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UMP25 Tue Jun 12, 2012 02:34pm

Umpires accosted off the field following Midwest Collegiate League Game
 
Permit me to preface this post by stating that I am not here to bash the league or its commissioner or even my friend who is the assignor. I'm simply sharing an incident with y'all that occurred after a game I worked last night in Sycamore, IL. (a town that borders DeKalb, home of NIU). In 35 years of umpiring and 21 at the NCAA/college level, I have never experienced anything like what transpired last night.

Rather than rehash everything here, I've uploaded to dropbox the umpire report that I submitted late last night/early this morning. (It was too large to upload to the forum.)

Click here to view it.

Feel free to peruse it and opine here--not about the report; rather, your thoughts on the entire situation. Again, I'm not here to bash the league or its commissioner, or even demand that they do this or that. It's in their hands, and we umpires in the league are simply waiting to see what happens.

MD Longhorn Tue Jun 12, 2012 02:52pm

I would hope that if I were in the same situation, I would not respond with "You're going to put 15 runs on me" ... but fully admit that it would have been mighty difficult to not say a word given that much provocation.

Most games around here have off-duty personnel that likely would have gotten involved much earlier in this situation, which might have diffused it.

UMP25 Tue Jun 12, 2012 02:54pm

Considering Mike asked it in the form of a rhetorical question, it was really a very minor thing, if that. After all, human instincts can sometimes cause us to say something we really shouldn't have said.

Because of the manner in which it happened, there really was no way anyone could have prevented this or even have foreseen it. Hasty's blow-up was totally unexpected and without provocation.

JJ Tue Jun 12, 2012 04:17pm

After the physical assault, I would have called the police and had him arrested (in Illinois physical contact with a sports official is illegal). Then I would have resigned immediately from the league.
Nobody needs that kind of abuse.

JJ

Rich Tue Jun 12, 2012 04:30pm

It amazes me how baseball people run the gamut -- from gentlemen to knuckle-draggers. You've encountered the latter. I would've called the police, too. Appears you had witnesses to the battery, as well.

Toadman15241 Tue Jun 12, 2012 04:38pm

I agree with calling the police. I think you guys know the comment probably wasn't the wisest decision, but most people would have said a lot worse than that.

Other thoughts:

-I think that after the first bump your partner should have turned around. He left himself very vulnerable to serious injury by not doing so.
- Why did you allow "You're lazy" to go without some kind of warning/ejection? Especially if it is being yelled across the field. That is a personal attack that deserves an early shower from LL to MLB.

MD Longhorn Tue Jun 12, 2012 04:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toadman15241 (Post 845710)
Why did you allow "You're lazy" to go without some kind of warning/ejection?

How idiotic would an umpire look trying to eject someone in the parking lot? Don't you think that's only going to incite the guy to get worse? This stuff going on in the parking lot, you just want to get out of there. Ejecting him in the parking lot is just going to make things worse.

LilLeaguer Tue Jun 12, 2012 05:05pm

You're Lazy!
 
Quoting from the write-up:

Quote:

However, the “You’re ****ing lazy!” comment came, I believe, as a result of a home run hit by a visiting team batter earlier in the game. There was nobody on base. Consequently, I was in my traditional “A” position down the first base line when the batter hit a deep fly ball to left field. The ball landed in the bullpen on the fly, resulting in a solo home run. Because the ball was hit to left field with no one on base, the home run decision is the plate umpire’s, who was the person who did, in fact, make the initial call. However, home team's Manager asked Plate Umpire to check with me and ask what I saw (it was twilight and visibility was admittedly terrible; however, I did see it easily clear the fence). I told Plate Umpire that I saw a clear home run. Plate Umpire explained this to home team Manager, who didn’t complain. Plate Umpire and I returned to our starting positions when visiting team Manager suddenly and inexplicably walked out of his first base dugout toward me and yelled to me, “Get in position out there! You’re lazy!” I completely ignored him, especially since such calls to left with no one on base are never the base umpire’s call to make. Quite honestly, I had no idea why he was yelling this to me.
So the coach had yelled "You're lazy!" to the umpire during the game as well.

UMP25 Tue Jun 12, 2012 05:29pm

In all fairness, I wasn't 100% sure he was talking directly to ME for two reasons:
  1. He didn't come that close to me and it was difficult to discern exactly what he was doing
  2. The call was so clearly NOT mine that I honestly felt no one with any brain cells could be yelling at a base ump in the "A" position about a fly ball hit to direct left field

Because of this, I didn't pay much attention to his comment and therefore didn't eject him. I surely would have had I known with absolute certainty he was hurtling such invective toward me.

UMP25 Tue Jun 12, 2012 05:34pm

A couple updates
 
Mike sent me this Email after doing a little fun digging on Vern Hasty:

Quote:

Originally Posted by from a Chicago State University official after Hasty was fired
"We felt that coach Mahmoud took over our team during a very tough situation..."

Quote:

Originally Posted by news article author's comments
I assume this is referring to Coach Hasty leaving his position as head baseball coach at CSU. Why was he fired? You may recall he had a "fit" of sorts at a game earlier in the season (April 2007) in which he called the police after being ejected from a game, and tried to have the umpire charged with disorderly conduct. Of course, the cops laughed all the way back to the station. I'd love it if someone could tell me where Coach Hasty is now. He is certainly leaving an interesting trail...

That was from a post from 2009.

Just an FYI--I'm not unaware of the legal situation this whole thing represents. I just got off the phone with a very friendly and helpful Sycamore police officer, who provided me with some good information. Time and space don't permit me to elaborate right now, but I can say that I still retain the right to file a complaint against Hasty. Truthfully, I would prefer to do it only if Mike joins me. I think it would look rather odd if only one of us pursues it. Either we both should or neither should.

I'll keep you updated.

d26 Tue Jun 12, 2012 05:48pm

(Composed my original reply while the OP was posting #10. The only ODD part of one of you pursuing the issue is how odd your "partner" will look. If neither of you make a report, you are doing all officials and participants a disservice - no battery should go unreported.)

Even after the fact, call the local authorities. Please!

Even if there is no action taken by the authorities, the event is recorded for future reference. Even if you do/did not want to take any action, think about the next person who the miscreant may act out upon. Maybe just having a face to face with a uniformed officer will be the cure. Maybe the miscreant already has had some police contact...

---
Based on experience, I always program my cell to call the local police dispatch as a speed dial. I prefer the local dispatch as they will usually be "very" quick to respond to something at a sporting event... 911 or similar can work, but can take longer to get to a person who can help you (some 911 calls are answered by a call center, then routed to a local office).

If you are going somewhere new and are not sure whom to call in an emergency, use a search engine to find the dispatch center number, call, and ask their advice on how to contact them if the need arises (the most direct line to call).

The authorities would much rather you call when there "may" be an issue, than to arrive with an ambulance.

