The Official Forum - Mystery of the Consultative Plate Guy

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Men's Game... Me Bases, Plate, 1st year Assoc member. OK, perhaps I am not having my best game....

Me in "B"... low liner to SS, he dives forward for a shoestringer that to my best view is a catch.. I announce and show.. "THATS A CATCH". now from the ground he tosses ball to 2nd?! (Ugh.. did I botch this I wonder). I make no signal on throw to 2nd (no force).. but hearing "Was that a catch", and "What's the call" I said.. ball was caught and finally F4 TAGS R1 standing on 2nd and I call him out.

Notsobright offense must be whining to plate ump.. Now he comes WALKING out to me (me standing with slight incredulous look), "Uh, did you see him drop it" or some such. I say he caught it, play stands, two outs.. he leaves.

Later innings.. R2, me in "C" grounder to short.. he gets ball, takes a stab at R2 running by in front of him.. I qive a quick nothing sign.. and turn and make the out call at 1st on throw. They argue.. "I tagged him, didn't you see that!" (I did not).

Here comes Wandering Wally.... now I have a sincere incredulous look.. he says, "didn't you see that tag, he got him on the upper arm.." I say no tag play stands we continue.

Ah, you've now reached the questions!

Do you agree that Plate Guy should NEVER have taken those two walks?

If so, how many beers does he need to buy me for his contrition?

Or, is his crime so great that beers will not suffice and bludgeoning is the solution?

Da Moose is in the building.

If there's a next time throw your clicker at him.

rex

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by BJ Moose:
Men's Game... Me Bases, Plate, 1st year Assoc member. OK, perhaps I am not having my best game....

Me in "B"... low liner to SS, he dives forward for a shoestringer that to my best view is a catch.. I announce and show.. "THATS A CATCH". now from the ground he tosses ball to 2nd?! (Ugh.. did I botch this I wonder). I make no signal on throw to 2nd (no force).. but hearing "Was that a catch", and "What's the call" I said.. ball was caught and finally F4 TAGS R1 standing on 2nd and I call him out.

Notsobright offense must be whining to plate ump.. Now he comes WALKING out to me (me standing with slight incredulous look), "Uh, did you see him drop it" or some such. I say he caught it, play stands, two outs.. he leaves.

Later innings.. R2, me in "C" grounder to short.. he gets ball, takes a stab at R2 running by in front of him.. I qive a quick nothing sign.. and turn and make the out call at 1st on throw. They argue.. "I tagged him, didn't you see that!" (I did not).

Here comes Wandering Wally.... now I have a sincere incredulous look.. he says, "didn't you see that tag, he got him on the upper arm.." I say no tag play stands we continue.

Ah, you've now reached the questions!

Do you agree that Plate Guy should NEVER have taken those two walks?

If so, how many beers does he need to buy me for his contrition?

Or, is his crime so great that beers will not suffice and bludgeoning is the solution?

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
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You don't say, but I assume there is one runner on first, though lots of umpires these days are in B with a runner on third.

The fielder didn't think it was a catch because he flipped the ball to second to force out R1.

R1 also didn't think it was a catch, for he ran in an attempt to beat the play at second.

Here's an intance where I think you blew the call big time, whether you were right or wrong on the "catch."

The principle is known as "Let the players make the call."

The ball is hit into the glove directly or on a bounce, but it's very difficult to tell.

Wait a second or so.

There's no harm in that. Meanwhile, you give the runner and the fielder a chance to sell the call for you. In that instance you appear to be the only person who thought it was a catch. That does not mean you were wrong; it merely means you could have saved yourselve plenty of trouble by going with the result everybody else saw.

You know, umpires do that routinely in two other instances.

1. The outfielder dives for the catch and comes up with his glove in the air. You call out, whether you saw him catch it or not. If he starts peering around, you call safe, even though the ball might be in his glove.

2. A similar play happens on the steal of second. The untrained amateur sees the runner tagged in advance of the base and screams "He's out!" before the runner finishes his slide.

That's very bad timing.

How many times have you seen your partner do that, only to have the runner overslide second? What does the fielder always do? He goes for him again! That says to everyone, true or not, "Gosh, I missed him the first time, but I won't the second."

The plate umpire still has no business getting involved -- in either play.

Be sure to check out our home page. You'll find we are unlike -- and superior -- to any other site devoted to officials on the Internet.

That's a flat out fact!

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Papa C
Editor, eUmpire

The principle is known as "Let the players make the call."

Papa C I understand what you are saying but aren't players taught - not to take things for granted?

In other words the bottom line in the above example is to get an out. F6 would have probably flipped the ball to F4 whether he thought he made a catch or not just to be on the safe side.

The umpire is the one who has to sell the call. If you see a liner, I agree wait and make sure - If it is indeed a catch - let everyone in the park no it so there is no confusion about the call - WE HAVE A CATCH WE HAVE A CATCH.

Sometimes the player isn't selling the play but just making sure he gets an out.

Now if you are really unsure about the call, then the players raction most likely will lead one to the correct call.

Pete Booth

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by PeteBooth:

The principle is known as "Let the players make the call."

Papa C I understand what you are saying but aren't players taught - not to take things for granted?

In other words the bottom line in the above example is to get an out. F6 would have probably flipped the ball to F4 whether he thought he made a catch or not just to be on the safe side.

The umpire is the one who has to sell the call. If you see a liner, I agree wait and make sure - If it is indeed a catch - let everyone in the park no it so there is no confusion about the call - WE HAVE A CATCH WE HAVE A CATCH.

Sometimes the player isn't selling the play but just making sure he gets an out.

Now if you are really unsure about the call, then the players raction most likely will lead one to the correct call.

Pete Booth<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

++++++++
Pete, I've been doing this for nearly 50 years. Shock me someday and just accept what I say. You know, I might be right.

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Papa C
Editor, eUmpire

Bludgeoning is not the solution for a very simple reason. You wouldn't get the beer!!

Oh, I forgot. You get cheeseburgers.

Never mind.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by rex:
Da Moose is in the building.

If there's a next time throw your clicker at him.

rex<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

NOW you should know that REAL MANLY MEN Umpires NEVER have an "indicatorclicker" out on the bases!!

As oft said.. I gave up my "blanky" years ago....

Uh oh... INCOMING......!!!

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by BJ Moose:
NOW you should know that REAL MANLY MEN Umpires NEVER have an "indicatorclicker" out on the bases!!

As oft said.. I gave up my "blanky" years ago....

Uh oh... INCOMING......!!!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

+++++++++++
Mike: (BJ)

You'll find we're just a tad more serious here than on the Boards you're more accustomed to.

"Issues" such as bopping your partner and carrying an indicator on the bases are inferior to the question of how umpires call the very difficult line-drive-at-the-shoetops play.

There is never "in-coming" here at eUmpire.

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Papa C
Editor, eUmpire