Whack early, whack often

[rainmaker]

Fall ball today. Girls Varsity. These two teams played each other three different times today. I have no clue why. I did all three games.

Both very good teams, each team had a couple of players who had been 1st or 2nd in their respective states. Each team had one player who has signed with a D1 college. All three games were close, white won the first two.

Third game, was back and forth. Near the end, white's whining about not getting calls, little things. Near the end of the game white was ahead by four. Black #1 goes up to shoot, gets fouled good and solid. As we're lining everybody up, and trying to deal with the different things that were happening, White #31 was ragging on and on, and then started complaining to the parents who were watching. So I whacked her. Black hit both the personal foul shots, and both the T shots. Black got the ball, but couldn't score, game ended in a tie.

In this league the rule is 3 minutes stop time for overtime. We get about 20 seconds in, white #34 is trying to get in front of black #1 who had the ball. Black stops suddenly just to the side of the key, scoops up the ball, and gets plowed from behind by white. I call the foul and say two shots. "But she wasn't shooting!!!" Well, no it's pretty hard to shoot with a full-size opponent on your back (#34 is a D1 prospect). "But she wasn't shooting!!" #34 kept yelling it again and again. So I whacked her. Black hit all four shots again.

Last 30 seconds, white still behind, and getting desperate. White #42 does the foul-to-stop-the-clock thing by bumping black #12, grabbing her arm and then pulling on her jersey. I called intentional.

Black won.

I'm having a hard time feeling the least bit concerned. They were all good calls. They were all obviously over the line, and easy to make. I didn't do it to vent, or to get back at anyone, or because I lost my temper. I was just calling the game that was in front of me.

I didn't have a hard time talking to the coach about it after the game. He was unhappy, but I knew I was right. He said, "Refs are supposed to avoid giving T's." I said, "Yes, coach, you're right, but there are times when it's unavoidable." He said, "You decided the game with that T." I said, "No, coach, your #31 decided the game with that T." He said, "You called two T's and an intentional foul on us. What am I supposed to say to my girls?" I said, "Tell them to play as well as they did in their first two games today, and to quit fouling!"

I feel like I've turned a corner. I haven't always been able to handle these kinds of things, but today, it felt natural, comfortable and smooth. I like working hard, and getting better! Gives me hope that i might actually be good someday!!

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Juulie:

Sounds like a typical day at the office. I would like to say that with regard to the coach's comments concerning the technical fouls: Just reminder the coach that his player committed technical fouls and that all you did was to stop the game and prescribe the appropriate penalties.

MTD, Sr.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by rainmaker
He said, "Refs are supposed to avoid giving T's." I said, "Yes, coach, you're right,..."

This is the only part of your post with which I disagree. Why would you agree with a coach that referees are supposed to AVOID calling something? Technical fouls are part of the game. They are called whenever necessary, just the same as traveling or FT violations. Or does this coach think that referees supposed to avoid making those calls too?

I just take exception to the idea that referees are supposed to make certain calls and not others.

We are simply supposed to call what is correct.

PS I take it that the girl who was fouled in OT was awarded two FTs because the double bonus was in effect.

[Junker]

I thought coaches were supposed to teach players to show sportsmanship and avoid T's.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Nevadaref

PS I take it that the girl who was fouled in OT was awarded two FTs because the double bonus was in effect.

She was awarded 2 shots because she had begun her shooting motion when she was fouled. She had not yet raised her arms, and had not yet extended her body upward, but she had started her customary motion. She had both hands on the ball and was crouching for the "spring" up. I was surprised that anyone objected to the call. It seemed obvious to me.

[rockyroad]

When you say each team was first or second "in their respective states", that makes me wonder if maybe one of the teams was Prairie?? Possibly the white team? Hmmm....

Sounds like you handled everything fine - even with Nevada's objection...and I would congratulate you on "turning" that corner - I know dealing with irate coaches is something you've been working on! Nice job!!

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by rockyroad
When you say each team was first or second "in their respective states", that makes me wonder if maybe one of the teams was Prairie?? Possibly the white team? Hmmm....

Sounds like you handled everything fine - even with Nevada's objection...and I would congratulate you on "turning" that corner - I know dealing with irate coaches is something you've been working on! Nice job!!

You nailed it in one.

And nailed it in one.

Thanks for the kind words.

PS I didn't say each "team" was first or second in their respective states. I said each team had players that were ...
Yea, one of the teams was Prairie. The other was Franklin!! In the PIL, you know? They have a girl that transferred from Central Catholic, and also a player from Jefferson. They're gonna do something this year. Keep an eye out.

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by rainmaker

You nailed it in one.

And nailed it in one.