UMP25 Tue Jun 12, 2012 06:31pm

I don't think I'd pursue anything with the police unless my partner wishes to do so as well. It wouldn't make sense for me to file a complaint alone.

ozzy6900 Tue Jun 12, 2012 07:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845730)
I don't think I'd pursue anything with the police unless my partner wishes to do so as well. It wouldn't make sense for me to file a complaint alone.

No one has the right to lay hands on you unless they are patting you on the back for a job well done, shaking your hand, or hugging you (we'll leave that one alone). If you were physically assaulted (even a push), you should be reporting this to the police. Too many people think that they can "take the game" into the parking lot and feel that they have a "right" to verbally or physically assault officials. What will the next guy bring to the lot with him, a .38cal? You have to stop these morons in their tracks...... it's up to you!

RPatrino Tue Jun 12, 2012 09:07pm

I am with Ozzy on this one. It is imperative that you file a police report ASAP, you were assaulted. You owe it to your fellow brothers in blue who might have the next run in with this putz. This guy needs a wake up call that this type of idiotic behavior isn't condoned by our fraternity.

UMP25 Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JJ (Post 845706)
After the physical assault, I would have called the police and had him arrested (in Illinois physical contact with a sports official is illegal). Then I would have resigned immediately from the league.
Nobody needs that kind of abuse.

JJ

In fairness to the league, John, my colleagues and I are waiting to see what the league is going to do. I'd rather my decision be based on reason, logic, and common sense and not emotion alone.

As far as the police report goes, tomorrow or Thursday I will head over to Sycamore and file the report. The more I think about this, the more I believe I just can't let this go. This guy really needs to be out of the game and off the field. I cannot cause that to happen, but if having him arrested gets him a little closer to the exit door, the game will be the better for it. Regardless, I wouldn't file a report for the good of the game or for my fellow umpires. I'd file it because he broke the law, and that is what's important here.

SanDiegoSteve Wed Jun 13, 2012 02:51am

I would file charges for sure. This guy belongs nowhere near a baseball field.

Are you sure they're not the Will County Crackheads? They sound pretty much like they're smoking something!

UMP25 Wed Jun 13, 2012 03:19am

In a league game tonight (Tuesday), I had Monday's home team (DeKalb Liners) as the visitors. In the plate meeting the Liners manager brought up the previous night's incident. Before I said anything, when referring to Vern Hasty of Will County, the Liners manager said, "That guy's nuts. He's absolutely nuts. He definitely has some screws loose."

It's not often a manager rips one of his peers like that.

SanDiegoSteve Wed Jun 13, 2012 05:42am

Not to be cruel, but just sayin', the name 'Vern Hasty' sounds like somebody that may have fallen off his combine a few times. :) I think the Liners manager was trying to distance himself from ol Vern right away!

Eastshire Wed Jun 13, 2012 08:38am

Let me echo what someone else said earlier: for all that's holy, don't leave your back turned to someone who's irrational. You can, and should, continue to walk away, but you need to see to protect yourself.

JRutledge Wed Jun 13, 2012 09:35am

Sounds like fun. Why guys still work these leagues is beyond me, but to each his own I guess.

My only real concern is why did you post this with actual names of all the parties (more the umpires IMO) involved? I know both of you and both of your are good umpires, but this only just puts light on people that may not participate in this forum and cannot give their side or perspective. Now everyone in the country (world) knows about this incident in a league that many experienced umpires totally dismiss for all kinds of reasons. Do not take this the wrong way, I am not talking about a lack of professionalism, I just would not have posted this with the names, but certainly would have said posted the incident and the circumstances. Maybe if this made the paper that is one thing, but totally different when no one even knows who is playing in these league or cares for the most part.

That is just my take on this issue.

Peace

MD Longhorn Wed Jun 13, 2012 10:19am

Quote:

Originally Posted by LilLeaguer (Post 845718)
Quoting from the write-up:


So the coach had yelled "You're lazy!" to the umpire during the game as well.

My bad. Sorry bout that.

UMP25 Wed Jun 13, 2012 11:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 845806)
Sounds like fun. Why guys still work these leagues is beyond me, but to each his own I guess.

My only real concern is why did you post this with actual names of all the parties (more the umpires IMO) involved? I know both of you and both of your are good umpires, but this only just puts light on people that may not participate in this forum and cannot give their side or perspective. Now everyone in the country (world) knows about this incident in a league that many experienced umpires totally dismiss for all kinds of reasons. Do not take this the wrong way, I am not talking about a lack of professionalism, I just would not have posted this with the names, but certainly would have said posted the incident and the circumstances. Maybe if this made the paper that is one thing, but totally different when no one even knows who is playing in these league or cares for the most part.

That is just my take on this issue.

Peace

I can understand what you're saying, which is why I've tried to maintain some fairness or decorum by not stating a name and ripping any named individuals here. As far as Vern, he has been in the news and is quite publicly known, and not in a good way unfortunately.

FWIW, he's also the author of 2 baseball books, the second of which is scheduled to be published in September.

As far as why guys work these leagues--we do so for several reasons. I enjoy college baseball. I work multiple summer college leagues, including the Prospect League, the CSBL, Wisconsin State League, and the aforementioned Midwest Collegiate League. In addition, I have assigned the Metropolitan Collegiate Summer Baseball League since 1995. Unlike some other leagues, these utilize 2 umpires per game, and they pay rather well. The quality of ball in some of them is very good (Prospect League and Metro Collegiate League have been the best in that regard).

If one is going to work summer college ball, these are the ones available.

JRutledge Wed Jun 13, 2012 01:01pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845827)
I can understand what you're saying, which is why I've tried to maintain some fairness or decorum by not stating a name and ripping any named individuals here. As far as Vern, he has been in the news and is quite publicly known, and not in a good way unfortunately.

FWIW, he's also the author of 2 baseball books, the second of which is scheduled to be published in September.

I am only talking about the incident being in the news. I have no problem with you even showing us the report, but with the names that is where I have a slight issue on that level. I am not totally against posting something about this, just saying that the names involved are what I am concerned about. And I am thinking of this from the standpoint of your partner who I know personally as well, if he would be OK with this discussion with his name involved.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845827)
As far as why guys work these leagues--we do so for several reasons. I enjoy college baseball. I work multiple summer college leagues, including the Prospect League, the CSBL, Wisconsin State League, and the aforementioned Midwest Collegiate League. In addition, I have assigned the Metropolitan Collegiate Summer Baseball League since 1995. Unlike some other leagues, these utilize 2 umpires per game, and they pay rather well. The quality of ball in some of them is very good (Prospect League and Metro Collegiate League have been the best in that regard).

If one is going to work summer college ball, these are the ones available.

