Using the body to control the dribble
 

I have been watching more game film then ever as I have moved up the ladder. I am noticing a lot of bad dribblers start to lose the ball and the ball contacts their legs and it helps them maintain the dribble. Yet there is no violation called. Is that because it is legal or no one likes to call it? I would like to hear some opinions.

Thanks in advance

What specific act are you asking is illegal and which violation do you think should apply?

Intentional striking of the ball with leg is a violation. Unintentional is nothing.

I try to go around my back and my hip gets in the way and helps me control the dribble so I can maintain it.

I am dribbling between my legs and start to lose it use my leg to push it back to my left hand to continue the dribble.

I am looking through the book to find something on this. I know people have called an illegal dribble when using hips, thighs, etc to help dribble or control the ball. Cant remember why this is sometimes called and sometimes not. That is why I wanted to start this discussion.

Basically Deecee we will have to judge if they moved their leg to help them keep control or not and unless you are sure you just leave it alone?

What you are describing, I see mostly as a player losing the ball. Not sure there is a reason to call an illegal dribble or any violation.

Peace

I have to say i havnt seen anything like this. ive seen guys try to go around back and hip gets in way. if ball gets stuck on hip the dribble is ended. if ball gets away after that they have to pick it up. i just dont see players using their hips and legs on purpose when dribbling.

I agree. But, I had a discussion with a partner about this a week ago who said she saw a player pin the ball (clumsily) to her leg. I told her I didn't see it, but to me, via her description, it sounded like the dribble had ended. From there, it's possible she could travel (illegal), simply stop moving (pivot foot established and no travel = legal), or fumble.

I wouldn't overthink this. Ask yourself, "did the dribble end?" and go from there.

That's one possible violation (and no one ever really uses the leg intentionally as you describe).

Another might be that the dribble has ended and a second dribble has restarted. What parts of "dribble ending" do you think might apply?

All I am saying is usually when the ball goes off their body, they lose control of the ball on some level. And if that is the case, I am not considering that an illegal dribble, but probably and interrupted one. The rule about an ended dribble is not about just touching your body, but what you are doing with your hands as it relates to the ball. If your hand did not stop the ball, I have a hard time calling a violation for that action and calling an illegal dribble. I think this honestly is trying to find something wrong when nothing really is wrong.

Peace

When I was playing back in the early 80's, I recall it being called double dribble because the leg or hip was a second touch between bounces -- for those who've been around since Naismith, was that ever the right call?

This is the other possible violation. There is a rule prohibiting a dribbler from touching the ball twice between bounces. Rare call, but illegal dribble is the violation. Is the intent of this rule to apply to the ball deflecting off the leg or body though? Seems that a double touch with the hands is what the rule is designed to prevent.

Would we have a kicking violation if we deem the contact with the leg to be on purpose?

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why wouldn't we?

Ok. Then what's the question in this thread? Seems to me that if the ball accidentally hits the dribbler's leg it's a fumble, therefore the player can only pick up the ball and pass or shoot from there. Or I guess they can stand there and risk a choice serving violation.

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Sorry... Auto correct. I meant he can risk a five second violation.

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It may be an interrupted dribble, but it's definitely not a fumble.
Go review your definitions.

Fair enough.

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Reference? I don't have my books handy, but I don't recall that.

I believe he is referring to 15.2 "During a dribble the ball may be batted into the air provided it is permitted to strike the floor before the ball is touched again with the hand(s)"

That obviously can't apply to the hip/leg, however.

What ruleset are you pulling rule 15.2 from? My rulebook stops at rule 10.

picky, picky, you want the RULE number as well as the section and article? :eek: Rule 4, definitions. 4.15.2. (See, this is what happens when a non-ref tries to use the rule book -- and y'all want coaches to do that :D)

Not necessarily.

it is a violation for intentionally striking the ball with the leg. If the player throws the ball off of his own leg that isn't striking it with the leg any more than it is when a player throws the ball off of another player's leg.

I call this maybe once a season. On a crossover or behind the back move sometimes a player will get it stuck on their shirt/leg/back etc. If the ball comes to a stop and they try to dribble again I'm blowing my whistle.

I did say it was done "on purpose", which is another way of saying "intentionally".

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No. That isn't the distinction I'm making.

Did the player strike the ball with the leg on purpose or did the player throw the ball onto the leg on purpose. That makes all the difference.