Has anyone ordered from Honig's lately?
 

First, I preface this post by saying I'm not trying to rip on Honig's here. I'm simply relaying information and making an inquiry.

Recently, I had to order a couple new shirts and a jacket (the one with the blue shoulder stripes) from Honig's for use in the Midwest Collegiate League. Most of us received our items last week. Well, one of my partners calls me and asks me if I tried on the shirts and jackets. He asked me because of what several of us have noticed:

• The shirts and jackets are now made in China
• The polo blue shirts are of a markedly different material and sized MUCH larger than the original polo blues (I have a few of those)
• The jackets are shorter in the sleeves and tend to run a bit smaller
• The jackets feel thinner and much flimsier; the collars are like paper

So, I was wondering if anyone has experienced the same thing lately.

I haven't purchased any baseball items from them lately but I had an issue with the dye running on their football pants and ruining the white stripe and they didn't really seem to care. I've written them off and only order from them if I absolutely have to.

I like the material on the newer shirts. The jackets not so much.


Now, if we could just find a way to get someone to stop carrying these awful Richardson hats and go back to NewEra, I'd be a customer of theirs for life.

I have not ordered any baseball stuff either. But I have ordered the football pants and I did not seem to have that problem. I know others that did have the problem with color ruining or bleeding into the stripe. But I wash everything in cold water and I am wondering is that the reason I have not had this problem. I know they did change who made those pants. Maybe this is the case with many of their items.

Peace

I have noticed over the last three years that as their prices have gone up, their quality has gone down. I no longer send them my money.

I stopped when they made deals with state HS associations to force officials to buy their crap. Thankfully, my state hasn't sold their souls. Yet.

I deal mainly with Jim Kirk and UmpAttire now.

My state has a deal with them, but we do not have to buy the stuff. It is just available to them. Actually this started with Gerry Davis Sports first in my state.

Peace

Deals and discounts are fine. But some states (Florida is one that comes to mind) has announced that without the little state logo, one that only Honig's is licensed to put on the uniform, officials cannot work the playoffs. In other words, Honig's has made a backroom deal with a state association to force all their officials to buy stuff from them -- and that I find distasteful.

That kind of deal will push me (whenever practical) to another vendor.

If I truly like Honig's stuff the best, I'll buy it. However, when there's a choice (for identical product like shoes and protective gear), I'll buy elsewhere.

And like others, I've found the quality of the goods to be lacking. Last season I worked a tournament where they provided us with pants -- the non-polywool charcoal variety. In my mind, these were the lowest quality umpire pants I'd ever dealt with.

We are not getting a deal or a discount. We just can buy a shirt for example with the state logo on them if we choose which can replace the state patch, but is not required. Actually there are three different vendors that we can use to buy shirts or other items like hats with the IHSA logo on them. It is actually more for each item with them putting the logo on them.

I cannot speak to the quality of baseball stuff because I have not purchased anything from them in baseball for a few years. The last time I got something from them it was a pair of pants which were OK. I did purchase many football things this past year because the NCAA changed their shirts and we had to purchase entirely different shirts and were required do go to a different pair of pants and those were just fine as well. I just have heard people complaining lately and I do think they have changed some manufacturers in the last few years. That is probably the problem. I know they had some problems with some back orders of items because who they were working with had changed. At least that is what I was told by one of the guys that comes to our camps.

Peace

Dry-lo bag
 

Has anyone noticed the poor design of the Honigs Dry-Lo ball bags. Velcro on the inside pockets (WHY???) and the pockets are ridiculously too deep Getting an indicator or plate brush out of the pocket is a two hand operation. The web site says "Manufactured to our specifications". That doesn't say much about their design team.

Brian Curtin and I worked a summer collegiate league game last night. Even he noticed the misplacement of the belt loops on my Honig's poly wool plate pants. This causes the ball bags to not be properly positioned. One's too far forward because of this. Honig's suggestion? Take it to a tailor and pay more money for these things, to get them fixed. Because they're hemmed, Honig's won't do anything with them. Like the misplaced belt loops are my fault! :mad:

Ump25.....sent the same jacket back for the same two reasons that you did earlier this spring. Got a Smitty from UA instead.
Needed extra embroidered association shirts for a tourney last season, figured I'd get pants (2 pair) from them to save on having to pay shipping charges to two suppliers.
Bad decision.....because that whole belt loop positioning thing with the ball bags stinks.
Like others, have shifted 100% to Ump Attire (including my basketball stuff) unless forced to go to Honigs as the official/exclusive supplier.