I am mostly speaking personally. I know why people like you and others do these leagues. This is your main sport and a way for you to get better and see some decent talent. I do get that. It just sounds like such a headache to deal with clowns like this have no perspective on why we are playing these games in the first place. Then again I did a handful of these games several years ago and I felt more like jumping off a cliff than working these games for the crap you take.

Peace

UMP25 Wed Jun 13, 2012 01:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 845833)
I am only talking about the incident being in the news. I have no problem with you even showing us the report, but with the names that is where I have a slight issue on that level. I am not totally against posting something about this, just saying that the names involved are what I am concerned about. And I am thinking of this from the standpoint of your partner who I know personally as well, if he would be OK with this discussion with his name involved.

I mentioned to my partner that I was discussing this on this forum but left his last name out of the posts here, just as I did mine. Sure, they're on the report, but I just left them out of the forum posts.


Quote:

I am mostly speaking personally. I know why people like you and others do these leagues. This is your main sport and a way for you to get better and see some decent talent. I do get that. It just sounds like such a headache to deal with clowns like this have no perspective on why we are playing these games in the first place. Then again I did a handful of these games several years ago and I felt more like jumping off a cliff than working these games for the crap you take.

Peace
This incident is a rarity. In all the years I've worked summer collegiate leagues, I can count on one hand the number of major problems I've experienced. Now the quality of the ball--that's a different story. It's also the reason why I don't do many CSBL games anymore. That league isn't what it used to be--lots of "old" guys on the rosters, and that lowers the quality significantly. I just help out its assignor with games in that league before my main summer collegiate leagues start.

LilLeaguer Wed Jun 13, 2012 02:01pm

Anonymization
 
JRutledge has a point, so I've redacted the names from the portion of the report I quoted earlier.

ozzy6900 Wed Jun 13, 2012 03:26pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845762)
In fairness to the league, John, my colleagues and I are waiting to see what the league is going to do. I'd rather my decision be based on reason, logic, and common sense and not emotion alone.

As far as the police report goes, tomorrow or Thursday I will head over to Sycamore and file the report. The more I think about this, the more I believe I just can't let this go. This guy really needs to be out of the game and off the field. I cannot cause that to happen, but if having him arrested gets him a little closer to the exit door, the game will be the better for it. Regardless, I wouldn't file a report for the good of the game or for my fellow umpires. I'd file it because he broke the law, and that is what's important here.

Next time, don't wait a few days. Call the police right then and there. The longer you wait the better a lawyer can get this guy off. He'll point out that "you had to think about the issue and you were probably steered into filing a complaint against this upstanding citizen.".

Also, you are not acting emotionally by calling the police right away, you are acting as you should. The jerk broke the law! If he robbed you, would you wait a couple of days to think about it? Of course not!

Steven Tyler Thu Jun 14, 2012 05:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozzy6900 (Post 845854)
Next time, don't wait a few days. Call the police right then and there. The longer you wait the better a lawyer can get this guy off. He'll point out that "you had to think about the issue and you were probably steered into filing a complaint against this upstanding citizen.".

Also, you are not acting emotionally by calling the police right away, you are acting as you should. The jerk broke the law! If he robbed you, would you wait a couple of days to think about it? Of course not!

Where do get your logic from............hypothetically speaking?

asdf Thu Jun 14, 2012 09:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845827)
I can understand what you're saying, which is why I've tried to maintain some fairness or decorum by not stating a name and ripping any named individuals here. As far as Vern, he has been in the news and is quite publicly known, and not in a good way unfortunately.

FWIW, he's also the author of 2 baseball books, the second of which is scheduled to be published in September.

I've received three e-mails from 4 assigners covering 3 sports advising us that if we puiblish an ejection report in a forum such as this or any public venue, we're done.... for good.

Whether the coach seems to have a history or is publishing a book is irrelevant. I any part of the allegation is proven untrue, the publisher of the information has "lots of 'splainin' to do !! Probably to legal counsel of the accused.

Let the league handle this. Word will get out as to what happened.

Rich Thu Jun 14, 2012 10:29am

Quote:

Originally Posted by asdf (Post 845952)
I've received three e-mails from 4 assigners covering 3 sports advising us that if we puiblish an ejection report in a forum such as this or any public venue, we're done.... for good.

Whether the coach seems to have a history or is publishing a book is irrelevant. if any part of the allegation is proven untrue, the publisher of the information has "lots of 'splainin' to do !! Probably to legal counsel of the accused.

iLet the league handle this. Word will get out as to what happened.

I would not let the league handle this -- I would've called the police while on site. However, I wouldn't have posted the ejection report, either, just like I wouldn't have posted the arrest report or the coach's mugshots (if available).

UMP25 Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845955)
I wouldn't have posted the arrest report or the coach's mugshots (if available).

The media will do that. ;)

jicecone Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:17am

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845955)
I would not let the league handle this

I certainly hope you are refering to only the personnal attack and not anything else.

You have a useless case if you don't follow the procedures alloted in the League. This is the same problem that law enforcement has every day and then some. Having the paperwork in proper order enables the League to penalize accordingly.

UMP25 - I realize that one feels violated after an incident like this however, publiclly posting only your side of the story with specific details can get you into more problems than you think. I am not saying what you reported is wrong, I am saying that when a League investigates the incident they will take into account statements from both sides, before making a decision. Be careful.

MD Longhorn Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:26am

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845955)
I would not let the league handle this -- I would've called the police while on site. However, I wouldn't have posted the ejection report, either, just like I wouldn't have posted the arrest report or the coach's mugshots (if available).

Are you merely saying you wouldn't have posted the ej report HERE? Or are you saying you wouldn't fill one out at all?

Rich Thu Jun 14, 2012 01:23pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbcrowder (Post 845963)
Are you merely saying you wouldn't have posted the ej report HERE? Or are you saying you wouldn't fill one out at all?

I'm saying I'd call the police on *top* of doing the required paperwork. If the league said "don't call the police" I would ignore that.

I would keep a close eye on what the league did, though -- if there's a pattern of this behavior and coaches not getting suspended, I'd probably quit working the league.

MD Longhorn Thu Jun 14, 2012 01:58pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845983)
I'm saying I'd call the police on *top* of doing the required paperwork. If the league said "don't call the police" I would ignore that.

Ah. Got it. And I agree.

Quote:

I would keep a close eye on what the league did, though -- if there's a pattern of this behavior and coaches not getting suspended, I'd probably quit working the league.
Absolutely.

UMP25 Thu Jun 14, 2012 03:00pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845983)
I'm saying I'd call the police on *top* of doing the required paperwork. If the league said "don't call the police" I would ignore that.

I would keep a close eye on what the league did, though -- if there's a pattern of this behavior and coaches not getting suspended, I'd probably quit working the league.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbcrowder (Post 845987)
Ah. Got it. And I agree.

Absolutely.

