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-   Basketball (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/)
-   -   Players: flip tucking their shorts for comfort (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/102117-players-flip-tucking-their-shorts-comfort.html)

Camron Rust Tue Jan 17, 2017 04:47pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref (Post 997602)
*Players do it [and so would I if I were having to play in saggy/baggy shorts] for the sake of comfort and less restrictive movement of leg flexion; based on this I will continue to allow it and instruct them to tuck those drawstrings in----though much to the chagrin of my partners who may feel otherwise.
It may be for comfort, but I doubt anyone is doing it because they're restrictive.

grunewar Wed Jan 18, 2017 05:15am
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 997615)
I've had to address this in almost every single game I've had this year....
Same for me. I've even had to talk to coaches, before the game when their team has a good many dressed like that. They flip their shirts over their shorts, tucked-in, and hope you don't see it. I don't see this going away any time soon. :(

BillyMac Wed Jan 18, 2017 07:23am
Flipped Over ???
 
This is a total non-issue for both players and officials in Connecticut. I hope that it stays that way.

so cal lurker Wed Jan 18, 2017 08:52am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 997626)
What is to disagree with....did you manufacturer intend for them to be worn with the waistband rolled? No. It isn't that ambiguous. Now, some states may have decided that the rule has gone farther than they think is necessary, but to claim that rolling is being worn as intended is not really supportable.
Some of those inside logos suggest the manufacturer does intend them to be rolled . . .

junruh07 Wed Jan 18, 2017 10:57am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref (Post 997588)
ahh ok bsed on the thread contents you linked to, so it is an issue of preference [by the states but not by the NF]. I have not seen any directive for this from Kansas.
Check the weekly newsletters that KSHSAA puts on their website for basketball. I am sure it is addressed there. I have received at least 5 emails about this issue from the state and my assigners. They have made it abundantly clear to us (at least in my area) that we are not to allow this. I can see the drawstring being a safety concern, and the them not wanting the extra logos showing. If players roll them to the inside instead of the outside, everyone I have worked with (and me) has been allowing this.

VaTerp Wed Jan 18, 2017 11:23am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 997626)
What is to disagree with....did you manufacturer intend for them to be worn with the waistband rolled? No. It isn't that ambiguous. Now, some states may have decided that the rule has gone farther than they think is necessary, but to claim that rolling is being worn as intended is not really supportable.
I disagree that this is an issue officials should be concerned with in 1st place and I disagree with the interp b/c I'm not gonna presume that the manufacturer didnt intend for a waistband to be rolled.

BTW here is a link from 2 seaons ago talking about the trend primarily in NCAAM. Its funny how styles have changed and kids actually want shorter shorts now. When I was in HS in the mid 90s we did everything we could to get our shorts longer. Some also cite fit/comfort/performance as a well but its clearly a trend. And one that IMO is a waste of time and energy for officials to be concerned with.

Rolling waistbands a new trend in basketball fashion

Welpe Wed Jan 18, 2017 12:43pm
I've seen it quite a bit this year. I'm not going to address it unless we're directed to.

AremRed Wed Jan 18, 2017 01:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by so cal lurker (Post 997678)
Some of those inside logos suggest the manufacturer does intend them to be rolled . . .
Yeah! There is a reason the logos read right-side-up even when flipped, hmmm...

Camron Rust Wed Jan 18, 2017 01:42pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by so cal lurker (Post 997678)
Some of those inside logos suggest the manufacturer does intend them to be rolled . . .
Your Fruit-of-the-Looms have a logo on the label too, do you wear those on the outside?

Camron Rust Wed Jan 18, 2017 01:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed (Post 997735)
Yeah! There is a reason the logos read right-side-up even when flipped, hmmm...
That would likely give it too many logos visible making it illegal in another way.

And it is is more likely so that the wearer sees the logo everytime he pulls the shorts up.

Raymond Wed Jan 18, 2017 08:01pm
I address it when the string is hanging.

Had a college supervisor last season who wasn't happy that one of his officials was overly concerned with this.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk

Adam Thu Jan 19, 2017 11:27am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Welpe (Post 997722)
I've seen it quite a bit this year. I'm not going to address it unless we're directed to.
Yep, and I wouldn't ask about it either. It's like asking for homework.

#olderthanilook Thu Jan 19, 2017 12:26pm
This has been specifically addressed in all KS area meetings since 2015 when this trend began being noticed throughout the state.

If you don't attend Area Meetings, I would highly recommend it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref (Post 997586)
Does anyone know if there are any NFHS restrictions on players flipping their shorts under at the waistband in order to improve the fit from saggy? Anything in the NF "uniform policy" about this?
Reason I ask is because I worked a game wherein partner and I were watching teams warm up and he was against allowing them to do it; however, I said it did not matter to me--I saw nothing inappropriate by it. Looking closely at the player's shorts they did have one manufacturer's logo imprinted on the flipped out side and some strings dangling [something like a "Champions" or "Russell" wording--which is normal right?.
I only suggested to just tuck those draw strings inside for safety and OK to play with shorts flip-tucked. My partner held that this was not allowed--claiming that the new uniform policy forbade such. Again, we disagreed and I did not enforce it. Anyone know for sure if there is such a restriction? Or am I just choosing to kick this policy/rule? Or is this yet another example of referees making up things to suit their preferences?

Scuba_ref Thu Jan 19, 2017 03:14pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 997600)
We've been instructed that rolling in or rolling out is not permitted.

That said, I don't get the fascination with rolling...why don't the players just tie the drawstrings?
Camron, you are in WA State, right? That is an incorrect ruling. Per the State Rules Interpreter, rolling the waist band is not illegal.

#olderthanilook Thu Jan 19, 2017 05:04pm
I found this in the NFHS rule book, fwiw:

3.5.5

ART. 5

Equipment which is unnatural and/or designed to increase a team member’s height or vertical reach or to gain a competitive advantage shall not be permitted. Equipment and apparel shall not be modified from the original manufactured state and shall be worn in the manner the manufacturer intended it to be worn


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