Well, one reason why I will NOT go with Ump Attire for now is because they refuse to affix uniform numbers on anything. When I placed an order some 6 weeks ago for a couple shirts, they replied, "We're sorry, but we only sell the numbers loose and unattached to the shirts. If you want them put on, we recommend having a tailor do it."

Tried that once; it was a disaster. What stinks is that most suppliers will not affix numbers to shirts/jackets that they did not sell you. So, this policy by Ump Attire is really stupid and not very customer friendly.

I have not had any of those issues with the Dry-Lo bags. In fact I find mine are well made and are well designed.

I found the same thing with the ball bags. Unless the Brush is brand new, it is too short to get out of the pocket. I like the depth of the bag, but everything else is a joke.

5-6 years ago, I felt Honig's was top notch and dealt with them exclusively. Their service was good, their products were good (a few of their HMLS shirts that were made in the USA from about 5 years ago are my favorites) and their quality was "worth it." I cant say the same anymore.

Their HMLS shirts are made in China now and although they are "similar" to the Ump-Attire Ultimate Shirts IMO, they are the same price. How can Jim afford to offer a shirt made in the USA & Honig's has a shirt made in China for the same price? And Im sure Honig's has a much higher volume of shirts ordered, too. Their business model with a significant number of locations adds overhead which results in a more costly product. Jim has touched on it before and said he has no plans to "expand" like Honig's has because of the cost and limited benefits.

In their old made in USA shirts, I wore an XL on the bases and a XXL for the plate. With their new shirts, that has changed to a L on the bases and an XL for behind the plate. I can attest that their sizing has changed.

During one of their closeout sales last year, I picked up a K17 jacket because it was only $39. I was shocked when I compared the quality to an older K17 jacket I had that was probably 8 years old or so. My observations echoed those in the opening post - much much lower quality and a lighter, paper feeling to the product.

I recently picked up one of their K14 "convertible" jackets and am pleased with the construction and quality. Its expensive too, but a far better value than their K17 jackets.

If you have followed them throughout the years, you will have noticed their prices went up by a dollar or two every single year until their HMLS shirts were around $33-34. Every year there seemed to be a difference in the material and construction (usually a decrease in quality) of their HMLS shirts as well. When they got to a point where they couldnt raise prices anymore, they brought in the shirts made in Pakistan for a year and then these current Made in China "Prosoft" HMLS shirts. I dont understand how a company of their size & "reputation" could even offer those Pakistan shirts? Didnt they receive protypes and test them for a season before offering them? Did they rush at the last minute because of a supplier issue and had to "settle" for those?

I look at the Smitty offerings and see a similar quality product for a much much lower price.

I was frustrated the one time I purchased a pair of Poly Wools and had an issue. If you look on the inside of the pants, the crease is lined with a glue/resin substance that maintains the crease for a long period of time. Well, on the pair I received, the substance was not properly applied and the crease was not straight - there were a bunch of little lines on the legs because the substance was not applied correctly. I had to jump through some hoops but then eventually took them back. I looked on some older pairs and noticed the same thing but didnt make an issue of it with them.

I ordered a pair of Dry-Lo bags from Evans over the winter and have been pleased with them. Mine dont have any velcro on the openings inside, though. They took a little while to "loosen up" ( I found the opening was a little tight on getting baseballs in/out at first) but I really like them and have no complaints.

Are you referring to these?
Honig's Whistle Stop - K40 - LARGE UMPIRES BALL BAG

I have a pair of these as well and they have velcro in them and the tag says "Made in China." I dont like these as much as the Dry Los.

noticed a difference as well
 

I noticed a difference in the quality of the shirts and jackets when I got my Midwest Collegiate League order as well. Jacket seems a lot thinner than the other Honig's Jackets I have and the shirts are quite a bit larger than the old models I have as well. Overall I still don't think it is a bad shirt.

I also don't order shirts from Ump-attire because of the numbering issue. It is one less thing I have to worry about when I order a shirt

I didn't like them either. I plan on sewing a line across so my brush doesn't get lost.

I just realized that jacket doesn't have a lineup card pocket once I got on the field. I knew something was weird when they said they don't offer the open-bottom version (at least for the black with polo blue stripes).

The jackets are shorter in the sleeves and tend to run a bit smaller
The jackets feel thinner and much flimsier; the collars are like paper

I bought one in January and sent it back straight away for the same reason.

