Appeals question
 

I'm a Cal Ripken 9-12 coach. My first post here so I apologize if this has been covered.

In a recent game I felt a runner left early from 3B on a caught fly ball. After play ended and ball returned to my pitcher I called time so my pitcher couldn't throw a pitch and instructed my third baseman to go to bag and for my pitcher to throw it to him for the appeal. The umpire told me I could not appeal because my calling timeout to tell my kids how to do it killed the appeal. He said once a TO was called no appeal could be made. I've searched the rule book but can't find any confirmation. Would appreciate being pointed to the section that states this if it is the rule. Thanks in advance.

You don't need to call time out in this case. Just throw the ball back into 3rd base and make the appeal. By calling time out, you didn't kill the appeal, per se. You just have to make sure the ball is put back into play, and have your pitcher step off the rubber legally and make a proper appeal.

Thank you sir. That's what I thought as well. I knew it wasn't required to call a timeout but I had an inexperienced pitcher and 3B and wanted to make sure they knew what to do. Appreciate the help.

When I coached, it was something I practiced regularly. Outs are valuable.

The ball must be live for an appeal, but the pitcher does not have to step off.

If that were the case, an offensive coach would request Time after every play where a runner takes two or more bases on a hit, and on every tag-up on a fly ball.

You'd be surprised how many HS coaches still go through this dance, even though they can make a verbal appeal.

Including the "calling time" part -- I usually just ask, "Hey -- what are you trying to do?" and then rule on the appeal when they answer the question. ;)

I hade a coach last night go through all of this foolishness. I walked over to him at the end of the inning and asked that he just make a verbal appeal. He said he didn't know he could do that.

Well I learned something new. Didn't know you could make a verbal appeal and not throw to the base. Thanks everyone.

Depends on your rule set. Fed, aka NFHS High School, rules allow a dead or live ball appeal by a coach or player with or without possession of the ball.

Last I saw Cal Ripken rules, it was OBR (Official Baseball Rules). The ball must be live and there are no verbal appeals by the coaches.

In your ruleset you would have to make the play.

Rita

Are you sure?

Really?

Play: R2 at 2nd base. Routine base hit into the outfield that scores R2. BR stops at 1st. The defense wants to appeal that R2 missed 3rd base. The ball is still live. Although they can throw the ball directly to 3rd, the pitcher steps onto the rubber then, comes set then, without stepping off, he throws directly to 3rd base.

Would that not be considered a balk for throwing to an unoccupied base?

A pitcher can throw to an unoccupied base for the purposes of making "a play". I have always been taught that an appeal is not "a play", however.

If all I've said above is true (and I'm not 100% sure it is) - then, it would seem, that the pitcher does have to step off or be liable for a balk; at least when it involves throwing directly from the rubber to an unoccupied base.

OBR 8.05(d) - If there is a runner, or runners, it is a balk when the pitcher, while touching his plate, throws, or feints a throw to an unoccupied base, except for the purpose of making a play.

Why would an appeal not be a play?

OK, let's say an appeal is "a play".

PLAY: R1 & R2 at 1st and 2nd. Batter hits a base clearing triple. The defense believes that R1 missed 2nd and that R2 missed 3rd. They throw the ball to 2nd, tag the bag, and claim that R1 missed 2nd. Then, they throw the ball to 3rd and claim that R2 missed 3rd.

Should the umpire disallow the second appeal (at 3rd) because there was an intervening play - one of the criteria for disallowing an appeal? It would seem that would be the case if an appeal was considered "a play".

OK, I see your point now. And I do see the apparent inconsistency with the word play.

Quite.

Quite what? You can make an appeal to an unoccupied base while still in contact with the rubber? Please clarify. :confused:

If it will make Bob feel better, consider the NCAA rule 8-6b(10): It is not a balk for a pitcher, while in contact with the rubber (does not step back), to throw to an unoccupied base for the purpose of making an appeal play.

For OBR, consider 8.05 Comment: Umpires should bear in mind that the purpose of the balk rule is to prevent the pitcher from deliberately deceiving the base runner. If there is doubt in the umpire’s mind, the “intent” of the pitcher should govern.

I think that nearly always all the players recognize an appeal which is being made from the mound.

An appeal is a play.

It's "not considered" ONLY for the purpose of making multiple appeals. It's really that simple.

I will grant that technically, it is NOT a balk if the pitcher throws to a base for the purpose of making an appeal play. However, if the pitcher does not step directly to the base, or otherwise balks, a balk is considered a play and the appeal will be nullified.

So, to be safe, I recommend that a pitcher step back off the rubber prior to making a throw to a base for an appeal.

Forget the deceit part. It's a stupid statement anyhow because the pitcher deceives the runner on purpose to get him leaning. It just has to be done without breaking the balk rules.

MLBUM: It is NOT a balk for the pitcher, while in contact with the rubber, to throw to an unoccupied base IF it is for the purpose of making an appeal play. (Note that the pitcher does not have to step back off the rubber to make an appeal play.) The emphasis is in the book.

Why is it so tough for people to simply let go of the fact that you can throw to an unoccupied base for the purpose of making a play or making an appeal?

It baffles me. Open the rule book. Is it lying?

Well, not this time. ;)

Most of the balks I call during appeals are committed when the pitcher tries to step off prior to throwing to the base. They're always making movements committing them to pitch before they throw over. If they'd just throw to the base when an infielder has the ball instead of going through all the gyrations they do with calling time, taking the rubber, and stepping off they'd be way better off.

I agree with your last sentence but I've never seen a pitcher commit to home before stepping off when he knows he's going to throw to a base for an appeal.