When the scorekeeper fouls up - what can the Referee do?

Specifically - They struggled with the possession arrow. Partner and I tried to keep a close watch in 8th grade game.

Last few seconds - Jump Ball. Signaled towards arrow direction - crowd on its feet. 12 seconds left to get off a winning shot, baseline under their basket. Coach wants Time Out to draw up a play.

Table signals us. We're told arrow was pointing wrong way. Other direction correct, ball should go to team up by two. Players in tight huddle with coach's.

As discussion insues - Coach says that possession should be kept manually in the book too. Correct? That would determine if there was a mistake.

We said to coach's that the arrow box was a message and IF the scorekeeper was SURE she did not change it correctly (she said she was certain) we went with her word. We did not have the manual book to back us up.

We went with scorekeeper, changed directions and time ran out.

Tough night.

Suggestions?

- Learn to be more aware of the arrow. Make sure it changes when (and only when!) it should.

- Discuss this with the table crew in pregame. Make sure if they have questions about the arrow, let you know, and to keep track in the book, as well.

- If you're keeping track of the arrow, you should know when it's wrong. That way, you can back up your whistle with a "I know it's pointing your way coach, but you got possession on the last held ball at the foul line."

bottom line is this...the score keeper was certain and you went with what she had...you did the right thing..even though it was painful....

I don't trust the table so I keep the arrow with me. I have a coin in my pocket. When I face the table which ever pocket the coin is in that's the direction we are going.

Takes a little practice, but eventually it becomes second nature.

I don't trust the table so I keep the arrow with me. I remember the direction in my head.

Takes a little practice, but eventually it becomes second nature.

(And it looks better than patting yourself down after every held ball.)

As painful as it can be, a game like that is a great one to work on your arrow management. Force yourself after each AP throw-in to look and make sure the arrow got flipped. If it didn't, get it straight at the next dead ball.

I agree with Chuck on the coin thing. I think it looks bad to see an official using a coin in the pocket (or whatever) or rubber band on the wrist to keep track of the possession arrow. Get rid of the crutch and force yourself to learn to be more aware.

Z

1. Always know which direction the AP goes without having to look at the table.

2. Make sure the arrow is pointing in the right direction after inbounding.

3. Never use a coin or rubber band. I saw a college assignor once tell an official, "If I ever see you switch a coin from one pocket to the other again, you will never work for me again."

I'm getting better at keeping track of the arrow in my head but as a backup I use the button on the left rear pocket of my pants as an indicator. As I face the table, if the pocket is open, go with it. If it's closed, go away from it. Not sure how assignors would feel about my method but it takes less time and is a little more subtle than switching a coin from pocket to pocket.

Oh my! What next?

I'm waiting for someone to post that they use the zipper on their fly to keep track of the arrow.

Ain't going any further with this one. :D

Switching an object from one pocket to the other every time there is held ball is goofy looking (to me). It is worse when BOTH refs are doing this, and even dumber when the table KNOWS how to keep the arrow properly.
After I observed a game where this was occuring, I mentioned this to the two refs (guys I knew). One of them said "It doesn't matter, only another ref would notice."
Hmmm...

PS The back pocket button doesn't sound like such a bad idea until you get used to using your memory alone.

not a bad idea!
 

Some of these ideas sound a little strange but if you work in a gym or at a level where problems are chronic they would be great tips. Heck we work in one gym where the same guy has been at the clock for years and we have seen timing errors that at first made us think he was crooked but now have seen so many that we just know he is inept. Guess what? When we go to that gym he is a part of our pre-game. We keep an eye on the clock and cover our own hinder! If it works use it!!

I just flip my combover hairstyle in the direction of the arrow. ;)

I agree with the officials who say the coin in the pocket, etc. looks stupid, but if you're just starting out and doing middle school games, that might not be so bad. It's a lot worse if a game is decided based on an incorrect arrow.

At a middle school game, you probably don't have an experienced scorer. Get in the habit of instructing the scorer before the game to keep track of the arrow in the book. Follow up at the end of the quarter.

Over time, as you get more confident in you officiating abilities, you'll be able to keep track in your head of the AP situations. And if you have definite knowledge of the correct direction of the arrow, that controls.

If my glasses are on we go left as I face the table if I take em off, we go right...that is if I can actually see a held ball :D

Can't use it!
 

Would't work for me. With my super hold hair spray I would need hinges on my hair to make it flip!

We keep track manually be putting a row of H V H V... at the top of the scorebook before the game starts, and crossing off each time the arrow changes. We rarely have any problems.

HVHV
 

That would be a great suggestion for publishers of scorebooks! As long as the scorekeeper remembers!

Scorebooks already have a place for scorekeepers to keep track of next possession. Good scorekeepers will even record the time of the change.

Strokes
 

whistleone, how many strokes will you give an old man if we play a little Nassau?

Working a univeristy game and the coach from team A calls me over after a time-out to explain that the arrow was not switched to start the second half. I was responsible for watchig the scorer change it and he did, but this coach was insistant that it was not changed. To satisfy him I go and ask the scorer if he switched the arrow, to which he says yes. I even go further, because the coach can hear us, and ask if the next held ball will favor team A. He says YES.

I go back to the coach and say the next possesion will be yours and the arrow is pointing in your direction. He is so upset that he is not listening and just keeps repeating "it was not flip" over and over. I decide I have been at this long enough and say, it's right trust me and point at my partner to put the ball in play. It was like a coach complaining that the score was incorrect and he should have 54 points and when you look at the sheet and score clock they DO HAVE 54.

About 5 minutes later in the game I am C infront of his bench and he say's to me "I'm not crazy you know". I really wanted to respond but just nodded and keep on reffing.

Re: Strokes
 

Since I'm unfamiliar with the course "a little Nassau" and I'm guessing it's your home course, not very many ;)

I like to record the time, the color, and, if possible, a short description of why there was an AP situation. That way, when the coach starts kvetching about why he should have the arrow, you can tell him there was a lodged shot at 12:42 - or whatever happened.

Re: Strokes
 

"The first nun had a stroke.

"The second nun had a stroke.

"The third nun couldn't reach."

;)

Sheez, Mark, some of the scorekeepers I've had to deal with can barely push a button correctly, much less start writing anything, even as simple as H V H V. But then there aren't a lot of pre-law-at-GWU folks keeping score at 7th grade girls' games.

The answer to every arrow problem is to always check just as it should change. Then the only thing you have to remember is whether it is (a) correct, or (b) needs dealing with at the next dead ball. Once the habit is firmly established, you have zero arrow problems at any level. I'm saying this from a position of still working on the habit.