Alright, fill me in here on swinging elbows.

A1 has ball then swings his elbows,
(a) without contact
(b) with contact
(c) viciously without contact
(d) viciously with contact

A. Nothing unless you have excessive swinging.

B. Player-Control Foul, Intentional or Flagrant.

C. You can only have a violation if you deam it to be excessive.

D. Same as B.

Peace

agree with rut. When you make the violation call say "violation" clearly. It will keep coaches from going crazy since they already think the other team is defending overly agressive.

In addition, if this violation is during a shot before the ball goes through, you have a dead ball, no basket, throw in for B. If team B committed the violation for excessivly swinging arms then you wait to see if the basket is good.

Called the violation for the first time, yesterday in a 7th grade girls game. She didn't have the ball, and her coach had told her that holding her arms straight out to the sides to keep the defense back was illegal, so instead, she had her elbows straight out, but arms folded back toward body. She would swing a little back and forth when she thought someone was getting close to her. I gave her the benefit of the doubt on the right elbow, but when that was followed by an immediate left, I called it. Coach says (get this), "You gotta let us play their game. Why is it illegal for us and not for them?" What I didn't say was that if I thought he'd coached them to use elbows, which is what he was implying, I'd have tossed him. Gotta admit, I've never heard this justification worded quite like this, though. "We gotta play their game". I gave him a few points for creativity.

Agree with rut except for A). In Illinois it is now a violation. Treated like a double dribble. Loss of ball.