The league is young--this is its 3rd year--but I do not believe it has a history of such problems.

The league is still conducting an investigation. Because Hasty has threatened legal action against the league if they discipline him in any manner, the league has asked Mike and me to submit signed, notarized affidavits and a second incident report detailing who was in the immediate vicinity of the altercation. They're wanting to get all their ducks in a row to make sure they have rock solid info in case Hasty tries to counter with something of his own.

Regardless, I'm heading to the Sycamore Police Dept. to file the complaint. I will include my original umpire report, the relevant Illinois statutes, and anything else I think would be helpful.

Steven Tyler Thu Jun 14, 2012 03:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845997)
The league is young--this is its 3rd year--but I do not believe it has a history of such problems.

The league is still conducting an investigation. Because Hasty has threatened legal action against the league if they discipline him in any manner, the league has asked Mike and me to submit signed, notarized affidavits and a second incident report detailing who was in the immediate vicinity of the altercation. They're wanting to get all their ducks in a row to make sure they have rock solid info in case Hasty tries to counter with something of his own.

Regardless, I'm heading to the Sycamore Police Dept. to file the complaint. I will include my original umpire report, the relevant Illinois statutes, and anything else I think would be helpful.

It sounds like Hasty thinks he's bulletproof for some reason. If this guy doesn't get some discipline, every umpire in that league should walk on out the league, because I don't think I would want to work for a league that condones such actions as the type of Hasty.

If anything the team he coaches should $hit can his butt.

UMP25 Thu Jun 14, 2012 03:49pm

You would think the team's owner would do something on his own. After all, this is a moneymaking league that is trying to come across as some "pre-professional" (their words, not mine) collegiate league. They're trying to be more like the Northwoods and Cape Cod Leagues, which is quite a stretch for any league, IMHO.

Considering the mental instability of Hasty, I personally think he's either bluffing about legal action against the league, or he is simply delusional, like he was in that Chicago State incident where he called the cops on the plate umpire who ejected him.

asdf Thu Jun 14, 2012 07:20pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 845955)
I would not let the league handle this -- I would've called the police while on site. However, I wouldn't have posted the ejection report, either, just like I wouldn't have posted the arrest report or the coach's mugshots (if available).

100% agree that the police should have been called.

100% believe that the report should not have been posted.

UMP25 Thu Jun 14, 2012 09:50pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by jicecone (Post 845961)
I certainly hope you are refering to only the personnal attack and not anything else.

You have a useless case if you don't follow the procedures alloted in the League. This is the same problem that law enforcement has every day and then some. Having the paperwork in proper order enables the League to penalize accordingly.

UMP25 - I realize that one feels violated after an incident like this however, publiclly posting only your side of the story with specific details can get you into more problems than you think. I am not saying what you reported is wrong, I am saying that when a League investigates the incident they will take into account statements from both sides, before making a decision. Be careful.

FWIW, some redactions made.

pob14 Fri Jun 15, 2012 09:34am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845997)
Regardless, I'm heading to the Sycamore Police Dept. to file the complaint. I will include my original umpire report, the relevant Illinois statutes, and anything else I think would be helpful.

As a longtime prosecutor, I would suggest you not bring the statutes. The police will take that as you trying to tell them how to do their job. (Think of it as a coach coming onto the field with the rule book open after you make a call.) Tell them the facts and let them deal with the law.

If they don't do what you want, well, then call them up in a few days, and say, "Hey, you know, I was talking to this POB guy on the Internet, and he says he's a lawyer or something, and he mentioned that these statutes might apply . . . ."

MD Longhorn Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:56am

Quote:

Originally Posted by pob14 (Post 846132)
as a longtime prosecutor, i would suggest you not bring the statutes. The police will take that as you trying to tell them how to do their job. (think of it as a coach coming onto the field with the rule book open after you make a call.) tell them the facts and let them deal with the law.

If they don't do what you want, well, then call them up in a few days, and say, "hey, you know, i was talking to this pob guy on the internet, and he says he's a lawyer or something, and he mentioned that these statutes might apply . . . ."

+1

UMP25 Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:27am

Quote:

Originally Posted by pob14 (Post 846132)
As a longtime prosecutor, I would suggest you not bring the statutes. The police will take that as you trying to tell them how to do their job. (Think of it as a coach coming onto the field with the rule book open after you make a call.) Tell them the facts and let them deal with the law.

If they don't do what you want, well, then call them up in a few days, and say, "Hey, you know, I was talking to this POB guy on the Internet, and he says he's a lawyer or something, and he mentioned that these statutes might apply . . . ."

Makes sense. I'll have to be sure to tell one of my colleagues that it wasn't such a great idea in the first place. :D

UMP25 Fri Jun 15, 2012 09:18pm

Saying that in the form of a rhetorical question is not unlike saying something along the lines of, "Hey, don't blame 15 runs and 6 errors in one inning on me, Vern."

Anyway, police report has been filed. The Sycamore officer has been nothing but helpful and totally empathetic. We'll see how this plays out.

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 02:34pm

The league at first decided to suspend Hasty indefinitely because of the pending criminal investigation. However, his suspension was lifted after serving only a few games. He's back in the dugout.

No comment.

JRutledge Thu Jun 28, 2012 02:55pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847677)
The league at first decided to suspend Hasty indefinitely because of the pending criminal investigation. However, his suspension was lifted after serving only a few games. He's back in the dugout.

No comment.

And what is the benefit of doing these leagues again? Remind me so I can avoid them even more than I do now.

Peace

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:00pm

Meanwhile, the league says I can't work in it anymore at all because I'm ineligible to work at one of its venues.

Toadman15241 Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:27pm

A lawsuit against the manager should seriously be considered. There are now actual damages. Throw in some punitives and it might be worth it.

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:30pm

No, a lawsuit wouldn't help. My ineligibility has nothing to do with the manager, the league, or even sports. I'm not complaining about the ineligible part. After all, several NCAA conferences, for example, have prohibitions against umpires working a game involving their alma mater. However, that doesn't preclude them from working the rest of the conference.

In this league, though, that doesn't seem to matter. Vern's back in; I'm out.

Funny how these things work, ain't it? :p

JRutledge Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:31pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 847695)
Imagine that. The league sided, in the end, with the rat.

Are we surprised? ;)

Peace

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 847696)
Are we surprised? ;)

Peace

Well, their attorney did tell me that if he's actually arrested, they'll revisit his status. :rolleyes:

JRutledge Thu Jun 28, 2012 03:56pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847697)
Well, their attorney did tell me that if he's actually arrested, they'll revisit his status. :rolleyes:

And he still has a job. It does not matter what the league says, why does he still have a job to represent them in anyway? Thank God this is not my problem.

Peace

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 04:10pm

Just a reminder to emphasize that the Hasty situation has nothing to do with my ineligibility.

