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-   -   NCAA 2-man alert! (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/104850-ncaa-2-man-alert.html)

Nevadaref Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:06pm

NCAA 2-man alert!
 
Lewis Garrison gets clocked by Cockburn from Illinois as he celebrates and is unable to continue. Kimble and Borovski are finishing the contest 2-man.
The injury to the official occurred somewhere around 4 minutes remaining.

bas2456 Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:08pm

Saw the replay. Hope he's alright, he got hit pretty good.

Nevadaref Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:14pm

Unfortunate and scary. Hope the best for him.

On another note, that’s such a dumb ending to the game.
To insist upon having a shot clock violation and inbounding the ball in a 9-point game, but not clearing the cheerleaders and camera crews off the court doesn’t make any sense.

crosscountry55 Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:14pm

Caught the last minute. Was hoping to see a few switches but none materialized.

The 0.1 second shot clock differential that forced a bizarre final throw-in was, well, bizarre.


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bas2456 Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:19pm

The game clock on TV was less than the shot clock, though I saw the shot clock still displaying in the arena. Bizarre ending indeed.

Nevadaref Wed Dec 11, 2019 11:35pm

It happened with 3:11 remaining. There is a video currently posted on ESPN.

Could lead to a decent bit of advice for officials to not run out onto the floor when making a call as the Lead.

bas2456 Thu Dec 12, 2019 01:03am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1035938)
It happened with 3:11 remaining. There is a video currently posted on ESPN.

Could lead to a decent bit of advice for officials to not run out onto the floor when making a call as the Lead.

This is true. Post, patience, signal.

In the end I think this is just an unfortunate accident that nobody could foresee. I think if we can learn anything from this it's to wait until we're sure of our path to the table.

bob jenkins Thu Dec 12, 2019 09:31am

Quote:

Originally Posted by bas2456 (Post 1035937)
The game clock on TV was less than the shot clock, though I saw the shot clock still displaying in the arena. Bizarre ending indeed.

The TV clocks aren't always sync'd with the game clocks -- the TV clocks are run by someone in the production truck. If you pay attention, you will see a few corrections / resets throughout the broadcast.

It used to be more prevalent (or maybe I used to be more observant -- I will admit I watch fewer and fewer games on TV as time passes).

SNIPERBBB Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1035938)
It happened with 3:11 remaining. There is a video currently posted on ESPN.

Could lead to a decent bit of advice for officials to not run out onto the floor when making a call as the Lead.

Yes...I nearly clocked a few kids as L back in my first year. In fairness to myself the endline of the courts at the time were only a foot from the walls.

chapmaja Thu Dec 12, 2019 10:49am

I am a bit surprised this isn't a technical foul against the player. In sports we often talk about how a player has to be in control of themselves during play, they are responsible for their actions, ect. This was clearly a case of a player not being in complete control of his actions, which resulted in very UNINTENTIONAL contact with an official outside the actual play of the game.

I understand completely that this was unintentional, but it was his action that caused an injury to the official. To me this should be a technical foul, without the ejection that comes with intentional contact of an official.

I know there are rules against contacting an official across all sports, and that contact needs to be deemed intentional to draw an ejection (I think all sports now deem intentional contact with an official an ejection). I am just surprised that this isn't a penalized action.

(For full disclosure, I am a UofM fan, but would feel the same way if it was a Michigan fan who hit the official instead of an Illinois player).

SNIPERBBB Thu Dec 12, 2019 11:15am

Accidents happen, we just had last week an official ran over on a steal in transition. U's in football get clobbered all the time. Just part of the job. Now if it was intentional, ejection would be the least the player needs to worry about.

Raymond Thu Dec 12, 2019 05:25pm

I just saw a replay. The official didn't do anything wrong, like walk through the players. The player was just celebrating spontaneously. Just an unfortunate accident.

LRZ Fri Dec 13, 2019 09:20am

I can't speak to college rules, but under NFHS rules, the act does not fall within any "player technical" definition, IMO.

Raymond Fri Dec 13, 2019 09:50am

Quote:

Originally Posted by LRZ (Post 1035978)
I can't speak to college rules, but under NFHS rules, the act does not fall within any "player technical" definition, IMO.

In both NFHS and NCAA-M's rule sets, disrespectfully contacting an official is mentioned as being a technical foul.

LRZ Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:19am

We agree, Raymond. This (even considering its unintentional consequence) was not disrespectful. A technical would not be justified under the rules.

chapmaja Fri Dec 13, 2019 04:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB (Post 1035953)
Accidents happen, we just had last week an official ran over on a steal in transition. U's in football get clobbered all the time. Just part of the job. Now if it was intentional, ejection would be the least the player needs to worry about.

To me this should be a technical because ultimately you are responsible for your body when playing the game. To use other sport examples. In hockey, you are responsible for your stick. Even if it is unintentional and you hit someone with a high stick you are penalized.

I fully understand this was not an intentional act, but I do feel that athletes need to be aware of their surroundings when doing things like this.

What would have happened if this was an opposing player and not an official? Even though it was an accident it is very possible all hell breaks loose because the player was not in control of his body.

As for the last part, if this was intentional (which I know it wasn't), I completely agree that the ejection would be the least of his worries. In that case I would completely support the filing of criminal charges against the player.

JRutledge Fri Dec 13, 2019 04:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by chapmaja (Post 1035986)
To me this should be a technical because ultimately you are responsible for your body when playing the game. To use other sport examples. In hockey, you are responsible for your stick. Even if it is unintentional and you hit someone with a high stick you are penalized.

Well you go ahead and do that. See how far that takes you in your career trying to be "technically" right. ;)

Peace

Camron Rust Fri Dec 13, 2019 05:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by chapmaja (Post 1035986)
to me this should be a technical because ultimately you are responsible for your body when playing the game. To use other sport examples. In hockey, you are responsible for your stick. Even if it is unintentional and you hit someone with a high stick you are penalized.

I fully understand this was not an intentional act, but i do feel that athletes need to be aware of their surroundings when doing things like this.

What would have happened if this was an opposing player and not an official? Even though it was an accident it is very possible all hell breaks loose because the player was not in control of his body.

As for the last part, if this was intentional (which i know it wasn't), i completely agree that the ejection would be the least of his worries. In that case i would completely support the filing of criminal charges against the player.

no.

LRZ Fri Dec 13, 2019 06:12pm

chapmaja, what rule would you cite for that T?

Multiple Sports Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by LRZ (Post 1035998)
chapmaja, what rule would you cite for that T?

STOP !!!! Why are we even entertaining this nonsense !!!

LRZ Sat Dec 14, 2019 08:02am

It's called the Socratic method, to teach (or try to). But I will obey.


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