This is a question which was asked among some of our board officials, with many different answers. I like to throw to every one here.
Team A is entitled the throw in from a jump ball situation, A-1 has the ball for the throw in he/she then holds the ball over the boundry line which then B-1 then grabs hold of the ball. Now both players have control and don't let go.
What would you call ??

We've gotten different responses from our members, curious what you guys would do.

[quote]Originally posted by barney on 01-23-2000 09:37 AM
This is a question which was asked among some of our board officials, with many different answers. I like to throw to every one here.
Team A is entitled the throw in from a jump ball situation, A-1 has the ball for the throw in he/she then holds the ball over the boundry line which then B-1 then grabs hold of the ball. Now both players have control and don't let go.
What would you call ??

The throw in has not ended for team A. Blow the whistle and "do over"!

You have a 'held ball'. That results in an alternating-possession throw-in. Since the original throw-in is an alternating-possession throw-in, Team A still has the arrow following the 'held ball'.

KDM

OK guys, let me add to this situation.
First you don't do a 'do-over' on a throw in.
The held ball is a possibility.
However here's some other possibilities.
You could say that A-1 is out-of-bounds, and give the ball to team B for the throw in, since the ball is in play and A-1 is out of bounds touching the ball?

Possibly a violation on A-1 for not getting the ball directly into play ?

Or as KDM stated you could call a jump ball, but can you call a jump ball when one of the players is standing out-of-bounds ??

In this situation the thing to do after everyone has thrown in their .02 is to go to the casebook.

Page 51, Rule 7, Throw-In Plane, 7.6.3A Play: "While attempting a throw-in, A1 hollds the ball through the plane of the end line. B1 (a) slaps the ball from A1's hand(s); or (b) simply grabs the ball and then throws it through B's basketball. RULING: In (a), no violation has occurred and play continues. In (b), score two points for Team B.

Therefore, using the above two examples, you can add in the third case, a held ball by A1 and B1, thereby creating an alternating possession situation.

You counter with, "but A1 is standing out of bounds when the held ball occurs." That is correct in all three cases, therefore in all three cases the ball must be alive.

Isn't it amazing what one can find in the materials we paid for at the beginning of the year http://www.ereferee.com/ubb/wink.gif

Player A-1 is out of bounds. If he holds ball inbounds and a held ball occurs, he is out of bounds and has caused to ball to be out of bounds. Team Bs ball for throw-in and possession arrow is turned towards team B because Team A has violated the alternating possession throw-in.

It cannot be anything else!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by b_silliman on 01-23-2000 03:43 PM
In this situation the thing to do after everyone has thrown in their .02 is to go to the casebook.


Isn't it amazing what one can find in the materials we paid for at the beginning of the year http://www.ereferee.com/ubb/wink.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

b_silliman,


Rather than referring to Case Book play 7.6.3A., on page 51, go to the bottom of the page to play "7.6.3F". An almost indentical play is described.

Maybe some of us have already gone to the 'books' before we give our 2 cents worth.

KDM

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bob Mull on 01-23-2000 04:46 PM

It cannot be anything else!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Bob,

Yes it can! Read case book play 7.6.3F at the bottom of page 51.

KDM

Hey guy's KDM is right, per the case book.

I knew this would bring different opinions, same as it did among our own board members.
Scenes as this one are good cause for fellow officials to spend more time with the book.

In case book (Held ball during throw-in--no arrow change!) 6.3.5B Page 43
When you are OOB and hold the ball over the boundry line and a inbounds player grabs it the OOB player caused the ball to OOB. I can't figure this one. The AP proceedure was not completed and the Arrow does not change!
More conversation needed on this one!


------------------
Don

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Geneva">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Alaska Ref on 01-24-2000 10:50 PM
In case book (Held ball during throw-in--no arrow change!) 6.3.5B Page 43
When you are OOB and hold the ball over the boundry line and a inbounds player grabs it the OOB player caused the ball to OOB. I can't figure this one. The AP proceedure was not completed and the Arrow does not change!
More conversation needed on this one!


<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don --

The ball was never inbounds, so it can't "be caused to got OOB" (yet). Otherwise, you'd have a violation on every throw-in.

The case is clear, and logical. The throw-in hasn't ended (it requires a *passed* ball to be touched by another player), the arrow doesn't change until the throw in ends, it's a held ball, use the arrow.