Bailed out by a Class Manager
 

This is one of those situations that I hate to bring up as I have to admit that I screwed up !!! I do however feel that I can learn from this, and am looking for suggestions on how to deal with this situation.

2 person crew, I have the dish. We have sun coming in from over the left field fence. Fly ball hit to the right of the left fielder (towards the LF foul line) who dives for a catch. It appears to me that the ball bounces, but I can honestly say I didn't get a good look at it as I was looking towards the sun. I look at my partner and he isn't giving me anything as he's watching the batter-runner touch first and go towards second. Since I haven't called an out, the batter continues on to second base where he ends up after the ball comes back to the infield.

Time is called and the visiting team coach comes out to talk to me (to his credit, very calmly and professionally) and asks what I had on that play. I told him that it appeared to me that the ball skipped but agreed to check with my partner as the sun was a factor and I wasn't 100% sure. My partner was unable to help and I was prepared to go with my call when the other coach comes in to tell me that the ball was caught. This was a great game and he didn't want to win this way. I called the out, no one complained and I promised the coach (only half jokingly) that I'd send him flowers !!! :D:D:D

I learned two things from this play.
1) Get your sometimes lazy arse out further than a couple of steps behind the plate on flyballs.
2) This is a situation we don't think about and should make sure we pregame with our partners.

How do you deal with potential sunfields, and would you have handled this play the same way that I did ??

Partner, I need your eyes!
 

Anytime there is a problem similar to this, sun, tree limbs, foul/fair polls, I request during pregame to have all eyes on the batted ball. Touching bases is secondary to foul/fair and catch/no catch calls. I tell my partners I need their eyes.
You handled it as best you could after the fact. In a 2 person crew a lot of calls are tough and some are even missed. It is great that you had a coach that understood your predicament.

Spirit works in mysterious ways! :D

Robert:

While I feel your pain. If I am your BU, I am going to watch the B/R because as sure as the sun rises in the East and sets in the West, the first time I don't do my job I am going to have an appeal play and I won't have the information I need to do my job correctly. And if I am the PU and you are my BU and you don't know if the B/R touched 1B, you and I will be having a private conversation.

MTD, Sr.

Signal safe.

This is something we pregame -- there are times when both sets of eyes should be on the ball. The catch / no-catch in a screwy situation like this takes priority over a base that's going to be touched 99% of the time.

So there are at least two associations out there that need retraining.

Shrug.

I've received and given more than enough training over the years. I know my responsibilities and also know when there's more important things to do than stare at a base.

But it's clear there's at least two umpires here who needs to learn that 2-man is a series of compromises and sometimes there's more important things than looking at a touch of a base.

I learned on a similar play on the third base foul line that polarized sun glasses are a great help.

Pretty sure I've forgotten more about two-man than you'll ever know, since you don't seem to know that the touch of the base isn't the only thing on BU's plate on this. And in this case, BU doesn't have anything to offer PU. If there's a foul pole involved, maybe. And you'll get eaten alive by a knowledgeable coach if you try this bullshit.

What do you do when 3 runners are on base and a ball hit in the gap? You cannot possibly watch each runner touch each base. I am suggesting you glance at the catch/no catch foul/fair or tree limb clip and then return to your normal duties as base umpire. 2-man is tough enough without one partner basically sticking his head in the sand.

Oh, boy, are you about to throw about your resume?

Eaten alive? There isn't a single coach at the HS or college levels I work that can do that. I hold all the cards and can make them leave, after all.

Back to the non-bluster part of this. The OP said he was having trouble with the sun. That's not a usual occurrence but also something that does happen from time to time. The odds of obstruction rounding first or a missed touch is minimal and if the plate umpire is struggling to see, I'm going to try to have an opinion.

There are times when we can't get a touch of first when we rule catch / no catch on a ball in the BUs area in normal play. Fielder dives in CF as the BR is rounding first. We don't clutch at pearls over that scenario.


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I think all would agree that baseball training indicates the importance of calls and touching a base is way down the list compared to fair/foul, catch/no catch. As a team, umpires are responsible to get the call right, not tell the coach, "He was watching the runner touch 1st" or "My partner is no help".

