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-   -   Worst umpiring crew in baseball... (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/92033-worst-umpiring-crew-baseball.html)

tmagan Sun Jul 15, 2012 02:26pm

Worst umpiring crew in baseball...
 
Dale Scott's crew with Bill Miller, Dan Iassogna and CB Bucknor. From the triple play debacle from the Padres/Dodgers game, to Dale Scott's missed call in the Braves game yesterday to CB Bucknor's changing strike zone today, this is the worst crew in baseball, can't go a day without trouble.

tmagan Sun Jul 15, 2012 03:03pm

CB Bucknor also called time, after Santana started his windup because Michael Bourn stepped out of the batters box.

In addition, after I started this thread, Dan Iassogna called a fly ball in left field fair even though it landed in foul territory.

Adam Sun Jul 15, 2012 03:17pm

I would like to thank you in advance for the entertaining thread that is about to commence.

MrUmpire Sun Jul 15, 2012 03:24pm

I just made some popcorn.

grunewar Sun Jul 15, 2012 03:25pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 849055)
I would like to thank you in advance for the entertaining thread that is about to commence.

Leave him alone Snaqs. Obviously, he works for MLB and has the experience to make a bold statement such as this. I expect suspensions Monday and look forward to his press conference.

APG Sun Jul 15, 2012 04:36pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 849055)
I would like to thank you in advance for the entertaining thread that is about to commence.

This is the same person that suggested that Marc Davis should be suspended for the rest of the playoffs...and potentially fired...due to a questionable technical.

JugglingReferee Sun Jul 15, 2012 08:02pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer (Post 849060)
This is the same person that suggested that Marc Davis should be suspended for the rest of the playoffs...and potentially fired...due to a questionable technical.

Great memory!

Adam Sun Jul 15, 2012 09:33pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer (Post 849060)
This is the same person that suggested that Marc Davis should be suspended for the rest of the playoffs...and potentially fired...due to a questionable technical.

Yeah, I saw that when I thought I recognized his name and checked on his posting history. I stand by all the negative responses I may have written or considered at the time.

Welpe Sun Jul 15, 2012 09:45pm

http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net...11264_700b.jpg

tmagan Mon Jul 16, 2012 09:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer (Post 849060)
This is the same person that suggested that Marc Davis should be suspended for the rest of the playoffs...and potentially fired...due to a questionable technical.

Notice he didn't make the Finals even though he did the year before.

APG Mon Jul 16, 2012 09:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmagan (Post 849250)
Notice he didn't make the Finals even though he did the year before.

Still worked in the conference finals...a far cry from you declaring he should be suspended for the rest of the playoffs.

JRutledge Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:13pm

And he will be in the league next year I am sure as well.

I have a question about CB calling time. How do you know how or why he called time? Just because someone starts their motion does not mean that the play was not already dead.

Peace

Adam Tue Jul 17, 2012 02:17am

I do believe my theory holds.

And what's the opposite of a jock sniffer?

RPatrino Tue Jul 17, 2012 12:53pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 849264)
I do believe my theory holds.

And what's the opposite of a jock sniffer?

A sock jniffer?

Adam Tue Jul 17, 2012 12:57pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by RPatrino (Post 849324)
A sock jniffer?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to see the pic for that one.

ozzy6900 Tue Jul 17, 2012 03:52pm

Jock Sniffer addiction!




https://encrypted-tbn0.google.com/im...CmTpZdTepmbNc5

JRutledge Tue Jul 17, 2012 04:15pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells (Post 849325)
Yeah, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't want to see the pic for that one.

You just had to talk that up. :D

Peace

UMP25 Wed Jul 18, 2012 01:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmagan (Post 849054)
CB Bucknor also called time, after Santana started his windup because Michael Bourn stepped out of the batters box.

In addition, after I started this thread, Dan Iassogna called a fly ball in left field fair even though it landed in foul territory.

Hawk Harrelson, is that you???

mrm21711 Thu Jul 19, 2012 06:39pm

http://www.shinyshiny.tv/troll.jpg

Lets stop feeding em.......

Umpmazza Thu Jul 26, 2012 09:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmagan (Post 849051)
Dale Scott's crew with Bill Miller, Dan Iassogna and CB Bucknor. From the triple play debacle from the Padres/Dodgers game, to Dale Scott's missed call in the Braves game yesterday to CB Bucknor's changing strike zone today, this is the worst crew in baseball, can't go a day without trouble.

I wish i lived really close to you, so I could come and see you umpire, and count the missed calls you had.... then I could come on here and blast you...

WOW dale had a very close play on a catch no catch.. I guess you have never missed a call before.. what level of ball do you work?

Carl Childress Thu Jul 26, 2012 11:11am

Take it easy, guys
 
Criticism of umpires is a staple of the Internet message boards. We all make mistakes. The mistakes of the MLUs are simply magnified.

Denkinger's call at first in the World Series, 1985. Three admitted bad calls by Tim McClelland: forcing the Dodgers to replace the pitcher early when the acting manager made a second trip to the mound after a warning; his double miss in Game 4 of the 2009 ALCS. Remember his press conference: "In my heart, I thought he was out." Jim Joyce?

I don't know the history of the man who started this thread. But I've said in print that Angel Hernandez is the worst umpire in the Major Leagues. (The players and managers think Jim Joyce is the best - still.)

But what do I know? I like Cowboy Joe West.

PLUG: My new book is on sale at Amazon. (grin)

UMP25 Thu Jul 26, 2012 01:57pm

MLB Umpires are humans. Consequently, they make mistakes. Case in point: I was at Tuesday's (July 24) White Sox game. In the middle of the game with no outs and the bases empty, a sinking fly ball was hit to the right fielder's left. He came running diagonally toward the right field line, diving to make the catch. On this play, both U1 and U2 went out on it! That's right--TWO MLB Umpires went out on a fly ball when only one should have. In this case, it was clearly U1's call.

