HIJAB ISSUE IN MARYLAND PLAYOFF GAME
 

Not to derail, but I saw this today and thought it was related--at least along the garbage lines of suggesting racial bias on the part of the officials:

HIJAB ISSUE IN MARYLAND PLAYOFF GAME

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sport...=.e5f287fdece4

"But we've done this all year and it's never been a problem" / "That hasn't been called a foul all season" is one of my favorite refrains from coaches.

I saw this story while traveling yesterday.

The governing body threw this crew under the bus and drove it over them a few times.

I would have let her play and not thought twice about asking for "documentation".

RE: the hijab issue... how am I, as the official assigned to that game, supposed to know if the proper documentation has been submitted to the state or not?

To me, it's similar to a player-eligiblity question... if anyone brings it up as a concern, I'll tell them to file a report with the state after the game.

I've had several games the last few years with players wearing hijabs... it's a non-issue.

The problem with that assumption is that, by default, the headwear is illegal. It takes an exception to make it legal. You know if they have the waiver by asking for it. If the team has a waiver for it, they should have a copy of it ready to present....or it should be communicated to your organization as a whole. We has such a case here. The state notified the association that it was approved and the association told all officials that player X at school Y had a waiver from the state. Her coach took care of business and that was the end of that.

Players, on the other hand, don't require special permission to play, generally. Being ineligible is the exception.

By not asking and letting players play with illegal clothing, you are making yourself part of the problem. Such inaction leads to articles like the above.

I still would have let her play without asking for documentation. I know and understand it is for religious reasons. I don't think this is being part of any "problem". I think it is using common sense. On the other hand, I see "illegal headbands" in a state championship game shown in another thread. I would have made them remove those. I think those types of things getting let go are being "part of the problem".

The best way to guarantee participants get to participate. Follow the rules. What an official chooses to ignore is no normal and if an official follows the rules, for their association to throw them under like that... I would have send an email to the whole associations telling the governing body to go F themselves. If I mess up I'll own it, if my association wants to they can own it. I don't make enough officiating to get run over by players/fans/coaches/ and my own association.

Hijab: Yes, the governing body responded horribly. Take a neutral stance with an eye toward future adjustments, at least. Sheesh.

Diversity training? Give me a break! Waste of time and a politically correct overreaction. The rule is outdated and needs some tweaking for common items such as hijabs and yarmulkas, which I doubt would become abused and unsafe fashion trends on their own. Unfortunately sometimes it takes an unfortunate circumstance like this one to get the committee's attention. I'll bet it did, and I'll bet we see a change in April. That would be a worthy victory for common sense.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

But there is an exception for the headwear in this case. I think having some common sense and understanding the intent of the rule regarding the exception to the headband comes into play here. There is obviously an exception so why not take things for face value and let the kid play? Why ask for documentation? All I am saying is that I am not asking.

What is the exception?

That a player can cover their head for religious reasons.

with a waiver.

Actually in this case, it appears that it hadn't been addressed all season. The play-off crew properly addressed it and the state governing body threw them under the bus, as Rich stated.

This falls on the servicing association (MultipleSports??) and the school's AD. Both or either should have addressed this with the state governing body way back in December.

Lol, I was too focused on the black/red leg/arm sleeves on 2 players for the home team.

I could go on and on about the hijab issue. I have had games with that situation and each time the team provided the direct documentation. How could that many officials not inform the school/state association/other officials/the player/AD/etc? How could it not be common knowledge that that school had a player wearing one and it not be addressed waaaaaay in advance? How could the state association react that way? How could all of the previous officials not be disciplined in some way? Why would the state association care about the NFHS when they can create their own allowed deviation from the rule just as shot clocks, coaching boxes, and other rules are? How could the AD not have investigated at the beginning of the school year when discovering a student might possibly participate? How could the player/coach/parents not have inquired with all school officials before the season began? Why didn't the player remove it to play? Oh, you mean she did not want to deviate from her religion's rule but they all want the officials to deviate from the rules? (yea, that is a little extreme but still) OK, rant over and it appears that i did go on and on anyway. Sorry, no need for anyone to respond to me, just bugs me big time when something negative happens to a student athlete as the result of a whole bunch of people (adults) not acting appropriately. I will expect fine coming for post containing too many words:)

I am not asking for it. The kid would have played and none of this would have happened. No one would have mentioned it just like no one mentioned illegal headbands in the state championship game shown on the other thread.

