Bill Lambieer WNBA Playoffs
 

I can't believe the amount of crap that the referees are taking from Bill Lambieer during the playoffs.

He is a hugh distraction, constantly yelling at the referees about every call. The camera is on him as much as the game itself. Last night one of the referees finally called a long overdue T on him and then amazingly took it back saying that it was an inadvertent whistle. It was obvious that the referee had called a T right in front of him.

What's up with the WNBA referees. Looks to me like they have been given instructions that Lamibeer is off limits.

Hey...what do you expect...he was a big cry baby when he played to. He would give the big flying elbow and whine about it when the foul was called. Wouldn't expect anything less as a coach.

At least Walton isn't doing the commentary!

He got his a$$ kicked last night. 95-71.

I don't find it hard to believe Lambeer was complaining. I think he is an entertaining interview, but once the game starts, he was always a cry baby. Secondly, it looks like there were 3 people watching the WNBA? Is that an all time ratings high? Sorry, I couldn't resist.:D

Actually 5, if you count myself and JRut. (Oops, I wasn't supposed to tell anyone. :D )

I missed the T, because I wasn't watching the whole game. When did it happen? And wasn't he miked, so was there any explanation as to what actually happend?

Bill Laimbeer's behavior has always been a detriment to the sport of basketball. It's too bad as he is an intelligent, likeable person off the court. In Isiah Thomas last game in the Old Boston Garden, I saw him stick an elbow out on a screen of Sherman Douglas that almost took Sherman's eye out. His style of "physical" basketball was always just "flagrant" fouls. They intended to do injury. The kids during the Bad Boys Era went just crazy with pushing and shoving.

He is one of the WNBA's Big names. The behavior they let him display is an affront to all the parents bringing their kids to watch the games which are often great.

QUESTION: I saw this one last night and I admit I'm stumped to find the NFHS Rule to support my opinion. I thought it was a good call. Player A holding ball is airborne over end line. Player B slides on floor and arm extends OOB. Player B touches airborne Player A with other arm. The Ref called it OOB with Team A maintaining pocession. Is there an NFHS Rule that supports this case?

If I understand the scenario you are describing (and I'm not sure that I do), this would be nothing in NFHS. See case play 7.1.1 Situation A.

In your case, out-of-bounds player B1 makes contact with A1. This does not cause A1 to be out of bounds since a player is not an object.

Z

Bill Lambieer is a coach in the WNBA? I thought the season ended last week. ;)

Peace

There was a play the a player for Sacramento was driving to the basketball and was fouled by Detroit and he was actually Booing the referee for the call. when they showed the play from a different angle it was an obvious call and the referee made a good call. The camera went to Lambieer, he still was booing the ref's. that is Bull $-it. He must be hands off.

He?:confused: In an WNBA game? How did...um...Shorty pass the physical?

Oh, you meant Laimbeer?

Nevermind.......

Yes, That's who I meant, Do you need glasses? Please reread my post LOL

Not quite. Saw the sports ricker on the bottom of the screen on ESPNU.

jdccpa,

I saw exactly what you were talking about. The official is coming up the court directly infront of the bench and Lambier is having his whine fest. You see the official blow the whistle and bring the upper hand down and the lower hand up to complete the magical T. As the official advances takes his two steps over to the bench to report you can hear Bill shouting 'you are calling a T on me????' and then after a brief pause the announcers say inadvertant whistle. Instead of shutting the hades up, Bill continues with the 'you will check the video at halftime right'.. I did the little rewind and there is no 'inadvertant whistle', there was nothing to be inadvertant about. The official made a decision to blow his whistle and then realized that he probably didn't want to loose a paycheck, so he tucked his manhood up and went on with the game.

Laimbeer is a lousy leader. They must be putting a microphone on the coaches, because you can really hear them, or the arena is just so empty. I can't stand the way he talks to his players. The openly challenging their courage and desire is the fastest way to get them to loathe him. Their success is likely as much in spite of his motivation techniques as because of.

