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-   -   USBL Coach Pulls Team off Floor (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/13594-usbl-coach-pulls-team-off-floor.html)

OverAndBack Sun May 09, 2004 10:16pm

You have to register to read the article itself (in Cedar Rapids, Iowa? Puh-leez.), so I'll summarize:

St.Louis SkyHawks (United States Basketball League) coach Floyd Irons, apparently a high school coach (and probably soon to be a former professional coach) pulled his team off the floor Friday night in Cedar Rapids as his team trailed the River Raiders 38-21 with 6:32 left in the first half.

Game officials Tom Turckas and Dave Cusick had a fun time trying to convince Irons to reconsider, but he was having none of it.

At the time Irons pulled his team off the floor, St.Louis had been whistled for five fouls and Cedar Rapids 1, with St.Louis having shot 1 free throw and Cedar Rapids 2.

Irons has won nine Missouri state high school championships, but may not get a chance to win one in the pros.

"Actions will be severe and swift," USBL PR Director Dennis Truax said. "He's a high school coach making a high school play and it's out of the question what he did tonight. It was Floyd Irons making a grandstand play because he didn't get his way."

Now, y'all have been around a lot longer than me, and this is professional ball rather than what we do (hey, it's the summer, what do you want to talk about?), but let me ask you: How long, how forcefully, and how loudly would you attempt to dissuade a coach from keeping his team from completing a game when he makes a grandstand play to protest the officiating?

I would tell him, very calmly and strongly, once, that he realistically would face very strong sanctions from his league and potentially the loss of his job if he continued with this course of action. I'd say now if you want to protest after the game, fine. But let's go out and finish the game, because as it stands, your team is going to forfeit and you are likely to lose your job. So what do you want to do?

And if he persisted, I'd say "fine," pick up my check and head home to watch the fireworks. Life's too short.

Ref Ump Welsch Sun May 09, 2004 10:24pm

Here in Nebraska, if it were a high school game, I'd remind the coach that pulling the team is an automatic forfeiture of the game. Nothing else. He/she should know the consequences if it happens.

BktBallRef Sun May 09, 2004 10:33pm

So, the cat is outta the bag!!

BBallCoach's real name is Floyd Irons!! :D

blindzebra Mon May 10, 2004 01:07am

Quote:

Originally posted by BktBallRef
So, the cat is outta the bag!!

BBallCoach's real name is Floyd Irons!! :D

No the article said this Irons won 9 state championships, I'd doubt BBallCoach has won a game much less a title.

ChuckElias Mon May 10, 2004 08:38am

I would continue to attempt to dissuade him until he was actually off the floor. As the league official said, this is professional basketball and all the participants should conduct themselves as professionals. I wouldn't want to let him just "hang himself". I'd keep trying to get him to play the game.

In fact, maybe I'd just eject him and try to get him to leave and let his assistant take over.

BktBallRef Mon May 10, 2004 08:50am

Quote:

Originally posted by blindzebra
Quote:

Originally posted by BktBallRef
So, the cat is outta the bag!!

BBallCoach's real name is Floyd Irons!! :D

No the article said this Irons won 9 state championships,...

I doubt it. He probably just told them that to get the job! ;)

OverAndBack Mon May 10, 2004 09:39pm

The league suspended the guy indefinitely. St.Louis papers say he's kind of an abrasive guy, the kind other coaches and administrators don't like to deal with. I can't imagine where they got that idea.

Stat-Man Mon May 10, 2004 09:48pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Ref Ump Welsch
Here in Nebraska, if it were a high school game, I'd remind the coach that pulling the team is an automatic forfeiture of the game. Nothing else. He/she should know the consequences if it happens.
In MI, if a team pulls his team off the bench, notonly is it a forfeit, but he has ot appear before the state association board and explain why his team doesn't deserve additional sanctions.

BktBallRef Mon May 10, 2004 10:21pm

Here, the school is fined and they may have to forfeit remaining games.

zebraman Mon May 10, 2004 11:22pm

I'd just say, "coach, are you sure you want to do that to the fans and players just because you are in disagreement with some of our calls?" When he said yes, I'd just call it off and let him deal with the mess he made. I wouldn't sit there and try to dissuade him any more than that. If he's in a frame of mind where he wants to take his team off the floor, he's in no frame of mind to listen to reason.

Why would high school administrators let him coach at the high school level if he's so hard to deal with? Are they that desperate for coaches there in St. Louis?

Z

Adam Tue May 11, 2004 07:01am

Here in IA, we had a coach pull us off the floor my sophomore. We were visiting team at parents' night at the eventual state champion. End of third quarter, score is 92-26 (or something like that) and home coach leaves his starters in to start the 4th quarter. Our coach pulls us off the floor (I wasn't happy because I lost some scrub time) and we go home.

