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-   -   Please educate a parent (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/24501-please-educate-parent.html)

bellnier Wed Jan 25, 2006 02:19pm

My daughter has played varsity ball for some years and I'm trying to figure out the small differences in refereeing trends from year-to-year. For example, up until this year we rarely saw calls for lane violations by free throw shooters...this year we see 2-3 each game. Last year we got lots of 3-second violation calls, this year not so many. Is there really a pattern, or am I imagining this? Do you guys get reminders on what to emphasize or look for at the start of each season?

MichiganOfficial Wed Jan 25, 2006 02:23pm

It could be a "point of emphasis" to the officials in your area for that year.

ChrisSportsFan Wed Jan 25, 2006 02:31pm

Every year we are give points of emphasis and expected to clear them up. I do not recall any emphasis on 3-seconds or free throw lane violations.

It could be that last year you had a kid who camped in the lane and got called for it 2-3 times per game and she could not find it in herself to get out until she realized that tonights officials were going to enforce it. Maybe this year you've got girls who played AAU ball all summer (they use women's NCAA rules and are allowed to enter the lane at the shot release) and they are struggling to adjust. I saw some of the girls games dealing with this at the beginning of the season as they were still adjusting.

It may not be the officials but rather a particular player who needs to get with the program. This late in the season, if you're still getting those calls against you, I would guess coach needs to address those kids.

At the varsity level, it's usually a pretty serious offense in order for an official to make those calls. IE: refs will try to chase kids out of the lane before calling 3 seconds.

SamIAm Wed Jan 25, 2006 02:38pm

Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
My daughter has played varsity ball for some years and I'm trying to figure out the small differences in refereeing trends from year-to-year. For example, up until this year we rarely saw calls for lane violations by free throw shooters...this year we see 2-3 each game. Last year we got lots of 3-second violation calls, this year not so many. Is there really a pattern, or am I imagining this? Do you guys get reminders on what to emphasize or look for at the start of each season?
As kids age they learn more about the game, increase their coordination, and generally become more competitive.

Sounds like you daughter and her teammates may have become more aware of the lane limitations and how long they are there. As they learn to play the game better, they start to infringe on violations that previosly did not came into play, or they were not creating an advantage by violating rules earlier, but now are.

Or

It could be a POE (point of emphasis).


bellnier Wed Jan 25, 2006 02:39pm

Many thanks!
 
Didn't know about POEs for basketball. It's strange, but there seems to be a real surge in FT lane violation calls this year...do all HS refs get the same POEs, or can it vary from state-to-state or section-to-section (we're in NY Section VI). Thanks again, you guys are great.

BktBallRef Wed Jan 25, 2006 03:03pm

The NFHS issues POEs each year, nationwide. Also, states and locals may have their own. Finally, some crews may be stricter on lane violations than on something else.

Forksref Wed Jan 25, 2006 03:06pm

POE or no POE, the big thing is to have the players adjust to what is being called. If you have more than one lane violation in the same game, they haven't adjusted (with help of coaches, of course).

johnny1784 Wed Jan 25, 2006 03:07pm

Re: Many thanks!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Didn't know about POEs for basketball. It's strange, but there seems to be a real surge in FT lane violation calls this year...do all HS refs get the same POEs, or can it vary from state-to-state or section-to-section (we're in NY Section VI). Thanks again, you <font color = red><b>guys</font></b> are great.
We do have gals working as basketball officials.

Maybe you feel every one looks like a man.



Back In The Saddle Wed Jan 25, 2006 04:49pm

We talked about lane violations just this week in our meeting. The state is concerned with some of the video they've gotten showing violations not being called. So I called one yesterday.

BktBallRef Wed Jan 25, 2006 05:27pm

Good grief, get over it.
 
Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Didn't know about POEs for basketball. It's strange, but there seems to be a real surge in FT lane violation calls this year...do all HS refs get the same POEs, or can it vary from state-to-state or section-to-section (we're in NY Section VI). Thanks again, you <font color = red><b>guys</font></b> are great.
We do have gals working as basketball officials.

Maybe you feel every one looks like a man.