Id like to see Honig's respond to these complaints

Someone I know did just that. He Emailed Honig's a polite but firm Email listing the complaints that I and others here also have experienced. He was able to return his polo blue shirt for the next size down, even though it had been embroidered with the MCL logo on it. He said he received an apologetic and explanatory Email from Bill Hoseney of Honig's.

As far as the jacket, when I asked him about this, my colleague told me, "I can't see what I can do about it. If this is the only blue-striped shoulder one they have, I'm stuck with it." He does agree with me and those here who believe this made in China jacket is noticeably different, and not in a good way.

A pocket is nice, Brian, but I don't even use the open bottom one for the plate. Those are just HUGE. I have always liked the elastic bottoms, and if I use one behind the plate, which is rarer now that I use a long-sleeved shirt or the thermal jacket, I just put my lineup card and its holder in my left ball bag or my rear pocket.

I've heard the people who owned +POS bought out Honig's.

If it wasn't for the fact that they've been dead a while, I'd almost believe you. :p

Serious question. Is the guy that ran the company dead? I know his wife died some years ago and she was the reason that company stayed afloat. When she died the company went into the toilet. But I did not know the guy died too.

Peace

Somebody who once worked there for many years and became a good acquaintance of mine has for the last several years worked at a Naperville Portillo's. I saw her not too long ago, and she mentioned that Buck died recently. I didn't hear this, so I didn't know the validity of that. I do know that his wife Sylvia died of cancer years before, but I thought the old man was still alive and kicking. I guess not.

The open bottom could have done with being a few inches shorter, but I've been a fan of it. I'm also a bit taller so I haven't had the problems a lot of people have with mass excess material.

I still want that pocket. It's on all of the shirts, I'm used to it, and there's no reason other than going cheap that it's not there. First world problems.

Their children want to continue their legacy............:D

Well he was alive soon after her death as he was even attempting to come to a came for IACO. But that has been some years before and I had not heard anything from them for some time other than online. I did not know if they were trying to come back or were doing other things. That is incredibly sad as I like them and been to that facility several times. The quality of their stuff had fallen off, but to start officiating where I did and first by my baseball stuff from them, then to actually go there some years later was special to me. Sorry to hear that if that is true and I am sure it is true. I will ask around to see if someone else knows and can give more information, but I have not heard anyone discuss his death. But that is probably mostly because no one has really heard of his company much since Sylvia's death. There is no question Sylvia was the backbone of that company.

Peace

My first umpire gear and unies were from +POS. I remember going there and if it was early afternoon, they'd invite me to join them for lunch; and let me tell you--they always had huge spreads for lunch. It was like a big catering affair.

I knew several of the veteran umpires that used to swear by +POS.

This was back before the Internet. A catalog, and a phone call took care of everything.

I used to deal with a supplier that sold Dalco brand uniforms. They were cheaper, and held up real well. I have some shirts that I used for five years, and they're still in great shape.

They carried pants that were lightweight, but they kept their crease forever. All you had to do was take proper care of them. Had great service too.

How convenient it must have been to "just" show up around lunchtime....;)

Uniforms and a buffet.

Made up for their prices sometimes. :D

You're entitled to your opinion, but to not shop at the most customer friendly company in the country b/c they won't sew on numbers, seems rather petty. Find a different person in your area who can affix the numbers correctly.

It's not customer friendly when a company won't do what all its competitors will gladly do. Hopefully one day Ump-Attire will enter the 21st century.

There simply aren't a lot of guys who wear numbers on their shirts.

Remember, extra food=extra pounds=bigger britches. They were playing you like a cheap guitar.

An incorrect generalization around here. A solid majority of umpires with whom I work have numbers.

Any company who wants to be at or near the top in customer service in a limited, narrow market but who refuses to provide a simple service that all of its competitors provide isn't very "customer friendly". I'd call that either lazy or shortsighted.

I have also found UmpAttire to be rigid and less than "customer understanding" at times. In a business as fickle as officiating supplies, that is risky.

Just dropping in to add another data point. I'm disappointed with UA not embroidering numbers. It's not an easy job to do at home and it's kept me from ordering their shirts, which I otherwise find superior. Someone should send Jim Kirk to this thread.

I don't wear numbers and I don't like the fit of UA's shirts. That said, I took issue with they way they described their sizing and they did everything in their power to make it right. I can't argue with that kind of customer service and they have a loyal customer in me.

I like everything about the ultimate shirts but the buttons & placket. Picky? Yeah.

I have a seamstress locally that does work out of her home as kind of a second job. I think she charges me $2 or $3 to put numbers on a shirt, and $6 per pair of pants to hem. She does oustanding work and I don't have companies put numbers on no matter where I get the shirt from.

