself. It doesn’t help the forum, and it invites confrontation that makes them have to work harder. My credibility is not on trial here, but you and some of the others insist on making it a point of interest. One more thing, since you are so worried about what others think, how can you call a game fair?

You do not know basic stuff. I do not care what everyone thinks about you. You have no crediblity because everytime you make a post, it comes from a place where no one has heard anything you are saying before. It is like you make it up as you go along.

HELLOOOO!!!!!! MEN'S AND WOMEN'S BASKETBALL ARE NOT THE SAME DAMN THING. THE FACT THAT YOU COMPARED SHOWS HOW LITTLE YOU KNOW ABOUT OFFICIATING!!!1

My point of making this post was more rhetorical than anything. I personally do not care what others think about the play one way or the other. I just find it funny that superstars are accused of always getting the fouls and one of the biggest did not get a call in one of the biggest games of the year. I think the officials working the game thought there was no foul and that is why they called nothing. Who cares if this took place in Detroit (another common myth). The officials get paid by the NBA not by Detroit. The NBA is not amateur ball when the school or host school cuts the check. Even working some college conferences you will get a check from the conference office.

Once again just like a fan you have not once talked about this from the standpoint of an official. If it was a foul on Lebron, you have to do better than say, "he got hammered." If you go to camp and use that line, they will cross you off immediately. But you should know that right? Officials do not make calls because there is contact; they make calls based on if something illegal took place. And to do so is being a fan and in many people's eyes is considered unprofessional. You come here all the time telling us what the officials should have done but you have not proven that you can even work a HS game.

And this comment is the very reason you constantly get crap from others all over the place. Now the guy who cannot work more than an intramural game wants to tell the NBA (which is a level you will never work) how they discipline officials. Work a HS game before you get so big and bad about what the big timers should do or not do.

Peace

I notice this term gets thrown around quite often on this forum. When someone has a different opinion the first thing you want to say is you don’t know basics. I have referee for over 15 years and played the game twice as long as that. How many years does it take before you learn the basics? I remember a movie, don’t recall the name, but a senior African American, in his 70’s after being called a boy, had a great line. How old to I have to be before I am no longer a boy?
Then why do you keep mentioning it? It has nothing to do with your topic.
Thank you, that’s the whole point of engaging the forum and sharing. There’s no point in engaging the subject if you have nothing different to say. Challenging the topic often makes for good discussion provided people can put there personal differences aside long enough to debate the subject. I do not understand why so many of you take things so personal, shoot the messenger mentality.

No, you just showed the world how small your brain is and how little you know about the sport in general. I was comparing how one coach made a public statement about the officiating and was able to get calls in his favor, thus helping his team win a championship. Right now, the only thing LeBron needs is a coach that has respect around the league. The pieces are there, they can win with this team. However, you’re not going to win any championship if the referee’s don’t respect you enough to call a foul. Remember the mad respect Miami got from the ref’s last year. You don’t think Dwayne Wade got a call or two down the stretch to help his team win that series.

Another point that shows your ignorance. The officials do get paid by the NBA Office, but who do you think pays the NBA office? The teams you moron, and they pay quite handsomely.

You would be surprised……
Have a nice day.

NBA is a whole different animal. I rarely watch it because I pick up bad habits. IMO he was fouled but since time was ticking away, they passed on it.

First of all your credibility with me is out the window (I am not judging this based on what others may or may not think). I do not care what you say about most things when you cannot recite a simple and obvious rule. You only talk about how human the officials are (we already know this) and that they make mistakes.

Secondly Lebron got calls because he earned them. He went to the basket and was more aggressive and he got calls as any good, knowledgeable player does no a regular basis. Lebron was very tentative in Games 1 and 2 and the calls that were not made in his favor are no different than other calls not made over the course of those games. Also what happen in Game 2 has nothing to do with Game 1, 3 and 4. The officials are not the same and the style of play can change. If you have not watched the Western Conference Finals, each game has been very different.

My point once again is what happen to Lebron and this season has broken a lot of myths in very obvious fashion. Because the media has spent a lot of their time talking about how the NBA set things up for certain teams and they do not go along with that philosophy, the media gets mad about it. In other words when the media cannot prove something, they run with it and start drawing conclusions. The unfortunate thing is you claim to be an official and you do not have enough sense to realize that officials do not care what the media thinks. The media is the same people talking about how dumb the balk rule is in baseball and the rule is in place to advocate offense and not have pitchers trying to fool batters and runners. Basically when people do not understand something by learning the rules and the complexity of the game, they start throwing out conspiracies instead of picking up something and reading which might take some time. Sound familiar? ;)

I also did not create this to get into a full scale debate if this was a foul or not. The point was to illustrate that the officials passed on a foul that is widely thought of based on who is involved in the play. We can always disagree on what is a foul or not. I do not think it was a foul because the defender did nothing wrong and if this was my game at the HS or college level I would have likely passed as I do often during the season.

Peace

I keep trying to tell you my credibility is not on trial here.

What does this have to do with NBA stars not getting fouls? Me citing a rule or not has nothing to do with that. I am amazed at how hard you guys try to paint me into a corner on this forum. You don't want me to be a referee, do you? The fact of the matter is, I am and I'm not going to stop because you think I can't cite a rule. Most of us, don't like to be told what to do. Even more of us don't like to be told in an insulting manner. Case in point, I had a play happen in my primary and I wasn't quite sure what just happened. Coach sitting right next to me jumped up and demanded a foul call. I was putting things together in my mind of this play while the coach became more and more irate, I just had to stop and address him. Coach would you let me call the game. Now it's too late to call the foul and he's even madder. He continues to go on and guess what. Now we going to call a foul on you, TF!