The fact is that there is a religious exception for covering a players head. I am not going to ask someone to prove their religion. That is just me.

You're not asking to prove their religion, and the player is not being prohibited from playing because of her religion. You're asking that she has a waiver for you to put a rule aside and she can't play because she is wearing an illegal article. She can take it off and play, or get the waiver. Stop using freedom of religion as the basis for your argument. Also using, "in the state finals I saw illegal headbands" is also a bad argument here. How do you know that officials weren't reprimanded?

An official that follows the rules should never get reprimanded or made a scape goat.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

We don't really know that...or at least not for every game. From the the first paragraph of the article, we know that she rarely played. So, the number of officials to have not addressed it may have been very small depending on how many blowouts the the team was involved in.

Then you are passing the buck to the official that follows you...just so you can avoid a potentially difficult situation. Not cool.

Since you put it that way, I would have let her play and told the coach to ensure she gets the waiver next season. It was a loser out game and they had no chance of winning. Common sense.

You aren't asking them to prove their religion. You're asking them to prove they followed the rules which any decent coach would've done the second he knew he had a player wearing a head covering.

I'll admit this -- I would've likely made a phone call during warmups.

I am not using "freedom of religion" for anything. Common sense here is that there is a religious exception. She is wearing headgear that indicates her religion. I am not going to ask her to prove it. No where in the rule book am I required to ask to see a waiver. It says we shall not permit any team member to wear equipment or apparel, in my judgement, that is not appropriate. In my judgement she plays. Easy.

The point of me bringing up the headbands in the other game is that as long as no one make an issue out of it then it is not an issue.

I will put myself in those shoes and the phone call would go something like this. "I have a player wearing a hijab. I asked the coach to produce a waiver and said she played all year without one. The coach also said she does not play much varsity". The official on the phone would hopefully say something like "We should not punish the kid. Being she does not play much anyway, lets not make a big deal about this. If she sees the floor, no problem, let her play. If they win we will get her the waiver before the next game. If they lose remind the coach that she should get the waiver next year." According to the news paper I would not be far off on this.

By "part of the problem", he simply means all of the officials who didn't stop it before set up the one crew that was put into the position of enforcing the rules. Me? I'd let it go in December and tell the coach he needs to request approval from the state, and that if I see them again I'm going to have to disallow it without that exception.

If I saw them the first time in January, I'm disallowing it and letting the coach know all he has to do is contact the state for the exception and this all goes away. In the day of emails, it would likely be done within a single business day.

By the time you get late in the season, officials are being scrutinized more closely. Once you're in the playoffs, there's no way they can let this go without repercussions.

Of course, having the state supervisor throw you under the bus doesn't help.

Hadn't thought of it (probably because I'm studying for series 7 right now), but I like that better than my idea.

No guarantee that I'd get the right person on the other end of the phone, either. In which case, I'd simply follow the rule.

"Do you have a waiver from the state office?" The answer to that question would guide my next decision.

We had a player in a hijab this year. The coach BROUGHT ME the waiver.

I feel for the officials who are being ridiculed for doing what they're supposed to do -- follow the rules.

Had a player with a medical device (at least thats what i think it was) and the team had a waiver that stipulated it had to be taped over.

Anyone else, like CJP, is just making excuses. If you don't want to do it, that's fine, I don't care, don't justify it with straw men arguments.

Funny you mention the rule book not requiring you to ask for a waiver when it is the rule book that says she can't wear it without one. :/

Being it is a religious thing and not a flamboyant showing off thing, I will not punish a kid because the coach did not know a rule. I agree the state could have handled it differently.

Look, I think it's a stupid rule to be honest, but it's pretty clear and until it's changed, the coach just needs to get a waiver. It's ridiculously easy to get.

If someone didn't tell him all season, those officials did him a disservice. If he was told in previous games and chose not to follow up, that's on him.

Actually, the rule book does not mention a waiver at all. Nice try though.

No waiver needed for medical alert or religious medal. Nice strawman though. lol

3-5-4(e) says headware prohibited. The Exception says state associations "on an individual basis" may allow it for religious reasons...etc

You are correct.

