Thanks, & new questions

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

Good post, Coach. I agree with you completely. Advantage/disadvantage is being taken to extemes by some officials who don't really have an idea of what the concept should be. They're using it as a cop-out for not making a proper call. For the guys that say that they're not gonna call a palm or a quick double dribble in the backcourt when there's no pressure, all I can say is I wanna be there when this happens in the last minute of a 1-point game with a crowd of a coupla thousand, and you ignore it. Have fun!

Hmmm, I'm gonna disagree with you...to a degree. By your arguments, you want every three seconds violation called, even if the offender is barely touching the lane line with the edge of one shoe and not involved in the play. You want traveling called every time a dribbler lifts his/her pivot foot just a fraction of a second before beginning the dribble. You want every jump stop called, because no player can truly put both feet down simultaneously. We routinely apply advantage/disadvantage to violations. We routinely call things "close enough" Now the question is, where do we draw the line. But I think we're kidding ourselves if we think we draw it at NOT using advantage/disadvantage for violations.

As for the last minute of a 1-point game...if a referee is going to let a mere 2000 fans intimidate him/her into making a call he/she doesn't want to make, perhaps there are other hobbies that person ought to consider.

[Edited by Back In The Saddle on Jan 13th, 2004 at 10:54 AM]

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Back In The Saddle
But I think we're kidding ourselves if we think we draw it at NOT using advantage/disadvantage for violations.

Agreed.

[blindzebra]

Originally posted by A Pennsylvania Coach
Advantage/disadvantage should be applied to FOULS, not VIOLATIONS.

If you disagree, which violations do you apply it to? All of them? Or just the ones you choose?

If all of them, when a dribbler in the back court with no defensive pressure puts a toe on the sideline for all the gym to see, right in front of the opposing coach, do you pass on that?

What if instead of a toe, the inbounds pass slips through her hands, bounces off the bleachers and back into her hand? No defensive pressure, no advantage, no call?

You can see how silly this can become.

And, if you insist that the "carry" is no advantage when the dribbler isn't making a move, keep in mind that when we see a dribbler "stop" a dribble by letting the ball come to rest in her hand, ALL FIVE of my defenders are instructed to do something differently (the help defenders can now deny, the deny defenders can go farther into the passing lane, and the ball defender can straighten up, step closer, and begin to trace the ball). If, as we are adjusting to the end of the dribble, the dribbler is then allowed to restart her dribble, we are at a severe DISADVANTAGE.

Coach,how does that apply in the 70 feet no defense scenario?In the situation that you discribed,if your defender closed in and got beat,YES I'm sure we would all
call it a carry.

If you limit it to fouls only,why stop there? Remove it entirely from officiating.What is left is a game without
flow,a contest of free throw shooting,and a chorus of,"Let
them play,"from the fans and coaches.

Does the concept get taken to extremes by some officials?
Yes,but it is necessary and something that comes with experience.That is why the varsity games are usually officiated better than the JV;JV better than middle school.