Publius Thu Jun 28, 2012 05:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 847679)
And what is the benefit of doing these leagues again? Remind me so I can avoid them even more than I do now.

Peace

the money's not bad, and I know a dozen guys who have worked indy ball for 10 years or more with nothing like this ever happening to them.

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 05:22pm

BTW, I want to make it clear that I have not here or even privately with any of the MCL umpires urged them to resign en masse, go on strike, or anything like that. What they choose to do is up to them. I did not recommend or suggest anything to them. The last thing I want is for the league to think I'm behind some work action.

JRutledge Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:38pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Publius (Post 847712)
the money's not bad, and I know a dozen guys who have worked indy ball for 10 years or more with nothing like this ever happening to them.

I can do a lot of other things for the money and I know my games are not going to get cancelled. To each his own I guess.

Peace

Rich Thu Jun 28, 2012 10:44pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847713)
BTW, I want to make it clear that I have not here or even privately with any of the MCL umpires urged them to resign en masse, go on strike, or anything like that. What they choose to do is up to them. I did not recommend or suggest anything to them. The last thing I want is for the league to think I'm behind some work action.

I had an incident like this a while back. I walked away from the league for four years when they decided to minimize the incident. Last year I decided to go back, but that team is still on my scratch list. One bad apple doesn't spoil the bunch.

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:33pm

Apparently the MCL doesn't agree with your bad apple assessment, because they don't think I should be permitted to work anywhere in the league if I am ineligible to work one venue.

Rich Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847739)
Apparently the MCL doesn't agree with your bad apple assessment, because they don't think I should be permitted to work anywhere in the league if I am ineligible to work one venue.

I'm guessing that, regardless of what they tell you, they're unhappy because you got the police involved. Or because you made the report quite public here.

Only good umpires get scratched, in my experience (bad umpires simply don't get hired). Screw them - enjoy the rest of your summer.

UMP25 Thu Jun 28, 2012 11:49pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink
Or because you made the report quite public here.

Not that there was anything to hide, but how would they have found out unless someone here felt it was necessary to go and contact them or something? ;)


As far as getting the police involved, I was told by my assignor that the commissioner was upset we didn't call the police right away. (My first call was 12 hours later, followed by the formal report filing 4 days after that.)

Oh, I'll remain busy, because I still have a lot of games in one of the other summer collegiate leagues that I happen to assign, along with a couple other similar leagues where the assignors, all friends of mine, are in desperate need of help on some dates.

Rich Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:36am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847742)
Not that there was anything to hide, but how would they have found out unless someone here felt it was necessary to go and contact them or something? ;)

Some of our brethren are bigger rats than any rats you'll find in a dugout.

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 02:02am

Oh, I know. I also know for a fact that someone on this board did actually contact the MCL and inform them of this thread.

Rather pathetic, if you ask me, but that's our profession. Worse, that's the Chicago area umpire world. It's no wonder the NCAA considers this area the most cut throat and political area in college baseball umpiring in the country. Kinda sad.

mbyron Fri Jun 29, 2012 07:07am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847749)
It's no wonder the NCAA considers this area the most cut throat and political area in college baseball umpiring in the country. Kinda sad.

And why would Chicago be any different for umpiring? I don't mean to be insulting, but 'cut-throat' and 'political' have applied to the city for a long time.

jicecone Fri Jun 29, 2012 08:46am

I believe some 30 something threads ago some were trying to tell you to be careful what you put out there for the public to read. Email and forums become permanent documentation and can be used against you. Unfornately there are a lot of umpires and organizations that judge books by their covers only.

A word to the wise is sufficient.

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 08:57am

Quote:

Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 847758)
And why would Chicago be any different for umpiring? I don't mean to be insulting, but 'cut-throat' and 'political' have applied to the city for a long time.

Indeed

Quote:

Originally Posted by jicecone (Post 847766)
I believe some 30 something threads ago some were trying to tell you to be careful what you put out there for the public to read. Email and forums become permanent documentation and can be used against you. Unfornately there are a lot of umpires and organizations that judge books by their covers only.

A word to the wise is sufficient.

Which is why I began this thread by emphasizing that I wasn't intending this to bash the league and/or its commissioner. I desired to share an unprecedented experience & seek opinions, particularly on whether any police action was warranted. That question seems to have been unanimously answered, BTW. I have tried to maintain a sense of decorum and professionalism.

johnnyg08 Fri Jun 29, 2012 09:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by GROUPthink (Post 847743)
Some of our brethren are bigger rats than any rats you'll find in a dugout.

Amen to that.

Rich Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:12am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847767)
Indeed



Which is why I began this thread by emphasizing that I wasn't intending this to bash the league and/or its commissioner. I desired to share an unprecedented experience & seek opinions, particularly on whether any police action was warranted. That question seems to have been unanimously answered, BTW. I have tried to maintain a sense of decorum and professionalism.

Except that you took a few steps that were unnecessary, IMO:

(1) You identified the league.
(2) You identified yourself and your partner.
(3) You identified the manager and the teams involved.
(4) You shared an ejection report, which most leagues would consider an internal document. I know that I've assigned umpires to leagues at about this level and would likely fire or suspend an umpire who leaked an ejection report to the public -- or even the umpire staff at large.

I think you could've accomplished the exact same goal you list above without doing any of the 4 things I've listed.

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 10:25am

I did redact the report to exclude last names, and regarding the manager, his actions have been a matter of record publicly, as evidenced by public news reports of his behavior in baseball.

The umpire report also became a matter of public record once the police report was filed. That was something I weighed when trying to decide whether to go ahead with the police report.

youngump Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:06am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 845688)
Permit me to preface this post by stating that I am not here to bash the league or its commissioner or even my friend who is the assignor. I'm simply sharing an incident with y'all that occurred after a game I worked last night in Sycamore, IL. (a town that borders DeKalb, home of NIU). In 35 years of umpiring and 21 at the NCAA/college level, I have never experienced anything like what transpired last night.

Rather than rehash everything here, I've uploaded to dropbox the umpire report that I submitted late last night/early this morning. (It was too large to upload to the forum.)

Click here to view it.

Feel free to peruse it and opine here--not about the report; rather, your thoughts on the entire situation. Again, I'm not here to bash the league or its commissioner, or even demand that they do this or that. It's in their hands, and we umpires in the league are simply waiting to see what happens.

That's not redacted (it's just black). If you're not comfortable with making the details public and I'd say you're probably right not to, you need to actually delete the words out of the doc, or change them to x's or something.

JRutledge Fri Jun 29, 2012 11:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847749)
Oh, I know. I also know for a fact that someone on this board did actually contact the MCL and inform them of this thread.

Rather pathetic, if you ask me, but that's our profession. Worse, that's the Chicago area umpire world. It's no wonder the NCAA considers this area the most cut throat and political area in college baseball umpiring in the country. Kinda sad.