A waiver might not be how this is addressed. It is allowed in Illinois I know that for sure. And if we have an issue, we file a Special Report to address the issue. We have had this come up several times over the recent years.

Peace

That's the way I'd handle it. Headware isn't an advantage. I've never had it down here. I've never seen any announcement on it though from IHSA.

Hmm, you did successfully derail the thread.:(

If you are an official I would say your association needs to train you better. I'm guessing you are not. Your reading comprehension is awful. Medical alert is NOT a medical device. Even these need to be taped up.

Not sure why you say this. The book mentions documentation and a waiver is certainly a form of documentation. Documentation can come in many, many different forms. The rule book is certainly not going to list every single piece of form so they use a broad term, "documentation". So, because the specific word "waiver" is not listed, would you accept an email/voice mail/hand-written note/text/etc from the state association? I am guessing that you would but those forms of documentation are not mentioned in the rule book.

(I have indeed used an email on my phone as a form of documentation to show a coach)

My reading comprehension is awful? You brought up the waiver you were presented and didn't know what it was for.

But tape required, lol.

So.. I would not have asked a kid for a waiver for something that just needs to be covered up by tape.

I am aware of what is not listed. We are to use prudent judgment while applying the rules. I believe that is what the state's position was. I don't judge the officials for making the ruling they did. I am simply saying what I would have done.

I am going to accept the fact that there is an exception to the rule and apply my own common sense that her religion requires her to cover her head. The game was not close and the coach wanted to let her play, so be it. No harm at all.

I am done with the thread. Have a wonderful day.

Sounds good to me, but I would neither use the word "waiver" nor the word "something". I do not like the use of waiver as it, by definition, relinquishes something. I would use words like "documentation", "approval", "evidence" (words/derivatives in the rule book) or synonyms. Instead of "something", I would use the words used in the rule book, "religious medal", and "medical alert medal".

Don't mean to split hairs and I also totally understand your view. I was moreso making fun of the semantics surrounding the words that we use (I am guilty too) and now I have even taken this thread too far, lol. No worries, no need to reply, and I am done with this thread.:)

Yes, because in 15 years of officiating some details over the years slip my mind. The point was that the team had documentation waiving the expectation of the rule be enforced for this kid, for this reason. They even had a requirement (taped over) that had to be adhered to.

You can argue semantics all you like, but like has been pointed out before, you are just kicking the can down the road for the next official to deal with these types of things. I get really frustrated when I get a game in February and I have to hear from a coach, "Well none of the other officials this year have said anything." Anything sub varsity I wouldn't care, and would just inform the coach/player that they need to adjust for the next level. At the varsity level I care, and not at the level I care for JC/D3.

JC/D3 I apply the letter of law, as written all times, that's the expectation.

Separated the posts w/discussion on hijab into new thread

Easy big boy !!!! Not my group or sport !!!!. That comment will cost you lunch in MAY !!!!

It only takes one or two games. Somebody would have mentioned it to other officials and it would have got back to the association board members.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

The decision was made prior to the game not when she tried to check in. Her coach did not inform her of this decision. It's not like it all the sudden popped up at the end of a 30-point blowout or something.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

But they are your friends, hahaha.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

this.

You left out the word "not".

Grow up. The state association agreed that the kid should have played.

The State Association better watch what they say. The NFHS has been known to pull seats from rules committees when states don't enforce rules.

Are you humor impaired?

I don't think you get it. Yes, the kid should have played.

But, when you're talking about varsity basketball, particularly state tournaments, there is a right way to do things and a wrong way. That is why the rules exist and a process exists to obtain a waiver. The coach should have asked for the permission to play. The state almost certainly would have granted it. It is not the official's job to set aside rules because the others botched their job.

In every state tournament I've been part of we have been explicitly told to enforce any and all uniform requirements and, if we don't, expect that it will impact our chances of advancing. While it is certainly not the only criteria, why would any official ignore what they've been explicitly told to do when they're told it will negatively impact them.

The coach and state botched this one, not the officials. They did the job they were hired to do. I would expect the coach and state to do theirs.

I'm doing exactly as CJP. Let her play. If anyone has a problem with it I'll tell them to file a complaint. I will let my chapter know after the game and they can deal with it.

