Wanted, Reward, Dead Or Alive ...

sdoebler

BillyMac wrote
Having any problems recruiting new talent?

Extreme issues. I believe historically, at least around here, schools played most of their basketball games on Tuesdays and Fridays. About two years ago the association met with the athletic directors and governing body to equal out games per day. They now try to have about the same amount of games played all six available days of the week Mon-Sat.

In terms of recruitment around 09-12 the new officials class would have 40-60 people in it each year. Now I believe the numbers have been 10-15 the last 2-3 years. It is not sustainable with the numbers of officials we have retiring each year. Also, around here there are more schools being built and athletic programs being added. Each year as we have less officials and there are more and more games to cover.

SC Official

sdoebler wrote
Extreme issues. I believe historically, at least around here, schools played most of their basketball games on Tuesdays and Fridays. About two years ago the association met with the athletic directors and governing body to equal out games per day. They now try to have about the same amount of games played all six available days of the week Mon-Sat.

I'm just surprised the ADs were willing to actually consider the officials in making their schedules.

BillyMac

SC Official wrote
I'm just surprised the ADs were willing to actually consider the officials in making their schedules.

It probably came down to that, not playing games, or playing one-person games.

When athletic directors keep getting, "Sorry. Nobody available", from the assigner every time they schedule, or reschedule, a game, they'll eventually get the point.

BillyMac

sdoebler wrote
... around here there are more schools being built and athletic programs being added.

Around here it's new magnet schools, and new charter schools.

We've seen a slight dip in subvarsity girls programs around here, a few schools couldn't field a girls junior varsity team last season, and very few schools have a freshman girls team.

JRutledge

SC Official wrote
I'm just surprised the ADs were willing to actually consider the officials in making their schedules.

Why would that be surprising? Even here some conference games were played on "off nights" in order to get officials they might not get if they played all their games on a Friday. I know that in many cases that were made to have officials that worked boys games to be available. I am not talking about half the season, but certainly, a game on off nights was moved to get a better crowd and sometimes to get better crews for that night as well. Keep in mind we do not do two games in a night.

Do not get me wrong, we often not considered at all in any things schools do. But if they want officials, they better do something.

Peace

sdoebler

SC Official wrote
I'm just surprised the ADs were willing to actually consider the officials in making their schedules.

I believe prior to this a variety of schools received the answer that there were no officials to work the schools game on Friday. My understanding is that this happened to almost half of their games scheduled on Fridays. Then they had to do last minute changes generally which no one wants to deal with. Like others have said they really didn't have a choice in the matter the games were already being moved to off days during the season. At least working with the relevant parties on scheduling prior to the season allowed them to avoid all the changes.

SC Official

sdoebler wrote
At least working with the relevant parties on scheduling prior to the season allowed them to avoid all the changes.

I guess that was my point. Normally officials are an afterthought for schools until something goes wrong, but the shortage must be getting so dire in some places that schools have to be proactive in scheduling around when officials will be most available.

I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

BillyMac

SC Official wrote
I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

sdoebler

SC Official wrote
I guess that was my point. Normally officials are an afterthought for schools until something goes wrong, but the shortage must be getting so dire in some places that schools have to be proactive in scheduling around when officials will be most available.

I wonder how your assigner decided which schools got officials and which ones had to reschedule.

We have about 6 assignors for our area, it was mostly the smaller and charter schools that were left out. This is probably for two reasons.

1. Lower profile games which may make them theoretically easier to move
2. Our process is different from most as I understand it. We receive all of our games for the entire season from the draw on or about October 31st. Many of the smaller schools don't get their schedule in in time to be part of the process so the officials for these schools are assigned manually with what is left. All of the games and officials are ranked so the higher ranked games will be filled first till there is no qualified referees left.

ilyazhito

Interesting. It certainly helps to have a degree of certainty as to who does what games, but how does your area deal with turnbacks, transfer officials, and dual-level officials (High School and College)? IMO, I might only know for sure what my availability is for the next month, unless there are set dates that I need to be present for (e.g. association/state meetings) or I cannot work on (e.g. the day before a final exam), and scheduling me for the entire season might lead to awkward situations in that regard. If the entire schedule is set in advance, then transfer officials might not have as much of a chance to get games compared to established officials, simply because the assigners have not seen them work, or may not know about them, other than through references from former associations.

BillyMac

ilyazhito wrote
If the entire schedule is set in advance ...

After being a Forum member for thirteen years, it is my understanding that some officials sign contracts anywhere from eighteen months, to twenty four months, in advance.

SC Official

BillyMac wrote
After being a Forum member for thirteen years, it is my understanding that some officials sign contracts anywhere from eighteen months, to twenty four months, in advance.

Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

In my state there are many schools that probably don't even have their schedules finalized for the impending season. Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here, 1-2 weeks for subvarsity. I wouldn't want to get games much earlier than that; there are too many things that can change with respect to my availability.