Coach received a two game suspension from the state. I don't know about any fines or anything like that, as it was way above our heads. It sure was nice to beat them my senior year, though. :)

OverAndBack Tue May 11, 2004 02:36pm

Quote:

Originally posted by zebraman
Why would high school administrators let him coach at the high school level if he's so hard to deal with? Are they that desperate for coaches there in St. Louis?
I get the feeling it's because he's been there a long time, he's won a lot, and he's a powerful force at what I gather is an influential school in the St.Louis area. I think he's also the Principal and the AD or some such.

Ref Ump Welsch Tue May 11, 2004 02:59pm

BBallCoach has been real quiet lately. Maybe he's not reading the board out of season!

Mark Padgett Tue May 11, 2004 03:47pm

In the early days of the NBA, Mendy Rudolph was working a game in Syracuse. The visiting coach (I don't remember his name, but the team was Ft. Wayne) threatened to pull his team from the court. Mendy told him that if he did, he'd have to personally pay for all the refunds to the fans. According to Mendy, the guy just sat down and shut up after that.

I heard him tell this on an old interview during halftime of an NBA game in about 1964.

tomegun Tue May 11, 2004 09:07pm

Quote:

Originally posted by OverAndBack

I get the feeling it's because he's been there a long time, he's won a lot, and he's a powerful force at what I gather is an influential school in the St.Louis area. I think he's also the Principal and the AD or some such.

I lived in St. Louis for a year after high school. If he is the coach and principal with state championships it can only be one school. That would be Vashon high school. The almighty V! If you know about their program then you would understand why he thinks he can get away with this. Notice I said he thinks he can get away with this. I'm sure he will keep this separate from his day job.

blacktiger Wed May 12, 2004 07:38pm

Coach Irons is the head coach at Vashon HS in St. Louis. They are a state power and are also on the national radar from time to time. His team recently won their ninth state championship with a 33-0 record.
This is not the first time he has done this. About 13 years ago he pulled his team off of the floor in the state semis with two seconds remaining. They were losing and Coach Irons ended up walking away with little punishment.
He is a very controversial person in St Louis. He is often accused of recruiting players from all over the city and often draws complaints from area coaches. He was turned in a few years when one of his players was shot dead in front of the players home. The problem was the player did not live in the Vashon district.
People in St. Louis either love him or hate him There is very little middle ground.

tomegun Wed May 12, 2004 09:27pm

Isn't it crazy when, although they make more money, the pro coach is third in power behind the college and high school coach? Sure, that statement is subjective but there are high school coaches that do not want to go to college because of the power they have and some college coaches that feel the same way about the pro game. The pro coach is often-time the lame duck because he is constantly invaded with beepers, cell phones, trials, the almighty agent and the posse! The saving grace is one season as a pro coach can set them up for life financially. Sometimes it doesn't make sense.

Adam Thu May 13, 2004 11:47am

The money has got to be there, or they'd never be able to recruit decent college coaches. The list of failed (but newly rich) NBA coaches who came from college is growing. Tim Floyd is the most recent examplt. He was making good money at Iowa State, but the NBA gold was too much to walk away from.

w_sohl Mon May 17, 2004 01:18pm

Ft. Wayne Pistons
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Mark Padgett
In the early days of the NBA, Mendy Rudolph was working a game in Syracuse. The visiting coach (I don't remember his name, but the team was Ft. Wayne) threatened to pull his team from the court. Mendy told him that if he did, he'd have to personally pay for all the refunds to the fans. According to Mendy, the guy just sat down and shut up after that.

I heard him tell this on an old interview during halftime of an NBA game in about 1964.

If it was a NBA team it was the Ft. Wayne Pistons, before they moved to Detroit.

Adam Mon May 17, 2004 01:27pm

Were they really the Pistons before moving to Detroit?

w_sohl Mon May 17, 2004 01:28pm

Ft. Wayne Pistons
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Snaqwells
Were they really the Pistons before moving to Detroit?
Yes they were...

TravelinMan Mon May 17, 2004 08:52pm

Fort Wayne holds the NBA record (dubious) for scoring the fewest points, both teams, in a half. Syracuse scored 27 points. Of course, back then (1955) they played defense and you could say they held Syracuse to only 27 points for the half. Plus didn't they jump it up for each quarter and on held balls.

__________________________________________________ ________
"Hell, there are no rules here--we're trying to accomplish something."--Thomas A. Edison

TravelinMan Mon May 17, 2004 09:20pm

Wait a second. Hold the press. This record must be for "modern day" NBA. Ft. Wayne beat Minneapolis (in 1950 or 1951) 19-18. Ft. Wayne took the air out of the ball. 24 second clock where are you!


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