What made it worse was that each umpire made the opposite call. U2, who had the worse of the two angles, called it an out, while U1 ruled it safe (in an admittedly weak signal, too). Well, all 4 umpires huddled in the middle of the infield for about a minute, and the came out of the meeting ruling it an out. This was an obvious screw-up all around. My friend with whom I went to the game, a fellow umpire, looked at me and asked, "What just happened?" I told him, "We just saw MLB Umpires messing up. They're just as human as we are."

BTW, replays showed that the ball had clearly hit the ground before F9 gloved it. It was a trap. U1's original call was, in fact, the correct one. I don't know what those guys said in their brief huddle, but U2 was definitely not in the best angle for making that call. As a Sox fan, I could have been pissed, but I wasn't, because I realize even MLB Umps make mistakes, despite the fact that some here think they never do. ;)

Carl Childress Fri Jul 27, 2012 08:38am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 849986)
MLB Umpires are humans. Consequently, they make mistakes. Case in point: I was at Tuesday's (July 24) White Sox game. In the middle of the game with no outs and the bases empty, a sinking fly ball was hit to the right fielder's left. He came running diagonally toward the right field line, diving to make the catch. On this play, both U1 and U2 went out on it! That's right--TWO MLB Umpires went out on a fly ball when only one should have. In this case, it was clearly U1's call.

What made it worse was that each umpire made the opposite call. U2, who had the worse of the two angles, called it an out, while U1 ruled it safe (in an admittedly weak signal, too). Well, all 4 umpires huddled in the middle of the infield for about a minute, and the came out of the meeting ruling it an out. This was an obvious screw-up all around. My friend with whom I went to the game, a fellow umpire, looked at me and asked, "What just happened?" I told him, "We just saw MLB Umpires messing up. They're just as human as we are."

BTW, replays showed that the ball had clearly hit the ground before F9 gloved it. It was a trap. U1's original call was, in fact, the correct one. I don't know what those guys said in their brief huddle, but U2 was definitely not in the best angle for making that call. As a Sox fan, I could have been pissed, but I wasn't, because I realize even MLB Umps make mistakes, despite the fact that some here think they never do. ;)

I can illustrate why they accepted U2's call by quoting from MY NEW BOOK, 151 Ways to Ruin a Baseball Game.

One of the ugliest photographs ever taken of umpires in action shows one umpire making one call while another umpire is making the opposite call. Two calls on one play. Our golden knights in shining armor were John Kibler calling “out” and the former supervisor of umpires for the National League, Ed Vargo, calling “safe.” Those guys make my partner and me look like pikers who were just pretending to be incompetent.

When I spoke to John about his play in September 2000, he told me he had a painting of “part” of the picture in his living room. “Carl,” he said, laughing, “the artist cut Eddie out.”

Play 54: Bill Sudakis (Dodgers) lifts a little Texas leaguer behind the shortstop. F6 chases the ball, the second baseman chases the ball, and John Kibler, the second-base umpire, chases the play. The pop fly falls safely, and Sudakis continues unchecked around first. Third baseman Mike Shannon (Cardinals) realizes nobody is covering second, so he figures he’d better guard the base. It’s a foot race between Shannon and Sudakis.

Kibler looks up and sees nobody in blue at second. Major league mechanics were clear: When the second-base umpire stays out, the first-base umpire goes with the batter-runner to second. Suddenly Vargo wakes up, and realizes he’s still at first. Now there’s a second foot race, this one between Kibler and Vargo though neither realizes the other is under way. Four grown men will wind up, breathing hard, at one bag. A photographer snaps their picture, and their places in baseball legend are secure.

Manager Walter Alston confronts Al Barlick, the plate umpire. “What do we do now, Al? I don’t know who to cuss.”
Ruling for Play 54: Barlick says: “Walter, it’s John’s base, and we’re going with his call.” Though Alston lost the decision, John told me Walter left the field without an argument.


In your play: Using MLU mechanics, it's U2's call unless F9 is charging toward the foul line. The crew thought: U2 is already out, and game personnel are accustomed to seeing him make most calls in the outfield. You yourself said U1's signal was "tentative." Clearly they knew they were screwed, so, like Barlick, they said: "It's U2's field, so ...."

CT1 Fri Jul 27, 2012 09:26am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Childress (Post 850063)
In your play: Using MLU mechanics, it's U2's call unless F9 is charging toward the foul line.

Which he evidently was:

Quote:

He came running diagonally toward the right field line, diving to make the catch.

mbyron Fri Jul 27, 2012 09:33am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Childress (Post 850063)
In your play: Using MLU mechanics, it's U2's call unless F9 is charging toward the foul line. The crew thought: U2 is already out, and game personnel are accustomed to seeing him make most calls in the outfield. You yourself said U1's signal was "tentative." Clearly they knew they were screwed, so, like Barlick, they said: "It's U2's field, so ...."

As CT1 has pointed out, this is U1's call. I expect that U2 sold his call better both on the field and in the powwow, and that's what they went with. :shrug:

Also, that way they get an out. ;)

D Ray Fri Jul 27, 2012 01:31pm

Here is a link to a nice write up after Mr Kibler's passing and the photo that Papa C referenced.

Midwest Ump: John Kibler NL Umpire (1928-2010)

UMP25 Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:46am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 850076)
As CT1 has pointed out, this is U1's call. I expect that U2 sold his call better both on the field and in the powwow, and that's what they went with. :shrug:

Also, that way they get an out. ;)

Actually, neither umpire sold his call. Both looked rather timid.


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