I agree it seems like they've been told not to whak him. He's out of control. On the other hand, I think we can all agree that the calibre of the crews seems to be below that of D1. Doesn't justify his abuse though.

I am not a huge fan of Women's basketball, but this comment is ludicrous. Most of the officials that work in the WNBA are currently D1 officials. Or they are on the track to actually work NBA games.

Also, let us not overact about Lambieer or any coach. The coach is miked up. It is not like every comment is heard by the officials or directed at the officials. And these are professionals. If you ever worked a college game, there are many college coaches that are tougher on their players than Lambieer ever will be. I have an officiating friend whose daughter plays at a Big Ten school. One of her best friends is Candice Parker (they played together in AAU and their families know each other really well). Some of the Pat Summit comments I have heard about are a lot worse than anything I have heard Lambieer say when I was watching SportsCenter.

Peace

I have a feeling if we miked up every D-1 and NBA coach during the upcomimg season we might be able to use about 25% of what they say on SportsCenter and the other 75% would have to be aired on HBO! Let's mike up Don Nelson for the season and I am willing to bet he is 10 times worst than Bill Lambieer!

Well, that pretty much removes you from the building right there then. DQ'd for not being a fan dude. :)

Good idea, lets start now, with me. :p

Who the coaches? The Refs? The players? And being professional implies what? What does the fact that they are getting paid have to do with whether or not there's been a lot of verrrrrry questionable calls. Hey, I watch the games, I'm a fan of the womens game. Don't tell me your not intertested, then try to defend their integrity. I don't care if they are D1, if you watch the games, it's one lousy call after another. How do I know that? I have the benefit of instant replay. I watch a huge amount of D1 basketball, and have always been impressed with the quality of the officiating. I might watch several D1 games in a row before I even see a call that looks funny, then the tape almost always backs up the Ref. Not so with the WNBA playoffs. You can watch a game and see several questionable calls per game.


Being tough on a player is not wrong, in and of its self, but you have to apply principles of quality leadership to your dealings with players, or they won't respect you. He doesn't get that. You can tell by the blatant looks of disgust and disrespect his players openly give him. Rule #1, you cannot effectively coach a player "hard" until that player KNOWS that you love him or her. It's clear from the body language/facial expressions that his players don't believe Laimbier has their backs. Rule #2, you can NEVER effectively coach a female player "hard" if she has a poor relationship with her Father. I didn't just make this sh*t up, it's tried and true psychology/leadership.


Yeah I'm aware of Summit's style, I've read both her books. Geno Auremma (U-Conn) is even worse. And these are good examples to help make my point- Summit's players know that Pat Summit loves them as though they were her own kids.

Don't hate me because I'm beautiful JRut :)

And therein lies your problem...you are trying to compare NCAA games and WNBA games...the officials have two VERY different sets of guidelines they are told to follow in those two very distinct games...you can't watch an NBA or WNBA game and expect it to be called the same as an NCAA game. In fact, watch a Lisa Mattingly, Sally Bell, Melissa Barlowe, etc. referee a WNBA game and then watch them ref an NCAA game - it's night and day...and that's the way the WNBA wants it. What you think in your mind is a "questionable call" is the way the WNBA has instructed plays to be called. Apples and tangerines, baby.

Sally Bell retired from the WNBA a couple of years ago, but point will taken.

I know - so did Barlowe after last season...but Sally was at a camp I attended this summer and is such a fantastic person that I had to throw her name in there!!

Considering that the WNBA is a professional league, I would assume that everyone involved would be considered a professional. :rolleyes:

Whether the calls are perfect or not has little to do with integrity. Once again unless you have strapped on the whistle and gone out there yourself not sure what you would understand about what is a good or bad call.

Wow, now you are a relationship expert. I am sure there are similar feelings with NBA players and their coach. I guess you have never heard of Larry Brown. ;)

Well Geno Auremma must have done something right, he has been kicking Summit's butt for several years now.