People at the NCAA really believe that? They really do not have much perspective if that is the case. ;)

Peace

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngump (Post 847783)
That's not redacted (it's just black). If you're not comfortable with making the details public and I'd say you're probably right not to, you need to actually delete the words out of the doc, or change them to x's or something.

That is what redacted is--blacking out certain specifics or information. Have you ever seen a document redacted by the government when they turn over said document? Sometimes it's laughable how little information is left after seeing almost everything covered in black.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 847784)
People at the NCAA really believe that? They really do not have much perspective if that is the case. ;)

Peace

I was told this by a D1 conference assignor himself. In addition, 2 veteran D1 college umpires whom I assign to spring college ball (D3) and summer college ball made this same statement. Quite interesting.

One of the comments was, "Why do you think that there has been only one CWS Umpire to have come from the Chicago metro area when there are many very qualified college umpires living here?"

The discussion further touched upon his observations that in the Chicago metro area, there are probably some 70 or 80, give or take, college umpires. Of that number, only an estimated 8 umpires receive a consistent D1 schedule in the spring. Of that number, only 1 has received any D1 post-season assignments (I'm referring only to Regionals/Super-Regionals/CWS) recently (meaning this year and in immediate preceding years). Only 1--a different person who no longer gets such post-season assignments--has been to the CWS.

It isn't difficult to notice something here. BTW, I am absolutely NOT complaining or whining about anything. I am simply stating observations made by one of my partners, observations echoed by a couple other veterans as well.

Note: The term Chicago metro area is meant to refer to only those Illinois counties in northeast Illinois the include and surround Chicago. No Indiana or Wisconsin counties are included in the aforementioned description.

johnnyg08 Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:42pm

Except for the fact that you didn't convert your redacted Word document into .pdf or view only, all of your redactions are uncovered by simply changing the black highlight to a white highlight or removing the highlight altogether since the report remains editable, not just viewable. Oops.

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 12:45pm

Hmmm. Thanks for informing dumb @ss me of that. I'll have to change that, despite that it's kind of like closing the barn door after the horses have left. :rolleyes:

Matt Fri Jun 29, 2012 05:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847792)
The discussion further touched upon his observations that in the Chicago metro area, there are probably some 70 or 80, give or take, college umpires. Of that number, only an estimated 8 umpires receive a consistent D1 schedule in the spring. Of that number, only 1 has received any D1 post-season assignments (I'm referring only to Regionals/Super-Regionals/CWS) recently (meaning this year and in immediate preceding years). Only 1--a different person who no longer gets such post-season assignments--has been to the CWS.

That's not out of the norm. In fact, that's probably in line with the distribution of D1 and non-D1 teams in the area.

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 05:07pm

Well, I can't say whether it's out of the norm or not. It's just his observation (shared by a couple others).

JRutledge Fri Jun 29, 2012 07:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847792)
I was told this by a D1 conference assignor himself. In addition, 2 veteran D1 college umpires whom I assign to spring college ball (D3) and summer college ball made this same statement. Quite interesting.

One of the comments was, "Why do you think that there has been only one CWS Umpire to have come from the Chicago metro area when there are many very qualified college umpires living here?"

Could that be because we have very little good baseball in this area of the country? I would not think for one second that in the overall picture we see nearly as good of baseball as those see in the south and the western part of the country. Now "qualified" is always going to be a judgment call. And I do not sit around wondering why guys from this area are or are not in that pipeline. Unless I am missing something, there are not many Midwestern teams that make it to the College World Series as a norm and I would think the fact we do not see that kind of ball might not help either. I am not saying he is not right, but that is my first guess based what I see.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847792)
The discussion further touched upon his observations that in the Chicago metro area, there are probably some 70 or 80, give or take, college umpires. Of that number, only an estimated 8 umpires receive a consistent D1 schedule in the spring. Of that number, only 1 has received any D1 post-season assignments (I'm referring only to Regionals/Super-Regionals/CWS) recently (meaning this year and in immediate preceding years). Only 1--a different person who no longer gets such post-season assignments--has been to the CWS.

It isn't difficult to notice something here. BTW, I am absolutely NOT complaining or whining about anything. I am simply stating observations made by one of my partners, observations echoed by a couple other veterans as well.

Isn't that on the assignor or supervisors of those conferences? They can only work games they are assigned. And I do not know many that are getting a shot realistically than what is going on here. It is the same issue that we have had in other sports at the D1 level. If the assignor are willing to hire and use people here they can. If they choose not to or limit the number they will. I do not attribute that to just what people think here. Heck the one guy I know that is working NCAA D1 Post Season is not even originally from here. I honestly do not know anyone that is really that influential to who gets hired from this part of the state in the first place.

Peace

Publius Fri Jun 29, 2012 08:27pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 847815)
Could that be because we have very little good baseball in this area of the country? I would not think for one second that in the overall picture we see nearly as good of baseball as those see in the south and the western part of the country. Now "qualified" is always going to be a judgment call. And I do not sit around wondering why guys from this area are or are not in that pipeline. Unless I am missing something, there are not many Midwestern teams that make it to the College World Series as a norm and I would think the fact we do not see that kind of ball might not help either. I am not saying he is not right, but that is my first guess based what I see.

Peace

That doesn't explain the three guys from metropolitan Lansing, MI who each go once every three years. It's very much a who-you-know system in the midwest.

JRutledge Fri Jun 29, 2012 09:05pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Publius (Post 847821)
That doesn't explain the three guys from metropolitan Lansing, MI who each go once every three years. It's very much a who-you-know system in the midwest.

It is that way anyway. No one is coming out to see you work baseball in the Midwest or a camp where everyone has to prove they deserve to be hired.

Peace

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 09:14pm

You mean the camp(s) where you pay for the privilege of being assigned non-paying fall ball games, which then gets you an automatic assignment to next spring's D3 conference tournaments, conveniently assigned by...well, lookey here...the guy who ran the aforementioned, previous fall camp. ;)

JRutledge Fri Jun 29, 2012 09:29pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847824)
You mean the camp(s) where you pay for the privilege of being assigned non-paying fall ball games, which then gets you an automatic assignment to next spring's D3 conference tournaments, conveniently assigned by...well, lookey here...the guy who ran the aforementioned, previous fall camp. ;)

No I mean a camp run by the D1 conferences where they identify talent that can work the conference in the future.

Peace

UMP25 Fri Jun 29, 2012 09:31pm

I know what you meant.

BTW, those camps don't always do what you think they do. It still is a lot of whom you know or how much of a buddy-buddy one is to certain people.

Anyway, enough of all this. Back on topic.

MrUmpire Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:13am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847826)
I know what you meant.

BTW, those camps don't always do what you think they do. It still is a lot of whom you know or how much of a buddy-buddy one is to certain people.