Correct me if I'm wrong here, but if we've pregamed this situation and I see the base umpire is following the ball, wouldn't I be at least taking a glance at the runner to see if the batter-runner had touched first ?? Obviously, I can't do this instead of taking the catch, but couldn't I be of potential help here if there was an appeal ??

Want me to tell you what happened with a pro manager? I had the touch of first. I had no help for my partner. Yet he came to me and overturned the call from foul to a home run. The DC then appealed first, thinking that I provided the info to overturn. Shitstorm ensues.

Situation: Bottom of the 7th inning, two outs, the Home team is down by 2 runs, with runners on 2B and 3B. B5 rips a sinking line drive to left field with the setting sun behind F7 and F7 dives for the ball. B5 is running hard and misses 1B on his way to 2B. The PU steps back into his holding position behind HP and so that he can see a possible catch/no-catch as well as R1 on 3B touch HP. PU is able to see that F7 trapped the ball; but the BU and PU have pre-gamed that the BU will also help in a situation as this. Not only does R1 score but so does R2 apparently winning the game. F3 calls to F7 for the ball and signals to the BU that he is appealing B5 missing 1B. What does the BU do? He didn't do his job of watching to see if B5 did or did not touch 1B because he was doing something he was not supposed to be doing, watching to see of F7 did or did not catch B5's sinking line drive. How does the BU handle this situation? I would not want to be this BU. We all want to get the call correct but doing our job correctly is the first step in getting the call correct.

MTD, Sr.

You have to be quick or dead! Leo D.
 

No player is that fast, to get to 1st at the same time as a sinking liner in front of F7. U2 would be in B or C position (depending upon where and when you were trained) and be able to watch the trap and still be able to get a good look at the touch at 1st and third. Problem solved.

Now your turn.
 

Mark,

Top of the last, 2 outs, home up by one, R3. Grounder to F6's right and throw pulls F3 up the line and the swipe by F3 is close on BR. Do you watch R3 touch home or help your partner on the tag/no tag down the first base line.
I tossed Coach Mikulik for the Asheville Tourists (A Ball Sally League) at Greenville Drive a week before his famous meltdown on this play when my partner told me he was watching R3 touch home and had nothing for me at first.

I will offer the suggestion you asked for instead of micro-analyze who should do what on the play.

Your lesson learned #1 is spot on, get up the line, shield your eyes with your hands from the sun and make the call. If I were the BU in this situation I probably would not be much help, although I will give you what I have and it only takes a second to watch BR touch 1b.

As for #2, you can't pregame every possibility, unless you know beforehand at this field that the sun is not a problem until 7th inning on the LF line.

What I don't understand here is how you can ask all players to step out of their mechanics when you need help. Certainly they can not know when you can or can not see something clearly.

The poster clearly implied that had he hustled more from behind the plate, he probably would have been able to make the correct call. At what point and how, do you communicate to your partner that you can't see something, so please adjust your mechanics so you can cover my butt? Is your partner supposed to help you out the whole game, or just when he receives the signal by osmosis that your eyes are blinded?

Listen, shit happens on the field especially in a two man system. Get out there and hustle and take care of your responsibilities. If by chance you can assist you partner, fine but make sure you get your job done correctly first. If you can't see a clear out then it is NOT an out.

I had a game where the ball was hit directly into the sun and when I next saw it, it was at the base of the outfield fence. My partner was watching the touch at first. OC said the ball hit the pole outside the field and bounced back. The runner made it to second and that's were he stayed until the next batter drove him in.

If life was perfect, they wouldn't need umpires!

Good for you. Your partner did his job, and you did yours.

Exactly. Mechanics are like policy--deviate from them at your own risk. I just would love to see the fireworks when BU misses F3 cold-cocking R1 (or even just obstruction or a missed base) because he's digging in PU's garden. At least if PU misses the call, you both were doing what you were supposed to be. If you miss your call, you weren't.

Moderator note:

Play nice and act like professionals.

The post seems to indicate that the BU was in A position at the start of the at bat. I really don't know how much help he would be able to provide even if he was staring the play down. The fielder would have blocked his view and it appears to me that the BU would have had a bit of a sun issue also.

Get out from behind the plate. Make the best call you can make. Do your job, don't rely on some one with their own responsibilities and possibly an even worse view than you had.


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