Technicals, team fouls and bonus

RefsNCoaches

Understanding technical fouls count towards team fouls.

I'm sitting here racking my mind If the 7th team foul comes as a result of technical foul, are we also shooting the 1 and bonus or 2 shots if it's the 10th?

I'm inclined to say no but do not have rule book with me to reference or cite. A Buddy of mine at work and I were discussing and I am wanting to check myself.

Thanks for your help on this and many other topics I merely read here.

BillyMac

RefsNCoaches wrote
If the 7th team foul comes as a result of technical foul, are we also shooting the 1 and bonus or 2 shots if it's the 10th?

Technical fouls carry their own penalty (often, but not always, two free throws and ball at division line) and have nothing to do with bonus (or double bonus) situations, even though they do "count" as team fouls toward such.

Think of the technical foul penalties as "trumping" the other types of foul penalties.

Raymond

Common sense approach. Free throws are shot in order of occurrence. If the common foul was first and only the 6th team foul, what free throws would you be shooting for a 6th team foul?

Raymond

BillyMac wrote
...

Think of the technical foul penalties as "trumping" the other types of foul penalties.

They don't trump other penalties, you are just penalizing in order of occurrence.

BillyMac

Raymond wrote
They don't trump other penalties, you are just penalizing in order of occurrence.

Poor choice of words, just meant to state that one doesn't do both penalties (technical foul penalty and the bonus penalty) for one illegal act (the technical foul), even if the technical foul is the eighth, or eleventh, team foul of the half.

Raymond

BillyMac wrote
Poor choice of words, just meant to state that one doesn't do both penalties (technical foul penalty and the bonus penalty) for one illegal act (the technical foul), even if the technical foul is the eighth, or eleventh, team foul of the half.

The free throw penalty for a technical foul is 2 shots. Never understood why any official would try to add on the free throw penalty for a common foul.

That's why I always keep the explanation simple: penalize in the order of occurrence. The penalty for a common foul in OP is a throw-in. There is a subsequent technical foul prior to the throw-in. The penalty for a technical foul is 2 shots and a division line throw-in.

I wish officials would use proper terminology and eliminate extra verbiage when teaching, because is cuts down on confusion.

BillyMac

Raymond wrote
The penalty for a common foul in OP is a throw-in.

For the life of me, I can't find a common foul anywhere in the original post.

The only foul RefsNCoaches described was a technical foul that happened to be the seventh team foul of the half.

It's pretty simple to figure out order of occurrence when there was only one foul.

Wait. Now I see why you may have mistakenly posted about order of occurrence.

I was wondering about that, thought that I might have missed something, but turns out the post confused me.

RefsNCoaches

Thanks for the replies fellas...

Raymond, I'm not shooting any FTs for 6th team foul unless it's a T or shooting foul 😕

So to recap...no additional FTs for a T that creates the the 7th-10th team fouls...just the 2 for the T.

I guess in my opening question, if the 6th foul committed against a shooter in the act of shooting, that was missed, followed by T, then we'd shoot the 2 for the missed shot, then the 2 for the T. But that's the 6th, not the 7th 😉

Raymond

BillyMac wrote
For the life of me, I can't find a common foul anywhere in the original post.

The only foul RefsNCoaches described was a technical foul that happened to be the seventh team foul of the half.

It's pretty simple to figure out order of occurrence when there was only one foul.

Wait. Now I see why you may have mistakenly posted about order of occurrence.

I was wondering about that, thought that I might have missed something, but turns out the post confused me.

I had assumed the only reason to have this discussion would be because of a 6th (or 9th) team foul called immediately prior to the technical.

I didn't realize the question was "do we shoot one-and-one plus 2 for the T" whenever the Tech is the 7th, 8th, or 9th team foul" or "do we shoot 2 free throws plus 2 for the T whenever the Tech is the 10th or greater team foul?"

BillyMac

Raymond wrote
I had assumed the only reason to have this discussion would be because of a 6th (or 9th) team foul called immediately prior to the technical.

Felix Unger, The Odd Couple, Assume, Yada, Yada, Yada ...

(What's worse, mixed metaphors, or mixed television situation comedy references?)

I fully understand. Everything's copacetic.

Communication would be a lot easier and much better if we could discuss these situations over adult beverages at the local gin mill, as God intended, instead of banging away at a keyboard.

BillyMac

RefsNCoaches wrote
If the 7th team foul comes as a result of technical foul, are we also shooting the 1 and bonus or 2 shots if it's the 10th?

Riddle me this.

White #2 and Blue #3 decide to have a chest bumping contest on the neutral mark of the lane during a live ball. A double foul is called on White #2 and Blue #3. It's White Team's third foul the half and it's Blue Team's eighth foul of the half.

How do we penalize?

BillyMac

RefsNCoaches wrote
If the 7th team foul comes as a result of technical foul, are we also shooting the 1 and bonus or 2 shots if it's the 10th?

Riddle me this.

White #2 intentionally fouls Blue #3 near the neutral mark of the lane during a live ball. Blue #3 is not in the act of shooting. It's White Team's eighth foul of the half.

How do we penalize?

ilyazhito

BillyMac wrote
Riddle me this.

White #2 intentionally fouls Blue #3 near the neutral mark of the lane during a live ball. Blue #3 is not in the act of shooting. It's White Team's eighth foul of the half.

How do we penalize?

2 shots by Blue 3, with possession to Blue at the end line nearest to where the foul occurred. This is just the basic penalty for an intentional foul. There is no "double jeopardy", so the foul is only punished once (with the intentional foul free throws and possession), and is recorded as a team foul. The penalty would be exactly the same as if the intentional foul was White's third foul of the half.

Nevadaref

I don’t believe that anyone has written the most important fact for the OP.

Bonus FTs are only awarded for COMMON fouls and only when such are the 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th or higher of each half. Bonus FTs do not ever apply to intentional personal fouls, technical fouls, double fouls, multiple fouls, or simultaneous fouls. Those all have there own specific penalties.

If it is not a common foul, do not even consider bonus FTs. They simply don’t apply, by rule.

BillyMac

Nevadaref wrote
Bonus FTs are only awarded for COMMON fouls and only when such are the 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th or higher of each half. Bonus FTs do not ever apply to intentional personal fouls, technical fouls, double fouls, multiple fouls, or simultaneous fouls. Those all have there own specific penalties. If it is not a common foul, do not even consider bonus FTs. They simply don’t apply, by rule.

4-8-1: A bonus free throw is the second free throw awarded for a -
common foul (except a player-control or team-control foul)

4-19-2: A common foul is a personal foul which is neither flagrant nor -
intentional nor committed against a player trying or tapping for a field goal
nor a part of a double, simultaneous or multiple foul.