One of my assigners put it this way: You don't get D-1 assignments with talent and no networking and you don't get D-1 assignments with networking and no talent.

JRutledge Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:21am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 847826)
I know what you meant.

BTW, those camps don't always do what you think they do. It still is a lot of whom you know or how much of a buddy-buddy one is to certain people.

Anyway, enough of all this. Back on topic.

Well that is obvious. And why many never get a chance or get to the point they can work higher level games.

Peace

UMP25 Wed Jul 18, 2012 01:25pm

Just an update on this
 
Well, Vern Hasty was back in the league after a mere 4-game suspension, and I was out. Then I was back in, having worked a game on July 5th with a young new guy. Now I'm out, and there's not enough money they can throw at me to ever want to work in that league again. BTW, some 4 or 5 guys quite the league a couple weeks ago. None were among the 7 guys whom I recommended for work in this league, so I don't know why they left. IMHO, they made the correct decision.

Today the police officer of the Sycamore PD who's handling this case called me to let me know where things stood regarding the Hasty case. Basically, things have slowed down or even stopped for one main reason--the league has refused to turn over any information the police department has requested. Moreover, all phone calls and Emails by the officer to the league for more information have been ignored and not returned. He can't even get a copy of the statement that the Liners Manager wrote explaining what he saw and/or heard about the original incident. The officer told me he has attempted numerous times to call the Liners GM (who's also the head coach at Kishwaukee C.C.) on his cell and at the school, but he has received no replies to the numerous voice mail messages left. Same thing when he has tried contacting the commissioner and the league's attorney.

The officer closed our conversation by telling me to think it over and let him know where I wish this to go. At a minimum a city ordinance violation of disorderly conduct can be pursued. That's just a ticket, a small fine, and no court appearance by Hasty needed. While that might sound OK to most folks, I am left asking myself, "Why should we settle on just that now that we know the Midwest Collegiate League has stonewalled this whole investigation and has 'blamed' my partner for Hasty's suspension being lifted?" Truthfully, I would love to pursue this as far as possible. Why the hell would any umpire wish to work in a league that thumbs its nose at the law and treats its officials like this? Personally, I believe every umpire in the Chicago metro area ought to know this. It's despicable the way they have gone about trying to "protect" themselves.

------------------------------

On a somewhat related note--many posts back, someone here made the comment that umpires can sometimes be among the biggest rats. I didn't disagree with that comment then; I don't disagree with it now. I say this because I know for a certainty that a forum member here personally contacted the league informing them of this thread. Hey, it's a public forum, I realize that. I just find it truly pathetic that a member of the officiating community felt some petty, childish need to directly contact a league about such a thread like this in an Internet forum. (No, I didn't get admonished over the thread; I'm simply mentioning that someone here had to act like a child playing tattletale or something. Seriously, what's the point in treating a fellow umpire like this?)

asdf Wed Jul 18, 2012 02:19pm

Wow, if something happens down the line that goes further than what happend to you, the league has set them selves up for a slam dunk gross negligence suit. I'd bet their insurance carrier would love to know about this.

My first post in this thread ened with me saying "let the league handle this, word will get out as to what happened."

The way they handled this will get out.

UMP25 Wed Jul 18, 2012 04:43pm

I agree that it will get out. The big issue here is not whether I'm ineligible to work at one particular venue. It's not whether Vern Hasty believes that I'm "as guilty as he is" for making physical contact with him (as the officer and others have told me, defense of property or other persons is a valid reason to physically contact someone and separate the offender from the victim). The sole issue at hand here is, IMHO, how the league has handled the entire Hasty assault, from not suspending him immediately, pending an investigation, to intentionally refusing to turn over requested documents from law enforcement, to suspending then quickly reinstating a possible Illinois lawbreaker--all the while treating the umpires in an unprofessional manner (and I'm not referring to only my partner and me--several umpires were threatened by the league).

I can't see any reputable assignor (the key word there being "reputable") ever taking this league. The league will then become as good as its umpires whom they've hired, and that will be a bunch of amateur schmucks.

radwaste50 Thu Jul 19, 2012 01:08pm

Do you know an attorney? A quick lawyer letter requesting information may shake things loose

UMP25 Thu Jul 19, 2012 01:19pm

Yes, I know a couple attorneys. Both are ruthless, and one is a member of his father's firm, his father being the former chairman of Du Page County. However, asking one of these gentlemen to send such a letter would, IMHO, be an exercise in futility. First, if a police officer gets no cooperation, I highly doubt an attorney will. Second, the league commissioner's (who conveniently runs 2 of the league's 8 teams) wife is the attorney for the league itself. I'm willing to bet she'd relish a battle of wits between attorneys.

Is it really worth it? Yes, my attorney would do this at no cost, but still, the more damaging action may just simply be the fact that no halfway decent umpires are going to be working this league anymore, and that, in the end, may be the death knell for the league. They'd deserve it, that's for sure.

UMP25 Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:25pm

25% of the league dissolves
 
We got this press release this morning. Two of the teams simply folded. One was the team that Vern Hasty was managing. I guess that's one way to get him off the field.
Quote:

MIDWEST COLLEGIATE LEAGUE PRESS RELEASE
For Immediate Release:
Media Contact: Don Popravak
July 19, 2012


MIDWEST COLLEGIATE LEAGUE ANNOUNCES RESIGNATION OF WILL
COUNTY CRACKERJACKS AND ILLINOIS LINCOLNS

Chicago, IL – July 19, 2012 – The Midwest Collegiate League’s Commissioner, Don
Popravak, has announced that effective immediately, the Will County CrackerJacks and
the Illinois Lincolns baseball clubs have resigned from the League.

Jamie Toole, Owner, President and General Manager of the CrackerJacks and the Illinois
Lincolns, notified the Midwest Collegiate League’s Board of Directors of his decision to
resign from the League at approximately 6:35 p.m. tonight.
Commissioner Don
Popravak stated that “each club in the League has a financial obligation to meet its debt
payments to the League throughout the year.” He added, “It is most unfortunate that
Mr. Toole has made this decision.”

Commissioner Popravak further stated the following: “In our opinion, Jamie Toole’s
decision to voluntarily resign his clubs from the League during the season significantly
impacts the fifty-or-so college baseball players, managers and coaches that were
recruited for his CrackerJacks and Illinois Lincolns teams. These baseball players,
managers and coaches are the ones who are paying the very high price of not being
able to continue their baseball development this summer. Additionally, it affects the
communities that supported these players and clubs.”

The Midwest Collegiate League’s six remaining clubs -- the Chicago Zephyrs, DeKalb
County Liners, DuPage County Hounds, Rockford Foresters and Southland Vikings -- are
revising the League’s remaining schedule and will release it on Friday, July 20th. Its
46-game schedule this year runs from June 1st through July 29th. Post-season League
playoffs begin on July 31st.

