My first one ever! Which is sort of like bragging that I finally learned to walk -- it's fun at first, but I'm sure to you-all it's old hat. It was easy and automatic and I didn't even realize what an historic moment it was until later. The coach complained, of course, but it was JV, and I went over and told him, "Coach for a kid at this level to actually pull it off is a credit!" He got that "Oh, yea...." look and shut up about it. I felt like it made my week!!

Same game, we called SIX PC fouls, five on the same team, and the game right before, we called five, and they were all good calls. And we passed on several borderline flops. It was VERY AGGRESSIVE basketball!!

Mark, Howard showed up unexpectedly, too. Wow did it surprise me!!! But afterwards, he said, "that was a tough game and you managed it very well." I've been told that a compliment from Howard is high praise indeed, so I'm floating today!! The only criticisms he had were "minor" mechanics things which of course I chalk up to "summer-arm-osis". He told me I have improved a lot since February when he evaluated me rather harshly, and that he had heard several reports on me that were very good. I'm definitely feelin' good!!! (perhaps this explains all the exclamation points in this post...)

I'll bite
 

What's B1?

Re: I'll bite
 

I honestly don't know! I know that B<b>I</b> is basket interference, and usually B<b>1</b> is used to designate a player from team B, so I'd take a wild venture that in this post you might be thinking it was a B<b>I</b> call on B<b>1</b> :D

[Edited by Danvrapp on Jun 13th, 2001 at 12:02 PM]

I remember my first BI. Varsity boys pre-season tournament. I got a real good look, was confident and sold the call. Of course Coach B and some fans disagree. Coach B and I have a very good relationship. After the game, he still disputes the call...a week later he still disputes the call and says he looked at it on tape again just the other night. I asked if we could watch the tape together? Suddenly the tape had mysteriously disappeared!!!

I guess the moral of the story is to trust your judgement and don't let coaches get in your head too much...they're just looking for a call somewhere down the road.

Ohhhh
 

Ahah, in Australia we refer to it as goaltending.

So what is the big deal with calling BI? I take it that it is fairly rare?

Re: Ohhhh
 

Well it is rare until you get to higher level, and then it still doesn't happen very often, unless you're in a very talented area.

snce it is just one of those plays you don't see very often, when you stick it, it feels real good.

Re: Ohhhh
 

Oz Ref,
I have called it once, so far.
mick

Re: Ohhhh
 

So what do you call goaltending? Here, basket interference and goaltending are different calls, with (relatively) the same consequence(s), but with very distinctive and unique requirements for each, so as to be distinguishable.

Reminds me of the game we did together a few weeks ago and we called 3 or 4 PC fouls on the same post player. Remember how his coach couldn't believe it?

Too bad you didn't get his remarks on tape. This happens about as often as Rasheed Wallace calls a ref "Sir".

Re: Ohhhh
 

While in a weak moment a few years ago, I was watching basketball at the Olympics where they use FEEBLE, er sorry, FIBA rules. I remember one of the announcers mentioning that, under those rules, there was no such thing as offensive basket interference. That is, if a shot bounced up off the rim above the basket, an offensive player could touch it to put it in even if the ball was still in the cylinder.

OZ, is this still the case? I'm not criticizing, just curious.

I don't think I have called BI but I have called goaltending several times. The signal is the same it is just the rule book has it listed differently.

Re: Re: Ohhhh
 

In FIBA once the ball has come off the rim following the shot attempt, the offense can stuff it in or the defense can swat it away! (Man would I like to be a 7 footer!)

Suprisingly, the players don't seem to take advantage of the rule difference though.

Re: Ohhhh
 

No, goaltending and basket interference are two differnet violations. GT is not BI and BI is not GT. FIBA allows players to touch the ball while it's on the cylinder. That's why you don't have it. It's a violation here.

Re: Re: Re: Ohhhh
 

That would still require coaches and players to read the rule book :D

OH MY GOD!
 

<B>HOLD THE PHONE - YOU WERE WATCHING FEEBLE BASKETBALL!</B> :)

The rule has actually recently been changed. Yes, both the offense and the defense can touch the ball once it has come off the ring, even if it is above the ring. However, a offensive basket interference has been added, but in FIBA's case, this applies to grabbing the ring or net, or banging the backboard in an attempt to make it sway, so as to increase the chances of the ball going in. It is reasonably rare, but I have called it once so far this year.

Just to clarify, I take it then that alley-oops and tip in dunks are basically illegal due to BI?

Feebely yours,

Re: OH MY GOD!
 

Alley oops are BI when the ooper catches the ball in the
cylinder (space above the rim). By tip in dunks you mean
the ball is resting or rolling on the rim when the tipper
dunks it? If yes, this is BI (although I'll admit that not
every one would to take back a monster dunk because of BI).
For old-fashioned, run of the mill dunks, there's an
exception in the BI rule that allows the dunker to carry the
ball into the cylinder, whether he makes the dunk or not.

tips
 

Oz Ref,
If they are on the rim, or in the cylinder, tip dunks are illegal by definition, but not necessarily by actual practice.
Most of the alley-oops are passes that are received <u>outside</u> the cylinder, and they are, therefore, mostly legal. ;)
mick

Thank you both for clarifying the rule. I appreciate it.

Re: Ohhhh
 

As Brian points out it's unheard of until the higher levels. I have been doing a LOT of 6th grade girls who don't get much play above the rim! But in anticipation of the play (not the call) I had been studying up on Goaltending and Basket Interference, JUST IN CASE. And it felt great to be right. This kid actually reached up through the basket and tipped the ball out of the cylinder, although I'm not sure that was his intention. But it was a great call, and it felt so good to explain it loudly to everyone, and then sell it, and to KNOW I was right!! You may guess that doesn't happen every day to me...

Re: Re: Ohhhh
 

You be the man! Uhm, the woman, uhm the person, well, uhm, well you know. Great job!

Re: Re: Re: Ohhhh
 

How 'bout "You go girl!" :D

One more question...
 

So if a player takes a shot, the ball is above the level of the ring, on its downward flight is it goaltending or BI?

I would assume that it is goaltending, as the basket per se has not been interfered with.

Also, is there any difference in the call? I.e. are the signals the same?

Cheers

Re: One more question...
 

If the ball has not touched the rim, it would be goaltending.

Rain - Pay attention at those lower levels, I actually had one in an 8th grade boys game last year. Took me by surprise because I never expected it to happen.

Re: One more question...
 

It is BI if the player reaches through the basket and
touches the ball before it enters the cylinder (I think
this is what Juulie had). It is BI if the player touches
the ball in the cylinder. It is BI if the player touches
any part of the basket (net included) while the ball is on
the rim or going through the basket. It is GT if the ball
is touched on its downward path, and has a chance of going in and is a tip or try (BI does not have this last
requirement). No signal for BI or GT other than "count it"
(2 or 3) or "no basket".

You can view the NCAA rules here. Look for 4.4 and 4.31.
I am certain the NFHS rules are identical.


http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/20...rules_book.pdf

http://www.ncaa.org/library/rules/ill_basketball/2001/

Re: Re: One more question...
 

Look at her post again. Hand thru the bottom of the rim
touching the ball is BI in or out of the cylinder.
She did good!

Re: Re: Re: One more question...
 

I took his question as a player touches the ball on its downward path while it is above the rim. This would be goaltending, until it hits the rim. I don't think he was talking about reaching through the bottom of the ring.

Re: Re: Re: Re: One more question...
 

Oops, maybe we got some crossed wires here. I thought you
said that Juulie's call should have been GT, not BI.