First, you post a vulgar name about the female anatomy that has to be deleted by a mod, now you're defending all of womankind?

Did any "gals" replay to this post? Have you considered that's what he was saying?

Moron.

canuckrefguy Wed Jan 25, 2006 07:34pm

Re: Re: Many thanks!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Didn't know about POEs for basketball. It's strange, but there seems to be a real surge in FT lane violation calls this year...do all HS refs get the same POEs, or can it vary from state-to-state or section-to-section (we're in NY Section VI). Thanks again, you <font color = red><b>guys</font></b> are great.
We do have gals working as basketball officials.

Maybe you feel every one looks like a man.



:rolleyes:


Lotto Wed Jan 25, 2006 08:24pm

Re: Many thanks!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Didn't know about POEs for basketball. It's strange, but there seems to be a real surge in FT lane violation calls this year...do all HS refs get the same POEs, or can it vary from state-to-state or section-to-section (we're in NY Section VI). Thanks again, you guys are great.
Girl's basketball in New York uses NCAA rules with a couple of modifications. We also use the NCAA points of emphasis. The two points of emphasis this year are displacement and bench decorum.

You can download the NCAA rulebook from the NCAA web site and read the details there.

rainmaker Thu Jan 26, 2006 01:41am

Re: Re: Many thanks!
 
Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Maybe you feel every one looks like a man.

With friends like this... :rolleyes:

bellnier Thu Jan 26, 2006 09:38am

Thanks everyone. This board is a great resource for folks (refs and nonrefs, alike) to git a little learnin'.

I shouldn't even respond, but I really didn't expect to be flamed by some jacka## for referring to all of you on this board as "guys"? It was meant as a gender-neutral term...sheesh.

ChuckElias Thu Jan 26, 2006 11:26am

Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
I really didn't expect to be flamed by some jacka## for referring to all of you on this board as "guys"? It was meant as a gender-neutral term...sheesh.
And everybody, with one exception, knew that, bellnier. So please don't let that discourage you from coming back and gittin' that next question answered. :)

johnny1784 Fri Jan 27, 2006 12:34am

Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Thanks everyone. This board is a great resource for folks (refs and nonrefs, alike) to git a little learnin'.

I shouldn't even respond, but I really didn't expect to be flamed by some jacka## for referring to all of you on this board as "guys"? It was meant as a gender-neutral term...sheesh.

Do you always try to blame someone by using derogatory words when you’re the reflection of your own grammar?





bellnier Fri Jan 27, 2006 08:33am

Grow up. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "guy" as follows: guy (noun): "used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex <saw her and the rest of the guys>"

SmokeEater Fri Jan 27, 2006 08:35am

Its not worth the effort bellnier! We all knew what your reference was.

johnny1784 Fri Jan 27, 2006 04:17pm

Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Grow up. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "guy" as follows: guy (noun): "used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex <saw her and the rest of the guys>"
IMO, continue to use appropriate words in your post.

But not all money is good money, and not all word definitions are proper ones.

Although myself and others knew the meaning of your post, your reference of the word guy's (guy; noun a: MAN, FELLOW b: PERSON) was posted with reference to the group being all male.

The dialect use of "you guy’s" a plural pronoun, is generally regarded as colloquial and non-standard usage when referring to a group of males and females.

However, you should use proper professional diction when referring to a group consisting of both sexes (people) or by addressing such a group of skilled basketball officials using; ladies/gentlemen, guys/gals, men/women, males/females.

It goes beyond using good grammar, proper spelling and appropriate diction in all your communications; you should also write to the point of being professional.

You posted as if there wasn’t a single female official in your thoughts as we all know it is a male dominant field.



rainmaker Fri Jan 27, 2006 05:42pm

Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Grow up. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "guy" as follows: guy (noun): "used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex <saw her and the rest of the guys>"
IMO, continue to use appropriate words in your post.

But not all money is good money, and not all word definitions are proper ones.

Although myself and others knew the meaning of your post, your reference of the word guy's (guy; noun a: MAN, FELLOW b: PERSON) was posted with reference to the group being all male.

The dialect use of "you guy’s" a plural pronoun, is generally regarded as colloquial and non-standard usage when referring to a group of males and females.

