We had this situation in our JV game last night.

My partner is coming from Lead to Trail as home team brings the ball upcourt. There is some pressure on A1 in the backcourt. A1 takes the ball, while dribbling, and passes the ball (with one hand) by pushing it towards another player. (This pass was obvious, but the ball did not come to rest in his hand.) The player he passed to (A2) was not expecting it and took off. A1 runs after his own pass and recovers it with a bat to the floor where he continues his dribble.

I wasn't sure about the call. My partner whistled the double dribble. We looked at the rulebook 9-5-3 & 4-15. Does the dribble end when a player passes the rock? Is this a double dribble or legal play?

Help me out with rule interpretation here. One varsity official said it should have been a no call, the other was not sure.

[Edited by footlocker on Feb 4th, 2004 at 11:46 AM]

Seems like just another dribble to me the way I read it.

Think about it this way. Would the action have warranted a double dribble had A2 never been there and the pass intent not been so obvious? If it's a dribble pass (player never really relinquishes dribble) as you suggest by saying it never came to rest, then I'm thinking a nocall here. It seems like an interrupted dribble to me.

Adam

Legal play. The dribble did not end under any of the provisions of R4-15-4. Call it an interrupted dribble, as per R4-15-5.

Since the dribble did not end by definition sounds like A1 id a heads up play

I agree with the other replies. It sounds like an interrupted dribble, and therefore would be a no call.

Ok, so we have a dribble by A1, then we have a bat by A1 toward another player, then we have another bat by A1, which bounces to the floor.

Seems to me that there is one piece of information missing here. What happened between the two bats? If the ball touched the floor between the two bats, then the play is legal. But if A1 batted the ball into the air towards A2 and then batted it again before it touched the ground, we have a violation. (FED 4-15-2 "ART. 2 . . . During a dribble the ball may be batted into the air provided it is permitted to strike the floor before the ball is touched again with the hand(s).)


I agree that the original post sounds like it was probably a bounce pass from A1 toward A2, but if not, then we have a problem.

Say what?
 

You can fumble, dribble, fumble but you can't dribble, fumble dribble so apply it to this situation and come up with your ruling!! This little saying helps to summarize any interpetations.

DJ, that saying may be true, but it doesn't apply here. There's no fumble. There's a dribble and a bat (controlled tap). Since the dribble didn't end with the bat, he may continue to dribble under certain circumstances.

You can't fumble during a dribble. If you lose control, it's an interupted dribble, not a fumble.

Bat?
 

Can a bat be a part of a dribble? Or is it just a dribble? The official has to determine if it is a dribble, an interupted dribble , a fumble or a pass. I don't see how it can be more than one. I can't see how an interupted dribble could be intentional and then be called a pass and finally an extension of his dribble? If he intentionally interupted his dribble I would lean in the direction of a double dribble. I think he made a mistake and now should lose his right to dribble again because he intentionally interupted his dribble. Are not the rules written to reward good play? He just made a bad pass and his reward will be a chance to dribble again?Just my humble opinion.

Does a dribble end when a player passes the ball?

Sure can. A "bat" is part of the definition of a dribble in Rule 4-15-1 & 2. There's no rule prohibiting a player from intentionally interrupting their dribble with a bat.

Dribble-bat-dribble has always been legal, as long as the dribble isn't ended, and the player doesn't touch the bat until it hits the floor again.

Depends on what he does prior to passing it.

Show me where a pass, by itself, ends a dribble, and I'll reconsider. You'll of course also need to show me a rule-book definition of a pass. Dribble passes do not end the dribble, as far as I'm concerned. There's no rule to back that up.

It may look ugly, and the fans and opposing coach are sure to be yelling, but it still seems legal to me.

Show me how this fits the definition of an interrupted dribble. If it is a pass, it's not an interrupted dribble.

Mregor

I've been thinking!
 

I've been thinking about the original play which can be dangerous so correct me if I'm wrong. It is the job of the official to determine if it is an interupted dribble or the the player has ended his dribble and then decided to pass. In the original post the pass was done in such a manner that it is really an interupted dribble that happens to go to the players teammate. If that same thing happened but did not go to a teammate the officials interpetation would be an interupted dribble in which case he can dribble as long as the player does not pick up the ball which would end the dribble. In the original post the pass also called a dribble pass(not in the rule book) is really an interupted dribble and not a pass.

Re: I've been thinking!
 

9-13, <B>An interrupted dribble occurs when the ball is loose after deflecting off the dribbler or after it momentarily gets away from the dribbler.</B>

IMO, an interrupted dribble is not an intentional act. We've discussed this numerous times and everone has their own opinion. I say it is not an interrupted dribble. If the player did not end his dribble, I've got a violation when he touches the ball after being OOB because the loose ball is part of his dribble. If he ended his dribble, I've got an illegal dribble when he returns and begins dribbling again. As originally described, I say it was part of the dribble, play on.

Mregor

Thanks for the help!
 

Thank you mregor. My illogic is becoming more like logic.