The MCL League will continue to look for expansion franchises across the Midwest for
the 2013 season and beyond. “We are looking for experienced owners and operators
who share our vision of creating a top pre-minor league baseball destination filled with
potential Major League Baseball prospects and who can recreate the family fun
excitement and experiences that are seen at the Minor League venues,” stated
Commissioner Popravak.

###
One of the top umpires, a member of my association who had been assigned to work the upcoming playoffs, resigned yesterday effective immediately over issues of back pay. Seems he, like me and others, have not been paid for several games going as far back as June 1st (I'm owed just one game's worth).

Many other umpires are leaving at the end of this season. With the unprofessional reputation this league has earned itself, I cannot see them surviving period.

Serves them right.

Rich Fri Jul 20, 2012 01:09pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 849574)
We got this press release this morning. Two of the teams simply folded. One was the team that Vern Hasty was managing. I guess that's one way to get him off the field.


One of the top umpires, a member of my association who had been assigned to work the upcoming playoffs, resigned yesterday effective immediately over issues of back pay. Seems he, like me and others, have not been paid for several games going as far back as June 1st (I'm owed just one game's worth).

Many other umpires are leaving at the end of this season. With the unprofessional reputation this league has earned itself, I cannot see them surviving period.

Serves them right.

Looking at the attendance for some of these games, it's a wonder they even bother.

asdf Fri Jul 20, 2012 01:28pm

Our finicky little friend named Karma sure can be a bee-itch at times. ;)

UMP25 Fri Jul 20, 2012 01:31pm

Indeed. :D

UMP25 Sun Jul 22, 2012 03:04am

Well, this stuff just keeps getting better! The slow, hopefully painful death of this schlock league continues. Perhaps.

Toole Pulls CrackerJacks, Lincolns Out of Midwest Collegiate League |

Scroll down and read the comment by a poster named Larry.

I do find it interesting that a league that bills itself as "pre-professional" goes ahead and lets a con artist like Jamie O'Toole run two teams, and hires as a manager a guy fired from 3 previous head coaching positions for his bizarre rants and actions toward umpires.

It cost each team $25,000 to enter a franchise into the league. How did O'Toole, who skipped out on numerous other debts over the years, come up with the $50K to have 2 teams in the league? Hmmm...

UMP25 Wed Jul 25, 2012 12:33am

One veteran umpire resigned last week, and this week four more umpires tendered their resignation, primarily because of the issue of not getting paid. In fact, one guy has worked 15 games in the league and, according to this individual, has yet to be paid for any of them.

Yeah, this league is "pre-professional" all right. :rolleyes:

CT1 Fri Jul 27, 2012 05:53am

Quote:

Originally Posted by SafeOutReplay (Post 850013)
Money. Independent wealth is unusual in officiating. Most do it for the money even if they lie continually claiming that they don't.

Sounds like that's not viable any longer.

Manny A Fri Jul 27, 2012 10:20am

Quote:

Originally Posted by UMP25 (Post 849846)
Which is why I began this thread by emphasizing that I wasn't intending this to bash the league and/or its commissioner. ... I have tried to maintain a sense of decorum and professionalism.
.
.
.
Well, this stuff just keeps getting better! The slow, hopefully painful death of this schlock league continues. Perhaps.

Hmmmm. Methinks you're starting to sway from your original intent...

UMP25 Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:31am

After all the crap this league has pulled lately, can you blame me? I'll still try to be somewhat restrained. ;)

UMP25 Wed Aug 08, 2012 07:17pm

The latest Email from the league's commissioner about the money still owed to the umpires. I'm owed for only one game, but many guys are owed for numerous games. One of my colleagues is owed over $1200.00!

Quote:

July 31, 2012

Dear Umpires,

As Commissioner of the Midwest Collegiate League, I would like to thank each of you for making this 2012 Season a success. First of all, as a League we have made great strides over the past seasons to improve both the quality level of our officials and their professionalism. In my opinion, each of you had contributed toward us achieving this goal. Secondly, I want to explain that on July 20th we received resignations letters from the Will County Cracker Jacks and the Illinois Lincoln Baseball Clubs. Both of these organizations were owned by Jamie Toole, an original founding member and board of director of the League. This sudden and calculated resignation by Jamie Toole to avoid paying his League fees has left us with an uncollected debt from him for the 2012 season was significant. This debt includes (without limitation) League fees as well as all of his prorated shares of the umpire fees. His actions are not your responsibility and it’s a matter that the League will be pursuing legally. With regard to back pay owed to any umpire, the Midwest Collegiate League will guarantee payment on all outstanding sums owed to each of you. Since July 20 we have revised the method in which we pay umpires and have paid everyone on site before or after each game. Thus, the outstanding debt is now isolated to a two week period of time. I am asking that everyone be patient with us for the next 14 days, while we as a League work through the financials so everyone can be paid. If anyone would like to speak with or email me directly, please do...
A couple things my colleagues have asked me:
  • How can he call this season a "success"? Many of us think it was a disaster.
  • Where did all the money go if each team had to pay $25,000 just to be in the league?

So O'Toole didn't pay his $50K for both teams. That means there should be $150,000 from the other 6 teams. Each team is responsible for its own overhead (lights, field maintenance, etc.). However, the umpires' pay comes out of the league's funds. How can there not be enough money to pay the umpires their remaining game fees?

As one of my colleagues commented, "Perhaps someone ought to investigate them, because something doesn't smell right at all."

Just sayin'... :rolleyes:

UMP25 Sun Sep 09, 2012 07:36pm

A few updates
 
1. The De Kalb County State's Attorney has decided to not pursue the case. This doesn't surprise me, in light of the fact that the league and the Liners General Manager Josh Pethoud (yes, I'm naming names now, because these people who stonewalled and lied through this mess deserve the shame) refused to cooperate with authorities and intentionally withheld information that was more than once requested by law enforcement.

2. The league owes many of its umpires a lot of money. I'm owed a measly one game's fee, but others are owed much more. It is believed that the total owed to the umpires who have yet to be paid is in the 5-digit range.

3. Jamie O'Toole is up to it again with his usual skipping out on unpaid bills.

Regarding # 2 above--many of us umpires have been discussing legal action against the league. Talk of a class action type of lawsuit is in the works. There's no excuse for a league that charges $25,000 per team just to enter the league to not be able to pay its umpires, especially when each team's overhead (balls, lights, field maintenance, and other such costs) are paid for by the team and not the league fees. So even after O'Toole skipped out on his 2 teams' $50K, the league had $150,000 in the bank. Where did that money go?

I wonder if its Commissioner, Don Popravak, is still driving that Porsche (or is it the BMW? Mercedes?). He runs 2 teams, BTW. Word has it that he makes a ton of money being the league commissioner.

One thing's for certain--the umpires didn't make the money they were supposed to make!


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