However, you should use proper professional diction when referring to a group consisting of both sexes (people) or by addressing such a group of skilled basketball officials using; ladies/gentlemen, guys/gals, men/women, males/females.

It goes beyond using good grammar, proper spelling and appropriate diction in all your communications; you should also write to the point of being professional.

You posted as if there wasn’t a single female official in your thoughts as we all know it is a male dominant field.



As I said before, Johnny, "us gals" don't need your defense. Your inappropriate language in other posts gives your opinions a complete lack of credibility. Please don't bother being "gallant". We are all big girls on this board, and we can take care of ourselves.

ChuckElias Fri Jan 27, 2006 11:56pm

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
We are all big girls on this board, and we can take care of ourselves.
We are? I guess I changed in the wrong locker room tonight. :)

rainmaker Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:18am

Quote:

Originally posted by ChuckElias
Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
We are all big girls on this board, and we can take care of ourselves.
We are? I guess I changed in the wrong locker room tonight. :)

Chuck -- this post isn't helpful or on-topic. It's just extraneous humor. Try to exercise a little self-control. Please.

canuckrefguy Sat Jan 28, 2006 02:20am

Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Grow up. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "guy" as follows: guy (noun): "used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex <saw her and the rest of the guys>"
IMO, continue to use appropriate words in your post.

But not all money is good money, and not all word definitions are proper ones.

Although myself and others knew the meaning of your post, your reference of the word guy's (guy; noun a: MAN, FELLOW b: PERSON) was posted with reference to the group being all male.

The dialect use of "you guy’s" a plural pronoun, is generally regarded as colloquial and non-standard usage when referring to a group of males and females.

However, you should use proper professional diction when referring to a group consisting of both sexes (people) or by addressing such a group of skilled basketball officials using; ladies/gentlemen, guys/gals, men/women, males/females.

It goes beyond using good grammar, proper spelling and appropriate diction in all your communications; you should also write to the point of being professional.

You posted as if there wasn’t a single female official in your thoughts as we all know it is a male dominant field.



:rolleyes:


Back In The Saddle Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:46pm

Whoa. Time to back off, Johnny. Take a deep breath, count to 10, hit the back button and read a different thread.

johnny1784 Tue Jan 31, 2006 05:11pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Back In The Saddle
Whoa. Time to back off, Johnny. Take a deep breath, count to 10, hit the back button and read a different thread.
Are you kidding or was the above a true reflection of your ignorant feelings threatening me with words?

I do not know you nor would I want to and yes, you seem like a person with a low IQ.

You may want to try your own suggestion of taking a deep breath but continue counting indefinitely.

Have a nice day.



johnny1784 Tue Jan 31, 2006 05:16pm

Quote:

Originally posted by rainmaker
Quote:

Originally posted by johnny1784
Quote:

Originally posted by bellnier
Grow up. Merriam-Webster dictionary defines "guy" as follows: guy (noun): "used in plural to refer to the members of a group regardless of sex <saw her and the rest of the guys>"
IMO, continue to use appropriate words in your post.

But not all money is good money, and not all word definitions are proper ones.

Although myself and others knew the meaning of your post, your reference of the word guy's (guy; noun a: MAN, FELLOW b: PERSON) was posted with reference to the group being all male.

The dialect use of "you guy’s" a plural pronoun, is generally regarded as colloquial and non-standard usage when referring to a group of males and females.

However, you should use proper professional diction when referring to a group consisting of both sexes (people) or by addressing such a group of skilled basketball officials using; ladies/gentlemen, guys/gals, men/women, males/females.

It goes beyond using good grammar, proper spelling and appropriate diction in all your communications; you should also write to the point of being professional.

You posted as if there wasn’t a single female official in your thoughts as we all know it is a male dominant field.



As I said before, Johnny, "us gals" don't need your defense. Your inappropriate language in other posts gives your opinions a complete lack of credibility. Please don't bother being "gallant". We are all big girls on this board, and we can take care of ourselves.

And like I previously posted before it was unfairly and discriminately removed in favor of your gender...

<font size 10>STFU</font size>





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