Thanks for the kind words.

PS I didn't say each "team" was first or second in their respective states. I said each team had players that were ...
Yea, one of the teams was Prairie. The other was Franklin!! In the PIL, you know? They have a girl that transferred from Central Catholic, and also a player from Jefferson. They're gonna do something this year. Keep an eye out.

Pretty easy to figure out it was Prairie...whining and coach making stupid comments like that - sounds way too familiar...

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by rockyroad

Pretty easy to figure out it was Prairie...whining and coach making stupid comments like that - sounds way too familiar...

This was actually a dad who was coaching. Real coaches aren't allowed this time of year. This is the dad of a daughter who plays at Concordia, another daughter who is a D1 prospect, and a MS son who's on some travelling team or other. I expect you've encountered him before.

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by rainmaker

This was actually a dad who was coaching. Real coaches aren't allowed this time of year. This is the dad of a daughter who plays at Concordia, another daughter who is a D1 prospect, and a MS son who's on some travelling team or other. I expect you've encountered him before.

Had the son in my homeroom classes last year...dad is actually a nice guy, but really doesn't have a clue about the rules. etc...I would imagine that he didn't do a lot of yelling, just said other stupid things also...

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by rockyroad

Had the son in my homeroom classes last year...dad is actually a nice guy, but really doesn't have a clue about the rules. etc...I would imagine that he didn't do a lot of yelling, just said other stupid things also...

Yup, nailed it in one again! You're on a roll! Care to prophesy the outcome of the world series?

[Snake~eyes]

Where are your partners in this game? Just curious, one of them could have had the second T on the other player and you wouldn't seem like such the bad "gal"

[rainmaker]

Partner was a good ref, but "just helping out." I've been doing this league for several weeks, and I knew the sitch better. He was sort of standing back and nodding in the distance. He did step in and cool the coach down after both T's. He also was very supportive to me personally afterward.

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Third game, was back and forth. Near the end, ... Near the end of the game ...

... time for overtime. ...

Last 30 seconds,...

OK, so I get the whack often part of the post, but none of this seemed to have occurred early.

[Camron Rust]

Originally posted by rainmaker
Fall ball today. Girls Varsity. These two teams played each other three different times today. I have no clue why. I did all three games.

Both very good teams, each team had a couple of players who had been 1st or 2nd in their respective states. Each team had one player who has signed with a D1 college. All three games were close, white won the first two.

Third game, was back and forth. Near the end, white's whining about not getting calls, little things. Near the end of the game white was ahead by four. Black #1 goes up to shoot, gets fouled good and solid. As we're lining everybody up, and trying to deal with the different things that were happening, White #31 was ragging on and on, and then started complaining to the parents who were watching. So I whacked her. Black hit both the personal foul shots, and both the T shots. Black got the ball, but couldn't score, game ended in a tie.

In this league the rule is 3 minutes stop time for overtime. We get about 20 seconds in, white #34 is trying to get in front of black #1 who had the ball. Black stops suddenly just to the side of the key, scoops up the ball, and gets plowed from behind by white. I call the foul and say two shots. "But she wasn't shooting!!!" Well, no it's pretty hard to shoot with a full-size opponent on your back (#34 is a D1 prospect). "But she wasn't shooting!!" #34 kept yelling it again and again. So I whacked her. Black hit all four shots again.

Last 30 seconds, white still behind, and getting desperate. White #42 does the foul-to-stop-the-clock thing by bumping black #12, grabbing her arm and then pulling on her jersey. I called intentional.

Black won.

I'm having a hard time feeling the least bit concerned. They were all good calls. They were all obviously over the line, and easy to make. I didn't do it to vent, or to get back at anyone, or because I lost my temper. I was just calling the game that was in front of me.

I didn't have a hard time talking to the coach about it after the game. He was unhappy, but I knew I was right. He said, "Refs are supposed to avoid giving T's." I said, "Yes, coach, you're right, but there are times when it's unavoidable." He said, "You decided the game with that T." I said, "No, coach, your #31 decided the game with that T." He said, "You called two T's and an intentional foul on us. What am I supposed to say to my girls?" I said, "Tell them to play as well as they did in their first two games today, and to quit fouling!"

I feel like I've turned a corner. I haven't always been able to handle these kinds of things, but today, it felt natural, comfortable and smooth. I like working hard, and getting better! Gives me hope that i might actually be good someday!!

Only one question. Why did you let the foul turn into an intentional? You had two opportunities to call a common foul before the jersey grab. Sure they wanted to stop the clock but it sounds like they were doing so with an aggressive defensive play (bump) that went uncalled. Only then did they escalate to the jersey grab.