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Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 05:42pm

Final Four video requests
 
Gonzaga/SC
18:53 PC for elbow?
6:45 & replay at 6:25 GT?
5:12 blocked shot & follow through contact to face?

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 05:49pm

2:45 quality screen
2:00 did the player step OOB on the end line before scoring?

Thoughts so far: physical game, Higgins allowing more contact than in Elite 8, Anderson's fake leg movement is ridiculous, but his multiple whistles on every call is more annoying to me, nothing on Sirmons so far.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:02pm

2nd half
3:54 held ball, does it meet the rule definition?

Fuelrider Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:06pm

Gonzaga-SC
3:43 offensive foul call on Zach Collins

Fuelrider Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:08pm

Gonzaga-SC
 
2:09 foul on Karnowski

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:08pm

2:09 4th foul on Gonzaga big man

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:10pm

1:45 excellent help by Anderson on OOB call.

AremRed Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004100)
2:09 foul on Karnowski

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004101)
2:09 4th foul on Gonzaga big man

Don't need video on this one, clear IC. Lead had a poor look at closedown instead of out wide and did not referee the defense.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:22pm

3.5 seconds left
Great example of a touch foul hurting the team with the ball.
That level of contact wasn't a foul all game.

JRutledge Sat Apr 01, 2017 07:53pm

Update: I will not be able to post any of the videos until Monday or Tuesday.

Again, specifics help with the time, half and the type of play.

I will not be home until Monday afternoon. It will also take me some time to get the videos up as well. That is why Tuesday is not out of the question.

Peace

ODog Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004104)
3.5 seconds left
Great example of a touch foul hurting the team with the ball.
That level of contact wasn't a foul all game.

Absolutely agree. Even the player whose coach supposedly wanted him to foul couldn't believe they actually called him for one on that.

Then again, this is not at all the scenario that has generated so much discussion in the Ohio thread.

ODog Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004102)
1:45 excellent help by Anderson on OOB call.

Agree again.

General question: How on earth do these reviews take this long?!
OOB off Gonzaga? Yup.
1:45/23 on clocks? Yup.

OK, guys we're good ... 3-4 minutes later.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:28pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODog (Post 1004111)
Absolutely agree. Even the player whose coach supposedly wanted him to foul couldn't believe they actually called him for one on that.

Then again, this is not at all the scenario that has generated so much discussion in the Ohio thread.

Few's postgame interview comments don't support that. He stated that they wanted to foul with under six seconds left and had practiced it all year.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:30pm

Ducks v Tarheels
10:06 of first half. CBS replay included.
Oregon drive to the basket.
Foul whistled on UNC.
1. Did he travel first?
2. Was it a clean strip by the defense?

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:33pm

Ducks/Tarheels
7:34 of first half
crash near the basket
Questions: possession of the ball by offense? time & distance by defender? Does the RA apply to this play?

ODog Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:39pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004113)
Few's postgame interview comments don't support that. He stated that they wanted to foul with under six seconds left and had practiced it all year.

Right. We know that. Yet the player who was whistled for the foul reacted incredulously and was still befuddled all the way back to the bench.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:49pm

2:32 left in first half
Trail whistles a block on a fast break while lead lets the contact go as another player swats the shot away.

bucky Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:50pm

2:32 to go in first half of Oregon game. Foul on Oregon play. Phantom foul and T appears to point at RA.

Nevadaref Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:55pm

Whether it is a foul or not shouldn't be the question.
I think that it is more important to note that the primary official had this play covered and the determination should have been left up to him. The Lead had an excellent angle to see the space/contact between the players. The Trail had a closed-look.
I would be ticked if a partner whistled this after I made a no-whistle decision.

ODog Sat Apr 01, 2017 08:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucky (Post 1004122)
Phantom foul and T appears to point at RA.

Agree. Incidental contact (if any) at best.

But I thought he was pointing to indicate the defender in question, just so everyone knew the monster blocked shot wasn't the foul. And pointing adamantly, for the sake of salesmanship, for taking the thunder out of the gym.

dahoopref Sat Apr 01, 2017 09:07pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ODog (Post 1004112)
Agree again.

General question: How on earth do these reviews take this long?!
OOB off Gonzaga? Yup.
1:45/23 on clocks? Yup.

OK, guys we're good ... 3-4 minutes later.

FYI, the replay system used is NOT the same video feed that is used by CBS. From my experience, DVSports has their own replay producer and the while the camera angles might be the same used by CBS, the speed of which the video feed is recalled on the monitor to the officials on the floor, is extremely slow. The game and shotclock in-lays are not shown on some of the replays. The DVSport producers will look what CBS is showing and then feed that video to the officials on the floor.

dahoopref Sat Apr 01, 2017 09:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004104)
3.5 seconds left
Great example of a touch foul hurting the team with the ball.
That level of contact wasn't a foul all game.

I saw this as a "take foul." Defender placed his two-hands in front of the offensive player; automatic foul no matter the level of contact.

SC Official Sat Apr 01, 2017 09:33pm

Why does Ted Valentine not start his PTS pack when he administers a throw-in?

