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-   -   Illegal screens? (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/103236-illegal-screens.html)

Kelvin green Fri Dec 15, 2017 08:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers (Post 1012980)
I've got a lot of respect for the rules knowledge of the people on this thread who have disagreed with me so I would have a rookie take their word. I don't think it's beneficial for me to keep stating my case, so I'll just say this and move on. In real time, if I'm calling that game, I'm going the other way. I don't think my assignor would have a problem defending that call. I've watched it 10 times, and every time it looks to me like she purposely sticks her rear end ever so slightly into the defender. As I said before, this is a garbage play 80 feet from the basket. She needs to clean it up, there was no reason for that in my opinion and I'm going to help her clean it up if I'm calling that game because on top of being (IMO) illegal, it's a bs screen that was only set so that she could put somebody on their back end. I don't mean to turn this into a debate and I've made my position clear so I won't continue to beat a dead horse after this post.

I will beat a dead horse. A couple of things you need to think about.
This is not a garbage play. You have claimed it is dirty. Sorry but it’s not.

What does the player do wrong? She stops. Let me reiterate she stops. You claim she put her butt out... but look how she stands.... she is entitled to any place on the floor she gets to first.... if she had the ball and stopped, would you say it is a dirty play?

It is not s a garbage play any more than a blinde side screen. Blind picks can be violent. It doesn’t mean it is cheap or garbage.

It’s not a bs screen. ... this is no different than a player slowing down to bunch up defenders so players team mate gets an easy layup ( the Legal moving screen)

You want to clean up a Legal play.

It was a contested play/screen on a steal not 80 feet from basket.

It makes no difference which way she was facing. If she turned 180 would you say the same thing? I doubt it... screening requires no particular way to face.

And lastly... you have no rule to back you up. Calling this is just making up something as you go along. Just because you didn’t like the play...what other rules do you make up because you thought play was garbage?

Some random thoughts....

JRutledge Sat Dec 16, 2017 03:03am
The first play is clearly legal. For one the defender ran into her. She obviously was not looking. They were going in the same direction. When players are going in the same direction, they can stop if they choose. Not sure what she was doing running without noticing her?

The second play looked outside of the frame and a hip check.

Peace

CJP Sat Dec 16, 2017 10:12am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin green (Post 1013015)
I will beat a dead horse. A couple of things you need to think about.
This is not a garbage play. You have claimed it is dirty. Sorry but it’s not.

What does the player do wrong? She stops. Let me reiterate she stops. You claim she put her butt out... but look how she stands.... she is entitled to any place on the floor she gets to first.... if she had the ball and stopped, would you say it is a dirty play?

It is not s a garbage play any more than a blinde side screen. Blind picks can be violent. It doesn’t mean it is cheap or garbage.

It’s not a bs screen. ... this is no different than a player slowing down to bunch up defenders so players team mate gets an easy layup ( the Legal moving screen)

You want to clean up a Legal play.

It was a contested play/screen on a steal not 80 feet from basket.

It makes no difference which way she was facing. If she turned 180 would you say the same thing? I doubt it... screening requires no particular way to face.

And lastly... you have no rule to back you up. Calling this is just making up something as you go along. Just because you didn’t like the play...what other rules do you make up because you thought play was garbage?

Some random thoughts....
The rules do support a foul call here. The two players are not moving in the same path and direction (screener is moving parallel to the sideline and the player screened is moving about 45 degrees from the sideline direction). Time and distance should be allowed.

Pantherdreams Sat Dec 16, 2017 01:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 1012954)
Not relevant. You never have to give time for the opponent to react when a player stops. That is for moving INTO another player's path. When it is a matter of one player following another (same path/direction) the following player is responsible for contact if the player in front stops regardless of the time/distance.
Agree to disagree I do not believe the6nare moving in same direction or following same path. If they. We’re there would be an Oreo type hit ball moving forward, girl getting sandwich not a side on hit.

JRutledge Sat Dec 16, 2017 01:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJP (Post 1013033)
The rules do support a foul call here. The two players are not moving in the same path and direction (screener is moving parallel to the sideline and the player screened is moving about 45 degrees from the sideline direction). Time and distance should be allowed.
This is a statement right out of the Simplified and Illustrated Rulebook, which is also a statement from the rules directly.

