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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 01:23pm
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Three person mechanics:
A1 drives to the basket. The drive originates in Trail's primary and contact is made between A1 and B1 on the lay-up. Lead sees charge. Trail sees block. I've read that the Trail has A1 and the call all the way to the basket if it originates in his primary. I've also read that Lead has the call since it was coming toward him. Both officials come up with a foul, then make eye contact before signaling. Who takes this call?
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Luther 
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 01:31pm
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because different people have different ideas here, this is important topic to cover in your pregame.
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Do you ever feel like your stuff strutted off without you?
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 01:35pm
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Quote:
Also, when it occurs durning a game take the time to discuss what each of you saw, that will normally tell you who needs to make the call.
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You can do what you want to do and be what you want to be but you can't be afraid to pay the price!
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 01:53pm
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Quote:
NFHS 2003-05 Official's Manual page 52: "When a player with the ball starts a drive to the basket from an official's primary area, that official has the player and the ball all the way to the basket." Difinitely a matter for pregame.
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Luther
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 01:53pm
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If both players started in the Trail's primary in a perfect world it should be the Trail that keeps the call. The Trail saw the beginning, middle and end of the play. The Lead might have seen part of the middle or part of the end. This should be discussed in pregame before you get into this situation on the court. What applies in 2 person does not apply in 3 person.
Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 02:02pm
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I'd give my lead a few seconds to make the call, and if I'm lead I want the call. Mostly because I believe the lead has a much better chance of seeing the defensive player coming into the play. On this play it's all about LGP. If you don't have the defense, you guess on the play.
Blackhawk
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There's only one thing that makes the adrenalin run as high as a packed house and a good ball game ~ Big Mule Deer! www.HuntingNanselRanch.com
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 02:13pm
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We do mostly 3-whistle now...and if the player starts in your primary, you have that player all the way to the basket. Now...if the T or C miss a big crash...then we pre-game that the L may come up with the call.
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Dan Ivey Tri-City Sports Officials Asso. (TCSOA) Member since 1989 Richland, WA
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 02:14pm
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I'm assuming "B1" refers to A1's primary defender. If so, I think Trail keeps this all the way to the hoop. If A1 crashes a secondary defender, Lead can come in to help. But Trail has the best look at the play start to finish.
In the end, though, absolutely something that needs to be addressed in pregame.
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HOMER: Just gimme my gun. CLERK: Hold on, the law requires a five-day waiting period; we've got run a background check... HOMER: Five days???? But I'm mad NOW!!
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 05:30pm
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 06:14pm
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I had this situation in a championship BV game last night with a 3 man crew. I was lead. The pass cam into the center just short of the free throw line in the key. As the center backed in he turned and I saw a secondary defense player (B2) close in and block. My partner (center) saw A1 charge into B1 a split second after which was caused by B2's block. We discussed the play and I took the call. Unless it's obvious, a double whistle most always deserves a chat. There really should be no hard and fast rule as to who should take these calls. Generally we hear that it goes to the official where the play is going but, don't live and die (especially die) with that.
[Edited by ChiliBob on Dec 30th, 2004 at 06:17 PM]
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 06:22pm
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I totally disagree that the trail has the best look at a b/c call on a drive to the basket. We specifically pregame that the lead should take this call because most of the time it will be a post player that steps in to take the charge. There is no way that the trail can have a good look at the position when he is watching the primary defender as the offensive player drives to the basket. It is very seldom that you will have a b/c call on the initial defender. The dribbler will beat the defender and the crash will come closer to the basket with B2. Think about this situation more and you will come to the same conclusion.
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Thu Dec 30, 2004, 07:30pm
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Quote:
I enjoyed your post right up to the last sentence. Then it became condescening. I agree with others that this should be part of any pregame discussion with your partners. Here's how we handle this in our neck of the woods. Trail stays with the drive all the way to the hoop if it originated in trail's primary. The lead might take it if the B/C is between A1 and a secondary defender (B2). A good referee officiates "one play ahead" and so the trail will anticipate the charge and may well have a better look at the play than the lead, even if the B/C is between A1 and B2. It's quite possible that the lead is very honed in an an offball competitive matchup and might not have a good look at the B/C at all. Around here, trail gets first crack and lead can take the call if he/she has a patient whistle and trail doesn't take that call right away. Z
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