It sounds to me you are more concerned with relationships than what results are. Now I also feel that relationships are important, but people are not successful at these levels because of their personal relationships. I am sure these players also deal with father issues not much different than what happens in the NBA or NCAA levels. I believe results are what is important here, not whether someone likes their coach or not.

I am not sure what being a fan has to do with what my opinion is. After all, I have been officiating and when I have watched the WNBA, I am watching the officials not the game. That is not much different when I happened to watch an NBA game. If you feel it bolsters your point of view, then go for it.

Peace

I don't want to jump into the middle of this, but it should be noted that normally in organized HS & NCAA games the only people who *don't* get paid are the players.

OK, carry on.

http://www.garyaustinadvertising.com/images/popcorn.jpg

Are you <B>sure</B> about that?

Ok, carry on.

http://www.garyaustinadvertising.com/images/popcorn.jpg

Why, should I not be sure about that?

(And no more popcorn for you if you say the fans don't get paid... :rolleyes: )

Being paid under well under $100 for a single event and being paid enough money to support a household are two different things. A lot of non-varsity coaches are not paid much more than what they are paid for working at the particular school as a teacher, advisor or district employee.

Peace

Nah, I like popcorn too much - I was talking about the players. Maybe in HS we can reasonably assume they're not being paid, but can you be so sure at the NCAA level? In fact, without being too cynical you can say most are being paid the cost of tuition to play, so doesn't that make them, by strict definition, a professional?

Anyway, back to the topic - I like rocky's response on the differences in philosophy. For those of us that don't watch the WNBA on a regular basis, I don't think we can offer an objective opinion on whether a particular call was correct. Just as the NBA is called differently, with a different rule set, from NCAA, the WNBA is called differently from NCAA as well. Add together the facts that the officials are put to a high level of scrutiny from the league, and there are probably a large number of officals that would want to replace them if they could, these have to be the best officials out there.

I'm not saying they're paid a lot, just saying they are paid.

hmmm...good point.

So only the non-scholarship student athletes are not paid.

I guess that was a major point to make. ;)

Peace

It wasn't only the major point, it was the only point.

Anyway, I'm getting in the middle of the real sniping, I'll let you guys get back at it.

:)

See what happens when you stick your nose in - it might get bitten off.

I learned that a long time ago when sticking my nose into my wife's conversations with her parents... :rolleyes:

So.......

Shut up.

Yes dear. <font = font>

Just to let you know they had 14,213 people at the WNBA Finals game last night in one arena, not the whole country!

And about the same number of people watching it on tv in the whole country......:D

Hate to say it, but the WNBA basically is irrelevant anymore, as boxing and track and field are also. The general interest simply isn't there.

I guess it is all one perspective. If you take a look into how many young girls look at the WNBA just like young men look at the NBA. So to say that no one watches the WNBA it's your own opinion. I think it give young girls a goal to work for.

IMO and only IMO.

The WNBA is 10 years old, how many people were watching the NBA or going to their games in their first 10 years?

Good point. The Celtics rarely sold out Boston Garden when they were winning all those championships in the 50's and 60's. In fact, the Garden was usually half-empty.

As far as Bill Laimbeer's ref-baiting, it's part of the show. The NBA and the WNBA are entertainment first, sports second. This type of behavior is clearly encouraged by the league. Coaches get paid big bucks, officials get paid small bucks. Survival of the richest applies here.

Yes, let us compare a different time and a different situation. I hope the WNBA has more to hang on to than what the NBA was doing at that time.

Peace

Man, for someone who supposedly doesn't care about the WNBA or women's basketball in general, JRutledge sure seems to need to reply to any post/thread that has anything to do with said topics which he doesn't care about...kinda weird, huh?

Sorry, Woody...the Ignore button is going back on now...

NOW I feel better.
 

Why does someone that is so hell bent on everything I say is wrong, spend so much time commenting on everything this person says. (Things that make you go hmmmmmmmm)

PLEASE KEEP THE IGNORE BUTTON ON. YOU ARE A NOBODY TO ME ANYWAY!!!