Fuelrider Sat Apr 01, 2017 09:45pm

North Carolina-Oregon
 
2nd half 11:30 I believe. No call when Carolina offensive player threw his shoulder into the Oregon defender, then turns into jump ball.

Fuelrider Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:00pm

North Carolina-Oregon
 
5:38 2nd half lead calls tripping. On Oregon defense.

Fuelrider Sat Apr 01, 2017 10:15pm

North Carolina-Oregon
 
1:32 2nd half foul called on brooks looked like a jump ball.

bucky Sat Apr 01, 2017 11:11pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004140)
1:32 2nd half foul called on brooks looked like a jump ball.

If this was the play that gave Brooks his 5th foul, it looked like an awful call. Outstanding defense that was penalized.

MechanicGuy Sat Apr 01, 2017 11:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004138)
5:38 2nd half lead calls tripping. On Oregon defense.

If this was against Brooks, it was an excellent call.

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004090)
Gonzaga/SC
18:53 PC for elbow?

Looks like a cylinder play
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/GPaN8BC7QXo" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>


Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004090)
6:45 & replay at 6:25 GT?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/4VGi4jefsXA" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004090)
5:12 blocked shot & follow through contact to face?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/M5Vl4LyK17I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:16am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004092)
2:45 quality screen

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_l4N3zF98ao" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004092)
2:00 did the player step OOB on the end line before scoring?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/KFb_q25MuS0" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004092)
Thoughts so far: physical game, Higgins allowing more contact than in Elite 8, Anderson's fake leg movement is ridiculous, but his multiple whistles on every call is more annoying to me, nothing on Sirmons so far.

Well that is often the standard. Everyone does not share this philosophy that you seem to.

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:12pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004098)
2nd half
3:54 held ball, does it meet the rule definition?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/8kvJ7Xao_Fc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:13pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004099)
Gonzaga-SC
3:43 offensive foul call on Zach Collins

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/N37TiFYm05I" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004100)
2:09 foul on Karnowski

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/_4Sm9Kvv5Es" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004102)
1:45 excellent help by Anderson on OOB call.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/u7-gFjj3Guk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

ODog Tue Apr 04, 2017 03:13pm

On the held-ball play, I think that meets the definition and was a good call. Otherwise, it would have been a travel, but I think Anderson got it right.

On the PC play, we have a closed look on both the original view and the replay view. Anderson had the perfect view of any potential elbow that potentially displaced Thornwell.

On the verticality play, I think the defender played that perfectly and I would not have had a whistle.

On the team control/shot clock play, obviously TC did not change and the shot clock should not have been reset, and eventually was properly left at 23 after a hiccup reset (and another looooonnngggg review).

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004114)
Ducks v Tarheels
10:06 of first half. CBS replay included.
Oregon drive to the basket.
Foul whistled on UNC.
1. Did he travel first?
2. Was it a clean strip by the defense?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Hg5Gg_b4fG4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:16pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004116)
Ducks/Tarheels
7:34 of first half
crash near the basket
Questions: possession of the ball by offense? time & distance by defender? Does the RA apply to this play?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/H8k2Z1LQ4Hw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:17pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nevadaref (Post 1004121)
2:32 left in first half
Trail whistles a block on a fast break while lead lets the contact go as another player swats the shot away.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/p02HKqsMp18" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:19pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004137)
2nd half 11:30 I believe. No call when Carolina offensive player threw his shoulder into the Oregon defender, then turns into jump ball.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/XBiUtHsKf4Q" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004138)
5:38 2nd half lead calls tripping. On Oregon defense.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/4jiWB6mO8ds" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

JRutledge Tue Apr 04, 2017 09:22pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fuelrider (Post 1004140)
1:32 2nd half foul called on brooks looked like a jump ball.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kRl1SDou4uY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

crosscountry55 Tue Apr 04, 2017 10:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1004429)
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/H8k2Z1LQ4Hw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

That was a PCF. LGP obtained and maintained, "receiver" established player control before contact.

Really tough call in real time, though. Given the relative motion of the two players involved, I can certainly see how it may have appeared to the L that the defender was moving forward. That happens when the offensive player has a lot of downhill momentum and the contact is significant.

bucky Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:42am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 1004433)
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/kRl1SDou4uY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Peace

Held ball!

Camron Rust Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:50am

Quote:

Originally Posted by crosscountry55 (Post 1004435)
That was a PCF. LGP obtained and maintained, "receiver" established player control before contact.

Really tough call in real time, though. Given the relative motion of the two players involved, I can certainly see how it may have appeared to the L that the defender was moving forward. That happens when the offensive player has a lot of downhill momentum and the contact is significant.


Having two feet down while not in the path (where he started) is not enough to establish LGP. The defender must get two feet on the floor while facing AND in the path. While the defender wasn't moving forward, what isn't clear from the video is whether the defender got that 2nd foot down to establish LGP once he got in the path of the opponent. From the angle provided, I can't say whether he did or didn't.


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