I beg to differ but we will see tonight. Remember, a foul is a foul, no matter in Cleveland or Detriot. A player should not have to go to the hole more aggressive to get a foul. That might lead to a charge or out of control situation. But then, what do I know. I can't even recite a simple rule.

First of all your point. If it's the media, that's there job. They're not trying to find the truth, they're trying to find a story that everyone will want to tune in for. That sells tickets my man, that's where the biggest part of the money this great franchise pockets, comes from, the media. But then what do I know. I can't even recite a simple rule, but you would think, with all your intelligence, you would know that.

As far as the officials not caring. It's in there contract not to care or talk to the media. Making the kind of money the NBA officials make. I wouldn't say a damn thing to the media or care what they said either. A wise man once said, it's not what you say that counts, its what you do.

Have a nice day...

You do not have to try to tell me anything. Your credibility as well as other people's credibility is on the line when you post. Considering your knowledge of officiating when you have posted in the past, your opinion on this is rather laughable. You can try all you want to get me and others to not talk about it, but the fact you do not even know how to call a GT call properly makes me really wonder about your knowledge of the NBA and the things NBA Officials do.

Peace

1) You don't have any credibility.

2) Actually we all would prefer that you were a real, live honest-to-goodness referee instead of a troll. If you were a referee, you might get a rule right every now and then, or maybe even actually understand a little of what we're talking about.

Have you checked McGriffs lately, JMO? Maybe they'll start up again and you can resume pissing off officials over there too.

Coach had a right to be pissed at you. You see a play, can't decide what actually happened, decide to do nothing, and then want to "T" the coach. Great game management.

I can't guess either. If I'm not sure, I'm not calling it, coach can get piss off all he wants, it ain't gonna change. I did not want to T the coach but he crossed the line, now that I am sure of. I thought it was great game management too.

Would you prefer I guess to make the coach happy?

My guess is that's what you do every time you make or don't make a call: guessing.

Based on most of his threads I would like to second that. ;)

Peace

You misspelled "treads." ;)

I will make note of this in the future. :D

Peace

A wise man once said, it is better to miss a call and risk being wrong then to make a call and be wrong.

Oh, and I second that!

Who said that? Nobody, you just made it up.

Peace

A wise man said that, I told you, but you would not believe me if I told you it was me, so I just say the wise man. The wise man also said, be not too concern with who said it, but what is said.

Have a nice day

http://www.forumspile.com/Post-Stupid-Dont_listen.gif

I have heard many clinicians say something to the effect of "It's better to miss something that did happen than to call something that didn't happen."

I think there aer exceptions to that rule, however.

I have heard clinicians say not to guess on plays, but that is usually associated with not being in position. They are usually not talking about a regular, every day play. Based on the person that cannot get a GT call right (which are not very hard to call at all if you have worked a lot of college ball) I do not think he understands the concept very well.

Peace

When was he ever "star"? And the fanboy site is at www.uranidiot.com. :rolleyes:

Wallace needs to go. I am so sick of his act and his whining. Everything is someone else's fault with him. He lost his cool at a critical point in the game. He gave up on his team and himself. He is a lost cause and Dumars needs to dumb his azz.

Peace

That is a bunch of crap, and what color is the sky in your world? A regular everyday play huh? No you moron, it is any play, regular, unregular, everyday, tomorrow, next week, any time it happens play.

I will not argue what you think, we are all entitled to our opinions. My concern is that you don't pass judgment and convict someone for life for kicking one call, especially a call not seen that often. I doubt that there are many coaches making over 6 figures that would argue that the shot was still going up on the GT. It's a quirk and I'm not going to say you can't even get everyday calls right because you miss this one. You live and learn and you move on, or in my case, put the ball back in play.

I told you and everyone that this team could win. They got ballers and in a seven game series the youth start to seperate themselves from the pack. This won't be a cakewalk for the Spurs. I'm happy for Cleveland, Mike Brown and the LeBron. The NBA rules are catered to players like LeBron. So we will see what happens.

1) Kicking a call is the same as missing a call. That happens to all officials at some time in their career. However, <b>not</b> knowing a basic rule like goaltending sureashell is <b>not</b> the same as kicking a call. <b>Not</b> being able to make the correct call because you don't <b>know</b> the rules happens to the Old Schools of the world, not to <b>real</b> officials.

2) I get it. Other people live and learn. You don't. You just put the ball back into play. Gee, why doesn't that surprise me?:rolleyes:

Based on recent postings here, this is turning into a fanboy site.

You want to talk about a bunch of crap? First of all I have seen coaches that barely make 4 figures argue that their players should not be called for a GT based on this fact. I worked my first summer games last night and there were a bunch of times a goaltending call was very close.

Here is the other delusional part of your comments. No one said anything about this team or even cares. This is a competition, of course they can win. What the hell does that have to do with you not knowing basic rules and basic officiating philosophies? Nothing!!!

Peace

No, I don't want you to guess. I want you to read the rule book, read the case studies, SEE the play, and make the call. And, don't blame the coach because you are such a screwup.

Dblref, you are not following the advice of your own tagline.