Referees who coach

[I'msureofit]

I have done a lot of rec games over my 10+ years experience as an official. Mostly, the games are Bantam (7-9 grades) to Senior (10-12 grades) boys. About half of these "experienced" (7-10 yrs, some certified but most are not) partners that I work the games with have a habit as the L of warning defensive players to get out of the paint to avoid a 3 sec call. They will also advise defensive players not to reach or "get your hand off" in a hand check situation. This fact has always driven me nuts.

I had a senior boys game recently where in the 2nd quarter I tagged a 3 (I usally count it to 4 to give the benefit of the doubt) on an offensive player who retorted that I had to give him a warning first. I told him that I'm not in the warning business but in the calling business when it comes to such calls, any calls. I would say that it's not entirely his fault but rather the result of being conditioned over time that warnings are given by too many refs in our league.

Now, two things that I'll throw out there for comment. 1.) at these levels, players are experienced enough to know these rules that cause these types of fouls and violations. I think we all can agree on that. And, 2) it is not the job of the officials to coach but rather to just call them, simply. It should be the job of the coaches to discern, or ask, what is or isn't being tolerated on the floor and relay that to his players. I haven't taken the time to look this one up in the rule book as of yet. Just thought I throw it out there for now to you all for comment and interpretation. Thanks.

[LarryS]

I agree...players should know the rules. So should the officials but I still see some put both arms up like they are reaching over someone and call "Over the back". Coaches should also know all the rules...but many don't bother with the finer points. That is why they occassionally ask questions...I assume you try to deal with them.

I am of the opinion that while we are not there to coach the players we need to remember the people behind the benches did not come there to watch us blow our whistle and prance around. If I can quickly say things like "clear the paint, guys", "Don't push", "Keep it clean", "Watch the hands" and keep the game flowing smoothly without giving someone an unfair advantage I should do so...just not the entire game

There is no harm in doing it...in fact, I view it as a part of good game management.

[ChuckElias]

If you like calling 3-seconds, then go ahead. If you'd rather continue the game without having the violation in the first place, then tell the players to "CLEAR" the lane.

JMO

[ChrisSportsFan]

Usually a couple of times in the first quarter I'll say "clear" or "get out" and I'll also remind players with a "hands off" or "straight up". I'm not coaching or giving an advantage because it's done at both ends. I believe it's preventitive officiating that helps get the flow of the game going. I usually don't do it beyond the first few minutes but I think it helps player know we're watching and people would rather watch them play than us officiate.

See the tread on; What is more important....

[tjones1]

Hi Chuck!!!!

Yes I agree with Chuck. I'll try and talk them out of it every time, but if they refuse to listen then I'll nail them with it. At the higher levels though, usually this only needs to be done once. Also, around here, a lot of the big guns (i.e. not me! ) view the 3 seconds call as a chicken sh*t call!

[Adam]

If he's loitering in there, waiting for his girlfriend to take a picture, I'll tell him to move. If he's affecting the play, I'll tag him. I'm okay with warning him or just tagging him. We warn all the time here, but we've never had players say they are owed a warning.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by I'msureofit
partners that I work the games with have a habit as the L of warning defensive players to get out of the paint to avoid a 3 sec call.

I'm assuming you misspoke when you say he warned a defensive player about 3-seconds

[thumpferee]

I have seen players running out of the lane and 3 seconds is called.

I have seen a player called for 3 seconds with the tip of his shoe on the lane line with the ball on the other side of the court.

I have seen 3 seconds called while the ball is in the air on a shot.

3 seconds is not a chicken sh!t call, but there is a time for it to be called.

Eliminate it from your game and you will be surprised how much of the game you've been missing!

JMO

[lrpalmer3]

Originally posted by thumpferee
Eliminate it from your game and you will be surprised how much of the game you've been missing!

JMO

I hated this opinion when I finished my officiating class. 2 years later ... it's eliminated.

I'm also slow on travelling violations unless it totally rediculous. I've watched enough game film to see that what looks like a travel usually isn't.

[I'msureofit]

I agree with the philosphy that we're not there to interupt game flow. I love those blessed stretches where play is good and whistles are muted. And, I know the crowd watching is enjoying it too and you almost hate to end it all with a tweet; but, such is our job.

I also agree that it would be beneficial to be more vocal early in the game to help players understand what thier doing; and, thus will understand better when they've been tagged later in the game. However, the said officals I'm speaking of tend to do it the entire game. As long as anything is equitable between teams, and aids game flow, throughout a game I guess I wouldn't take issue with this strategy. However, the one call, the 3 sec call, I find is more crucial than some give it credit for, as some "big guns" find it. Those who camp out in the lane gain a big advantage because that area is the highest percentage field goal area on the floor i.e. easy basket and the highest percentage, per position, for offensive rebounding i.e. put backs. I rarely see any hesitation on the part of NCAA D1 or NBA officals to make this call (and, I watch far too much basketball). Thought I would just interject these thoughts as the the tread flows i.e. this is better than actually working today and watching 3 inches, per hour, of white crap fall outside my office here in Syracuse. Again, thanks for the input on my post.

[Smitty]

Originally posted by lrpalmer3

I hated this opinion when I finished my officiating class. 2 years later ... it's eliminated.

I'm also slow on travelling violations unless it totally rediculous. I've watched enough game film to see that what looks like a travel usually isn't.

Which other rules do you all choose to ignore?

[I'msureofit]

(is misspeak a word?). In a manner of speaking (the biggest expample I hear is "get out of there") the players are warned that they're camping out.

[Smitty]

Originally posted by I'msureofit
(is misspeak a word?). In a manner of speaking (the biggest expample I hear is "get out of there") the players are warned that they're camping out.

I think what she meant was that defensive players can be in the key for as long as they want. It's those pesky offensive players that need to get out. But hey, if you never call it, I guess it doesn't matter.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Smitty

I think what she meant was that defensive players can be in the key for as long as they want. It's those pesky offensive players that need to get out. But hey, if you never call it, I guess it doesn't matter.

Yes, misspeak is a word. (Obviously biased political comment omitted).

Smitty's right. I was saying that I hope your partner isn't warning the defense. Warning the offense is debatable, but warning the defense is just plain wrong!

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by I'msureofit
(is misspeak a word?). In a manner of speaking (the biggest expample I hear is "get out of there") the players are warned that they're camping out.

I've never whistled a D-player for being in the lane to long. Dang, guess I better get with it!