Quote:
When screening an opponent who is moving in the same path and direction as the screener, the player behind is responsible if contact is made because the player in front slows down or stops and the player behind overruns his or her opponent.
Nothing in the rule talks about what angle degree or that they have to be straight behind them. This player was running at an opponent that was moving up the court. The Tennesee player did not change her direction and cause the contact. She did not see the opponent for some strange reason.

Peace

BillyMac Sat Dec 16, 2017 03:21pm
And Don't Think For A Second That I Won't Use It ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1013051)
Nothing in the rule talks about what angle degree or that they have to be straight behind them.
Be careful. I've got a protractor in my pocket and I know how to use it.

BigCat Sat Dec 16, 2017 03:44pm
1st is legal 21 just stopped. I don't think she stuck her backside out to make the contact. The player in gray just assumed 21 was going to keep running.

2nd is illegal and I wouldn't pass on it.

CJP Sat Dec 16, 2017 04:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1013051)
This is a statement right out of the Simplified and Illustrated Rulebook, which is also a statement from the rules directly.



Nothing in the rule talks about what angle degree or that they have to be straight behind them. This player was running at an opponent that was moving up the court. The Tennesee player did not change her direction and cause the contact. She did not see the opponent for some strange reason.

Peace
True or false . A person traveling east and a person traveling southeast are traving in the same direction on the same path.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sat Dec 16, 2017 05:41pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1013051)
This is a statement right out of the Simplified and Illustrated Rulebook, which is also a statement from the rules directly.



Nothing in the rule talks about what angle degree or that they have to be straight behind them. This player was running at an opponent that was moving up the court. The Tennesee player did not change her direction and cause the contact. She did not see the opponent for some strange reason.

Peace
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1013058)
Be careful. I've got a protractor in my pocket and I know how to use it.

Jeff:

You sound like me in quoting the Simplified and Illustrated Rule Book, :D.

And between Billy, a Chemist, and me, a Structural Engineer we have pocket protectors, mechanical pencils, and protractors covered.

MTD, Sr.

BillyMac Sat Dec 16, 2017 06:29pm
Slide Rulers ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 1013075)
And between Billy, a Chemist, and me, a Structural Engineer we've got pocket protectors, mechanical pencils, and protractors covered.
You forgot slide rulers. I've got one and I'm not afraid to use it. If they outlaw slide rulers only outlaws will have slide rulers.

bob jenkins Sat Dec 16, 2017 07:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 1013075)
Jeff:

You sound like me in quoting the Simplified and Illustrated Rule Book, :D.

And between Billy, a Chemist, and me, a Structural Engineer we pocket protectors, mechanical pencils, and protractors covered.

MTD, Sr.
But apparently not English. Remember to proofread carefully to see if you any words out.

Raymond Sun Dec 17, 2017 07:25am
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJP (Post 1013033)
The rules do support a foul call here. The two players are not moving in the same path and direction (screener is moving parallel to the sideline and the player screened is moving about 45 degrees from the sideline direction). Time and distance should be allowed.
The screener is moving away from the defender and then stops. There is no rule that says a player cannot stop. It makes absolutely no sense that a player moving away from a Defender is how somehow responsible for the contact simply for stopping.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

Multiple Sports Sun Dec 17, 2017 08:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1013087)
You forgot slide rulers. I've got one and I'm not afraid to use it. If they outlaw slide rulers only outlaws will have slide rulers.
BM - with all due respect I doubt your "slide ruler" is getting much attention from the moms on Friday night or Saturday morning at the youth games.....����������

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sun Dec 17, 2017 09:28pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 1013097)
But apparently not English. Remember to proofread carefully to see if you any words out.

Bob:

Yes, I know, LOL! I went back and corrected my grammar.

MTD, Sr.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sun Dec 17, 2017 09:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1013087)
You forgot slide rulers. I've got one and I'm not afraid to use it. If they outlaw slide rulers only outlaws will have slide rulers.
Billy:

How could I forget slide rules. When I entered engineering school in September 1969, it was a right of passage for a student entering engineering school to buy his first slide rule. My first and only slide rule (which I still have and I kept by my side even as I went through my engineering career) as a Post Versalog 1460. I also a half size Post Versalog 1460 and a Post Trig Slide Rule.

When Mark, Jr., entered engineering school I went on eBay and bought him a Post Versalog 1460.

MTD, Sr.


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