Had a discussion the other night at our association meeting.
It seems we have a new private religious school that comes into our area for games. The problem that has arisen is that this team cannot leave their school before the sun has set.
As a consequence, the team was late for a "B" Varsity Boys contest that our officials were to officiate.
I'm not sure how late...but, they were late.
The referee for the contest administered a T to the team...and let them have 8 minutes to warm-up before the game. (The official said he had got together with the AD's and that's what they agreed on)
Well, one of our board members stated that he thought this was not enough time to warm-up...and that it was a safety issue that we should be aware of.
He asked me if there was a rule concerning time allowed for a team to warm-up.
I stated that I did not know of a rule regarding this, but agreed that since the team had already received a T...to let them have at least 15-20 minutes to warm-up...for saftey reasons and for the officials pre-game duties.
I also stated that I thought this should be a league concern, since it will probably continue to be a problem.
Maybe they can change the start times for this school on long road trips.
Comments?

I've really never thought about this kind of thing happening to be honest. Always said there's no excuse to be late unless of bad weather or a last minute transportation issue. I don't know, in some ways it sounds like an AD problem. Why don't they allow and schedule the game a little later for the team to travel? If they already got a T, I agree, I would put 15 on the clock to allow them to get warmed up, no need for some one to get hurt when an extra 5 minutes could have prevented it.

I would not give a T for this. I don't like to punish kids for the lack of organization of adult administrators. But that is just me. After the game, I'd alert my association's board of directors of the situation and have them elevate it as high as possible to get some permanent resolution.

To me, this isn't something the officials should have to deal with. I would also take the responsibility (liability) off of my crew by getting the two A.D.'s together (or coaches if A.D.'s weren't present) by saying something like this:
"You guys decide how much warm-up time you need and when we start." But that's just me...

Z

Has anyone checked out this guy's homepage on his profile? It's really disgusting porn. I'm not kidding.

Vampires??

IMO no T. Let them have at least 15 minutes to warm up. And get a clause in your contract for late fees.

Must have missed it Mark. I guess it was removed.

Nope...probably Seventh Day Adventist. We have one of their schools here also...can't compete from sundown Friday until sundown Saturday...the league schedules all their Saturday games for 8:00...

That will teach me to let an official "friend" of mine use my puter at work...sorry if any of that crap offended you...I didn't even open it, but I DID delete it after I read your statement Mark. (I thought you were kidding) :(

P.S. Thanks a lot RedneckRef...I wonder how your ratings will turn out next year.
Of course Mr. Padgett probably could have used a little more discretion and e-mailed me about this...but hey, at least he got to look at some "disgusting" porn and tell the world about it to. ;)
Edited:
Just checked with my buddy RNR...he assures me it wasn't him...so I guess I have to figure out who has my password around here. ????

[Edited by RookieDude on Feb 10th, 2005 at 03:51 PM]

Yep...but the Vampire thing was pretty good! :D

The current homepage link is the Official's Forum --- are you trying to insinuate something? ;)

TJ,

I live in a big metropolitan area. It is not totally uncommon to have a school be a little late because of traffic that can be compounded by weather or accidents on these local interstate roads. If I have a team that is late, I would be as accommodating as possible. I would give them normal time for the most part. Really this is an issue between the schools and not really that involve the officials as much. Until the game starts we really do not have much say as to what is going to happen. I would have no problem giving the full time depending on how late they were. If it was less than an hour I probably would not make a big deal out of it. This happens all the time during the baseball season and we are fighting light. That is usually not a problem during the basketball season.

Peace

I'm showing the www as chat112 -dot- com

I wouldn't issue a T for this. This is an AD/administrator problem. The only time I'd issue a T prior to the game for being late is if they warm up, go to the lockerroom and then return to the floor after the buzzer has sounded.

As mentioned above, don't penalize the kids for an administration problem.

I agree that no T should be issued for this type of situation. Having the roster and starters turned in prior to the 10 minute mark assumes that the team is at the location.

Once they are in the facility, put 15 minutes on the clock and use SOP from there.

But I would NEVER issue a T in this situation.

The assignor needs to address the situation would the administrators who steup the schedule. I understand that there are religions who won't play after sundown on Friday, etc. But what in the world had leaving the school after the sun goes down got to do with anything? :confused:

I agree with no "T". I say bite the bullet and let the game begin as it normally would.

That type of sportsmanship (<I>as demonstrated by the A.D.</I>) would be short-lived around here. That A.D. may have never wanted to play the "new" school", but was forced to take the game.

Tactless. Tasteless.

mick

For what it's worth!
 

I know this is a different scenario than the original post, but to add to the more general discussion...

Very early this season, a team arrived an hour after the scheduled starting time for the game. The bus had left late and then an accident (not theirs) delayed them. My partner negotiated with the coaches and they agreed to a shortened warm-up time, shortened periods, and an abbreviated halftime. I emailed our assignor after the game and asked whether what we did was okay. He informed me that we should stay out of that decision-making and just referee the game.

I wonder if our association ever tried to negotiate a "late fee"?

Re: For what it's worth!
 

I could see some real problems with being that late for a game, sometimes I am assigned multiple games at multiple sites, with first game in one town and second game in different town later in the day. This could really mess up getting to the second game/town in time for the second start time. I know, everybody will say, "don't schedule multiple games in different towns and you won't have that problem" true, but the games are scheduled by the assignor and he/she wants you on that particular game and knows how long it should take to get from Point A to Point B. Sometimes it creates a little anxiety even if the first block of games takes longer than expected because they get to be a little bit on the "foul-fest" side.

I can't see giving out any Ts for a bus being late. Stuff happens.

WTF!
OK...I changed my password...hopefully, this s*** will stop now!

BTW, I agree with the no T and let the league handle it.
As a board member...I can assure you that we have notified the league and are taking steps to handle this problem.

Good idea to change your password.

But why did you tell everyone you changed it to hopefully?

Re: For what it's worth!
 

Unless I've got specific information about the status of a team that is not present, I'll be gone before they get there if they're that late. I wouldn't just wait and wait hoping they will show up.

I think that negotiating the time down would be acceptable (and is specificlly authorized in the rules...although it is silent about who can initiate the idea of reducing times).

[/B][/QUOTE]

Good idea to change your password.

But why did you tell everyone you changed it to hopefully? [/B][/QUOTE]

I want to know how he got to pick hopefully. Mine is always *********. :p

I've had a couple of situations where the visiting team was extremely late. The first one was because one school had the game scheduled to start an hour later than the other school had. The other time was when a problem arose with the bus they were traveling on.

In both instances, the coaches were able to make contact with each other to let us know what was going on and that they would be there.

Even though it's extremely aggrevating (because we get fined if we're late to a game) to have to wait on the team to arrive, we must remember, <b>we work for the schools</b>.

In todays world, with just about everyone having a cell phone, being able to communicate shouldn't be a problem.

Btw, every instance I've ever had where the visiting team was late, they've always hurried as fast as they could to get dressed, take a few minutes to warm up, and get the game underway. We (officials) have never had to try to speed them up, they already felt bad enough for making us wait.

Also, our contracts with the schools stipulate that we are to wait 30 minutes after the scheduled start time before we can cancel/forfeit the game. However, if during that 30 minute late time, we discover that the team is on the way, we are required to stay and officiate the game.