An aside to the uniform rules, at the state tournament here, they specifically tell the officials not to worry about uniform issues such as headbands. Knowing that, I'm definitely not addressing this issue. And if I'm not the R and in your crew and you want to enforce it, I will voice my disagreement but will support you by not saying a word or being anywhere near the conversation with the coach, that is all you. If I'm the R, we are not addressing it and she is playing.

Story was on the local news tonight.

They never mentioned the fact that the rule has been there for a long time, just never enforced. They just leave it hanging that these refs used "bad judgement" enforcing the rule in this game.

Are we twiddling our thumbs and looking for hot moms in the stands during warm-ups?

Every prior game allowed for at least one observant, engaged, rules aware official, who should know the uniform rules, to bring this to the attention of the coach and point him in the direction of a legit solution.

It would be incumbent on the coach to pursue the proper waiver instead of peddling the old chestnut, "It was never mentioned all season".

Disgraceful reactions on so many different levels....

Did anyone ask Maryland why they were throwing their officials under the bus?

Diversity training? Really?

https://twitter.com/MPSSAA_Org

Yes, it was insensitive for them to apply the rule.

Seems to me that it would be insensitive to the wearer to allow the wrap to be worn, because that loose fitting, flowing scarf around her head, neck and onto her shoulders in the Wash Post article looks like the cause of an accident waiting to happen. And, it probably wouldn't end so well for the wearer. Maybe not so well for the defender that gets their hand caught up in it, either.

https://img.washingtonpost.com/rf/im...EeeT3AD5vddO0Q

I guess they'll have to stop calling fouls and violations. Wouldn't want anyone to be offended.

Not these days you don't want to. You could get terrible, terrible tweets about you.

I have to agree with Camron Rust. As an evaluator during the state championships I would have marked down the crew without addressing the issue. WA state plays multiple sites and has a state representative during the state championship games that would make a decision on this situation before the game started. It would then be out of the hands of the crew. If you don't follow the rule book and an injury occurs from the hijab during play it puts the crew in a situation where they could be included in a lawsuit. I've heard of instances where the crew was included in lawsuits because they didn't follow the rule book. Don't put your crew in this situation.

Can't they just say "other refs didn't enforce the rule" as their defense though?

Sure, if they want to lose.

I guess the sky is falling. Seriously, if our liability was so high then we would be seeing tort claims against officials more common and organized youth sports would cease to exist. Do lawsuits happen? Yes, it happens (after reading your post I did some research). After doing a little research, I would still let this kid play.

I think it is silly to use the threat of a lawsuit here. I mean, I would hate to see a coach out of his box all night long and we ignore it and a kid hits him and get injured. I cannot imagine a serious injury happening as a result of this kid wearing the hijab in the picture that would be more serious than a kid hitting a coach standing on the floor while running full speed. I know - strawman but give me a break. Lawsuit = joke.

Those who would let this player in the game in violation of a rule are not likely advance in their careers AND are setting themselves up for problems.

Now that's a bit dramatic. There are plenty of times we see the uniform rule(s) not applied and those officials, at all levels, seem to do just fine. It all depends on your assignors to be honest. Most don't make such a huge deal over these types of issues. However if they want a reason to cut you you essentially give them a freebie.

I agree. If you call a great game then this would not even be a speed bump. On the other spectrum, if an assignor didn't care for you, something like this could effect your assignments or lack thereof.

It's surely not the only factor.

But consider that this is a playoff game. You're not just working this for your assignor, but for other potential assignors as well, assignors that work higher levels.

Not really.

At the JV level you see V guys do games where they let this go and you say, "man if I did that game I wouldn't let that happen. Why do they keep getting these games?" At the V level you see JC/D3 guys do games and let this go and say "man if I did that game I wouldn't let that happen. Why do they keep getting these games?" This goes on and on, and the pure fact is NO ONE CARES. IF you can ref the game, manage the coach and the game, and the COACHES trust you YOU DO THE GAMES. The assignor has some power, but if all the coaches get to list 10 guys that they would want working the final four and all the coaches put the same 10-15 guys on that list. GUESS WHAT? The guys working those games will be FROM THAT LIST.

So you can keep thinking that the uniform rule will hold you back, but it wont. It will just be a half ass excuse or reason you are given to (1) not advance or (2) not work any more for an assignor.