I love my polywools, but after hearing about the belt loop issue I might have to get the Ump Attire polywools for next year. I need new black shirts too and I will go with either Smitty or UA. The UA black shirt I have now seems to have faded rather quickly though.

Honig's was my go-to place when I worked baseball/softball and football back in central NY. I am a bit upset at the deal going on with FHSAA down here. Even though I have taken myself out of any state playoff consideration down here, I think it is wrong for one company to have sole rights to FHSAA gear.

Why is that? Do most of your partners work in a league that requires them? Most of the guys I work with have them, too, and the only reason I can discern for them doing so is to give the appearance that they work higher levels than they actually do. That, or they just think it looks cool for some reason.

No HS, college or summer amateur league in our area requires numbers, yet a sizable minority wears them.

Well, the association of which I'm president and for which I assign (spring college and summer collegiate) has required them since our inception in 1988. Consequently, many guys I use have them. In addition, one of the other leagues for which I work requires them. This results in most guys having them. Even umpires in other associations who work games I assign have numbers.

Very few around here do not have them.

Just curious. Another regional difference, I guess.

Our HS umpires wear them for evaluation purposes.

Jacket
 

I am pretty sure the jacket we received is a base jacket. That is why there is no pocket. I have seen guys in the past that had the base jacket with the white stripes with no pocket.

Elastic bottom = base jacket
No elastic bottom = plate jacket

However, the no elastic bottom/plate jackets run VERY big. I don't like them. I use the elastic one, tuck it in, and carry my lineup card holder in my ball bag or back pocket.

For whatever reason they don't sell the one with the blue stripes in the open-bottom version.

Anyway...waste of money having to buy a jacket for a June and July league. I sweated through my pants halfway through my plate job yesterday so I don't think I'll be wearing that waste of money any time soon. Maybe I'll wear it while brushing off the snow on my car.

I ordered some shirts and numbers from a supplier and they convinced me to let them sew them on (new service). I described how my other shirts looked (distance off the shoulder, etc.) and they started giving me a hard time that "it couldn't be done that way". They finally listened and told me they understood.

Lo and behold, I get the shirts and they are a DISASTER. Did not follow instructions that they claimed to understand and the quality was horrible. Took a picture of my old shirts hanging next to the ones they prepared and the difference was obvious. BTW - they have a policy that embroidered shirts are not returnable - which I completely understand.

Sent them the picture and did not hear ANYTHING back. Nothing, I did not request a refund and the complaint was fairly mild. No acknowledgment whatsoever. Poor Customer Service if you ask me.

Now I only purchase the bare minimum from them and the vast majority of my business goes to the folks at UA. NEVER had a problem with them.

If a supplier needs to be told how to affix numbers on an umpire shirts, it's a huge red flag. The numbers should be affixed by every supplier in the one correct way.

Post who it was so others don't get numbers attached by them.

I hesitate to name them since they may have gotten their act together and this is may no longer be an issue. The quality issue was that the stitching was too far in on the "outer" color which enabled the numbers to curl.

Also, I had numbers and patches sewn on locally prior to this, so my intent was to have all of my shirts match. I am not saying what they did was "wrong", but it was not to my request to which they had agreed.

The part that stuck in my craw was the complete lack of acknowledgement of my dissatisfaction on their part.

So, I take my business elsewhere.

If anyone is THAT interested, I will pass the firm along in a message.

When I started out officiating in 2001, I got all of my stuff for both basketball and baseball from Honigs. Good quality, good service and I was satisfied. I noticed a trend over the years though; prices went up and quality went down. Their shirts seem to be made from different materials and are cut differently every year. I also noticed that their ultimate umpire pants fade badly. My originally charcoal gray pants now look more like heather gray after two seasons. I've never had a customer service issue with them.

The quality and price issues encouraged me to look elsewhere and today I buy nearly all of my gear from Ump Attire. I think Jim Kirk seems to make a real effort to listen to his customers and get himself in tune with the umpiring community. I've also been happy with their prices and quality. To me, Honigs seems to have been top dog for so long that they've started to take their market position and customers for granted, which is a very unwise move. With the proliferation of internet business, there are a ton of places officials can get their equipment.

I have always ordered my shirts and pants from Honigs and know how are sized for what I need to order. How does UA's sizes compare to Honigs' sizes? Is a 2XL the same cut from both. I have always liked the length of Honigs. Are the UA shirts long too?