Good luck with your season.

Peace

You noticed that? :D

I don't watch much WNBA.. maybe an occasional few minutes when I'm channel surfing (Sue Bird and Lauren Jackson are pretty darn good). But I do hope the WNBA sticks around. Some of my friends have daughters and they are so glad to see their daughters taking a big interest in the Seattle Storm. They much prefer that to their daughters being interested in Brittney Spears and the other hoochies. :eek:

Amen!

I have a daughter who has played basketball since she was in second grade, It's the WNBA which has given her hope thoughout her middle and High school years. With today's teenage pregnancy. I kiss the floor on that I officiate everyday becuase she didn't become a statistic. Basketball is what gave her hope....

Well the NBA has not helped the inner-cities very well. Not sure how the WNBA is going to make women any better.

The women in my life make more than most WNBA players do working a single season. I guess expectations for women are really, really low in this country.

Peace

REFVA, lets get sumthin' straight. It was never my intention to run down or belittle the WNBA. I'm just saying that it's simply a niche sport. It has it's following, but the general popularity of the WNBA simply isn't there. It's no different than Arena Football, the Major Lacrosse League, Major League Soccer..... or the Seattle Mariners. They all have their devoted followers, but none of them seem to have a general following, except locally maybe.

Thanks. makes sense
 

I appreciate you explaining this to me. I'm not on some kinda ego trip here, with a powerful need to be right. I just want to understand, that's all.

[QUOTE=Jurassic Referee] or the Seattle Mariners. QUOTE]

Hey now...be careful or we'll end up with that idiot in Illinois starting to post about the M's too - since he doesn't care about them either...

[QUOTE=rockyroad]I was just kidding. Any team with JJ Putz on it is fine with me, no matter what the sport.:D

Well at least the idiot from Illinois has seen a World Series winner in his state. What have the Mariners or (Seahawks) done? ;)

Now I see why you are so bitter. :D

Peace

[QUOTE=Jurassic Referee]
Seattle still has a pro baseball team?

I thought the last major league team to play there was the Pilots in 1970!

I am not saying you are belittle the WNBA, I just stated my situation. But remember these girls have a goal to work on. If there werent a WNBA what would these girls focus a goal on?

Just think if there weren't a WNBA, you wouldn't have as many as inner city players there playing right now. Lets call it the way it is. The WNBA has more players that came from the inner cities. Just my IMO..

JR, I don't believe that it's just devoted following, Carol Lawson is a local Virginian, do you know how many girls follow her here in Virginia, Not just the local Sacramento followers. It's growing, I believe that if you ran the WNBA in conjunction with the NBA, the NBA would loose followers, especially the female side and as well get some fathers followers who will share the fun with their daughters. The same follows for Diana Taurasi, Sue Bird and many other WNBA players.

Track and Field, Volleyball, Soccer, Softball, Golf, education, college, grades, family activities or whatever someone can do outside of basketball.

The problems in the inner-city are not young women. I really do not think a $30,000 job that may or may not last past a couple of years as a vital part of the maturation of women. I would also hope that people in the inner-city have other things to focus on then just being good athletes. For young boys sports is only going to last so long. Not every playground legend is an NBA player or even a college player with boys. There are fewer WNBA teams then there are NBA teams combined with the NDBL or the many other Pro-Leagues we never talk about here.

I guess what I always find funny is why is it an issue if we like or dislike about the WNBA have to turn a social issues and not just the fact the league is good or stinks? I could say the same things about the WNBA that I say about the NHL, MLS, XFL or the Pro Bowlers Tour. The Women's Pro Bowlers Tour folded because there was little interest. If it was not for the NBA and their commitment to keeping the league, it would fold too. Hell, NCAA Women's Basketball loses money every year and at least that is somewhat exciting.

Peace

They tried this already and the league folded.