When in Rome...

BillyMac

SC Official wrote
Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here ...

Same here in my little corner of Connecticut.

Now.

Back in the Ancient Days before computers, the internet, email, and Arbiter, we were assigned games through "snail mail" delivered by the United States Postal Service. We mailed (not email) in our availability calendar (it was an actual physical calendar) in September/October, and received our assignments for the entire season a few weeks before the season began. Turnbacks, and reschedules, were handled by Ma Bell's land line telephones, some with rotary dials (Goggle it young'uns). Somehow, it worked. It worked for our assigner, and it worked for us. Hard to believe, but it's true.

Now I have to go out shopping for a new buggy whip.

Camron Rust

SC Official wrote
Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

True, but he's sort of forced to do it that far out. If he doesn't, someone else will grab all the better officials and he'll be left with the leftovers. His schools will be unsatisfied with what he has and will find someone else.

That is one of the downsides of having multiple assignors in the same area. With just one, it doesn't matter how early the schools get their schedules out.

SC Official

Camron Rust wrote
True, but he's sort of forced to do it that far out. If he doesn't, someone else will grab all the better officials and he'll be left with the leftovers. His schools will be unsatisfied with what he has and will find someone else.

That is one of the downsides of having multiple assignors in the same area. With just one, it doesn't matter how early the schools get their schedules out.

Right and I get that, but speaking from an official’s perspective I’d hate to have to commit to a Tuesday night in December months, if not years, in advance just to find out a few weeks before that I have to go on a business trip for my bill-paying job. Is the assigner really going to give me a hard time for giving that game back?

And I can only imagine how s*itty it would feel to be a transfer coming into a state like Wisconsin just to be told that games for the next two seasons are already given out and you’re basically just a fill-in.

Really it is the schools that ultimately force the assigners to schedule this way by making their game schedules so far in advance. Like I mentioned, in my state schools weren’t even thinking about 2018-19 basketball schedules until this past summer, and there are plenty that are still trying to get their last dates filled before practice starts.

JRutledge

SC Official wrote
Rich is an assigner and official in one of those "18-24 month" states, I believe.

I don't get it, personally. Assigners are creating more work for themselves by giving games that far out because there certainly are a high number of turnbacks. It's unreasonable to expect an official to know what his/her availability will be on a specific date months/years in advance.

In my state there are many schools that probably don't even have their schedules finalized for the impending season. Getting varsity games 2-3 weeks out is the norm here, 1-2 weeks for subvarsity. I wouldn't want to get games much earlier than that; there are too many things that can change with respect to my availability.

When in Rome...

It is easy whenever Friday is a premium date for all officials (at least on with boys games). Everybody works on Friday for the most part at all levels. Tuesday is another boys typical game night. If you work girls basketball, you likely get a combination with the other dates. If you are a college official, you likely will not working high school games on Saturday for the most part.

So yes you do know what you are doing here when that is the standard. My goal as an official early in my career was to work a varsity boys game every Tuesday and Friday during the week. I get it that it is different, but not hard to deal with when those are things that have been done since I was in high school which was in the 80s and 90s.

The games for the coming season I started to receive almost 14 months in advance in some cases.

Peace

BillyMac

SC Official wrote
... in advance just to find out a few weeks before that I have to go on a business trip for my bill-paying job. Is the assigner really going to give me a hard time for giving that game back?

Our local policy: Game Turn Back Due To Not Closing Date - Fine $15.00

SC Official

JRutledge wrote
It is easy whenever Friday is a premium date for all officials (at least on with boys games). Everybody works on Friday for the most part at all levels. Tuesday is another boys typical game night. If you work girls basketball, you likely get a combination with the other dates. If you are a college official, you likely will not working high school games on Saturday for the most part.

So yes you do know what you are doing here when that is the standard. My goal as an official early in my career was to work a varsity boys game every Tuesday and Friday during the week. I get it that it is different, but not hard to deal with when those are things that have been done since I was in high school which was in the 80s and 90s.

The games for the coming season I started to receive almost 14 months in advance in some cases.

Peace

You’re completely ignoring conflicts that come up in one’s personal life that can’t be foreseen from so far out. Officiating high school basketball is not most people’s first priority.

SC Official

BillyMac wrote
Our local policy: Game Turn Back Due To Not Closing Date - Fine $15.00

We’re supposed to lose a rating point each time it happens here. Not sure how strictly that’s actually enforced. But it’s not really comparable since we get games just a couple weeks out.

BillyMac

SC Official wrote
You’re completely ignoring conflicts that come up in one’s personal life that can’t be foreseen from so far out. Officiating high school basketball is not most people’s first priority.

Hopefully, most assigners realize that and act appropriately when their officials encounter such conflicts. To do otherwise could lead to a loss of officials who want to "work" for them.

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