Originally Posted by SCalScoreKeeper (Post 1027743)

Crosscountry,

The leagues that use it here are our area's stronger public school leagues. Our shot clock operator pool is pretty strong out here. Most of the experienced ones go thru at least half a season without a CE involving the clock. The most common one I've seen is inadvertent reset but they're able to correct pretty quickly using recall or they happened to catch a glance of where it was at prior to reset.

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 1027619)

Some of his points were valid....moving to 3 means you need 50% more people to cover the same number of games or you need the same people go give 50% more of their time.

A lot of people can't give up 50% more time, so you ultimately need more people. Assuming you normally use the "best" officials with 2-person crews, that means the ones you need to add come from the next tier down, adding people that were previously working JV games to now do Varsity games. You have more officials on games that are not ready for those games. You can cover select games with an experienced crew, but not all, may not even most games.

It is certainly better at the top, but the big question is whether the 3-person system, across all games, overcomes the effect of adding a generally less capable official to most crews. When we switched to 3-person, who that was was patently obvious to anyone who had any idea of what was going on on the court. They tended to not know where to go and the call selection was just not the same. We knew that there would be growing pains for the first few years as many had to learn 3-person...most 3-person crews had 1 person with 3-person experience (typically with a college background), 1 that was familiar to some degree, and 1 that had no idea. We hoped that the benefit of the 3-person format would eventually overcome the hurdles. While 3-person is certainly better when you have 3 top-level officials, the jury is still out as to whether it is a net win across the board when you have a limited pool to draw from.

Originally Posted by ilyazhito (Post 1027762)

Was there additional training given in SD when the state went to 3-person, or did most scholastic officials already have 3-person experience (camps, playoffs, college, or intramural games) at the time of the transition?
....

Originally Posted by MattReferee (Post 1027765)

Here in South Texas we do both 2&3 man crew depending on 1A,2A etc...
I love 3man as I live by the Sayin 3sets if eyes ARE ALWAYS better then 2 sets..
And as long as you have a strong pregame with co-officals as to primary, consistency and court awareness you should be good🤷*♂️ Why would anyone want 2man over 3 is totally crazy.i could see it for a small 1Aor 2A But 3A. And up Varsity needs 3 man
Long Live The 3 Man Crew

Originally Posted by Raymond (Post 1027768)

These are the type of questions no one knows the answer to. But most HS officials I have encountered do not have college or camp experience. They are just guys/gals who decided to officiate and their bodies are needed to fill games.

You have grave misconceptions about the amount of standardize training that occurs at the HS level.

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1027776)

I have observed more games this season now that I'm injured and it amazes me how many officials ball watch and how many simply call all over the floor. Shouldn't surprise me, but it still does.

Originally Posted by crosscountry55 (Post 1027778)

You might not want to share that observation with the BB editor at the Janesville Gazette. [emoji6]



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1027776)

With a lot of areas of our state using set crews that self form, there are a lot of bad habits and crew specific officiating going on in games all over the place.

I have observed more games this season now that I'm injured and it amazes me how many officials ball watch and how many simply call all over the floor. Shouldn't surprise me, but it still does.

Originally Posted by SC Official (Post 1027805)

I’m glad SC is not a “crew state.” I can only imagine the bad habits and lackadaisical officiating that goes on when you work with the same people every night.

And the writer of this article implies that having 2-person crews where the guys have worked together for a long time is somehow better than a 3-person crew. If you’re a good official you can work with anyone on a given night; you shouldn’t need your “usual crewmates.”

Originally Posted by ilyazhito (Post 1027803)

Raymond, Rich, you're exactly right. There is not enough systematic training at the high school level. Some states make camp attendance a playoff requirement, but it appears that not enough officials go to camp even then. If local associations are able to put on camps and on court training sessions, either on their own or with state support, the quality of officiating will increase, because officials will have more practice. As of now, most officials only get game experience, so if all their games are 2-person (MS, Subvarsity, and rec games for non-varsity officials), how will they learn enough 3-person to become competent enough to do varsity games? If states require camp attendance every year (whether the local association, HS at the state level, an independent teaching camp, or a college camp), and provide some source of scholarships/support local association camps, more officials will be better trained, and we won't see a's extreme of a drop-off from varsity officials who know 3-person to newer varsity officials and JV officials who don't.