Peace

Bottom-line is that WNBA gives the teen female population a professional team sport with which they can identify. It's ludicrous to compare the WNBA to MLB, NFL, NCAA-M b-ball, or NCAA football. It'll never reach those levels, NEVER. But I don't think that is the charter of the WNBA. Professional sports are a business. And sports revenue by and large comes from the pockets of men, whether you're talking about teens buying jerseys and caps and sneakers, or middle-to-upper class men buying season tickets and satellite/cable packages. Take 50 male CEO's and 50 female CEO's. What percentage from each group is going to spend their personal money on a luxury box for the local NFL team or court side season tickets along celebrity row? Women don't spend their $$$ the same way men do, that's just a fact in America.

Basketball is the only professional team sport available to women. There will never be true or legitimate professional football, hockey, or baseball for women. There is no interest in women's soccer past the World Cup and Olympics. Most of the other sports women excel in are individual sports. And when do those sports get good ratings? When someone sexy is competing for a title, that's when.

So the fact that 14,000 showed up for a WNBA game or a network of any type is willing to broadcast it is really an accomplish in and of itself considering the state of womens' sports in America. And I'm willing to wager that a few of those aforementioned CEO's will buy WNBA tickets if they have a teenage daughter in the household.

And the WNBA is significant enough that top-level officials from both the women's and men's side of the game officiate in it. So that at least gives it some legitimacy in my eyes.

I personally don't watch the WNBA b/c it doesn't interest me, just like MLB and NHL don't. I had interest when it began b/c I used to play pick-up ball with one of the original L.A. Sparks. But once she moved to the front office my interest waned completely and I stopped watching. The only thing that would get me back to watching would be if one of the local HS products were to make it into the league.

BadNewsRef,

Well said.

Peace

Um, they <b>do</b> run the WNBA in conjunction with the NBA. If they didn't, there wouldn't be a WNBA. The NBA is subsidizing the WNBA to the tune of $12 million a year. And the WNBA sureasheck ain't growing either. League attendance from 1997 is down and tv ratings are generally terrible. As a vice-president of ESPN said in this recent article, it's simply a niche sport.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...071100988.html

Facts, REFVA, not wishes......

I agree as well BadNewsRef. But those young ladies at least have some goal to work on even though as they get older it may deminish..That goes for any sports that is appropriate for ladies..

Jurassic Referee, I guess we all have our opinion and that's what makes this world tick everyday,. Have a good one.

Unfortunately, opinions aren't necessarily facts. And, again, I say that without trying to diss the WNBA.

You have a good one too.

Well said. I taught at an inner city elementary for a few years. I was amazed when parents of 5th graders with a 1st grade reading level explained to me at conferences that their grand plan for their kid was to play professional athletics. I really wish more people understood how rare an athlete of that caliber is. As they say, student comes before athlete in student athlete.

A once in a lifetime event. Savor the moment. Hailley's Comet will be back before the next one.

It is better to know that Haley's Comet is coming back then to have no idea what a Comet is. ;)

They are in the playoff hunt. How long has Seattle been out of that hunt?

(14 games out as this is posted)

Peace

1. I don't know.
2. I don't care.

I do know that the Mariners are about 14 games out of first. I do not care about the Mariners, no one seems to. :p

Peace

[QUOTE=PWL]
Thanks PWL, I live in the Milw Area and the Brewers are playing like the 1969 Seattle Pilots....bad!

rockyroad, I'm not sure that you are correct on this one. It may be that when we say "man, the officiating sure is bad in WNBA, nowhere near as good as NCAA D-1" that you can be right. EVEN if they are the same officials on the floor. If the assigners are saying "call the game this way" and you disagree with how the assigner's want the game called - then you'll think the officiating sucked. Perhaps the blame for the "poor officiating" in the WNBA lies at the assigners who asked for the officials to umpire like that, not with the officials on the floor who are doing exactly what was asked.

(I haven't seen any of the WNBA playoffs, so I'm not commenting on the officiating as good or bad, I'm just replying to others who say that it is bad)