The Darkest of the Darkside
 

Well folks, it has happened:

71 days after my retirement from umpiring I have been approached to manage (coach) a 30 and over team in the local adult league.

The team is made up of 22 all-stars that did not want to join any other teams.

Who'd of thunk it . . . yrs trly a "RAT" . . . this could be interesting.

Regards,

Advantage
 

Well, you will know all of the Umpires, and you can keep your rats under control and give them some tips

Time for a pool! How many times will Tim get the hook in his managerial debut season of adult babysitting?

I will go with ZERO on the hook pool, since good umps generally know where the line is. However, I wonder if "22 all-stars that did not want to join other teams" is somewhat tongue in cheek..??

My goodness gracious!

Ain't life funny some times?

I'm waiting to see where they set the over/under on how many games before Tim gets dumped.

Knowing where the line is and not crossing it are two different things.

In retrospect, I found coaching much more stressful than umpiring. You'll have to let us know how it goes if you accept the offer.

JM

No disagreement here! I coached youth football, not baseball, but it was enough to make me want to start drinking at times.

Heaven help any umpire that kicks a ruling in one of Tim's games.

I'll start the book, but two things need to be known:

How many games in the season, and how many of the umpires are known to him?

:eek: You know the rules and how to bend them without breaking them. Just remember to let the umpires umpire (which I am sure you will). But above all, if it comes down to "getting the hook", please, please - get your money's worth! (heh, heh, heh!) :D

[QUOTE]HOWEVER, when TEE is coaching he is a COACH not an umpire. Of coarse with Tee's experience he knows the rules and that will help, but his PRIME responsibility should he take the job is to COACH not umpire.

Will he give the men / women in blue a "break" - most likely but in the heat of battle if an official blows one BIG time sometimes it's a natural reaction to argue for your team. However, I think TEE would argue with class as opposed to coming out ala Lou Pinella.

3 separate and DISTINCT functions.

1. Players play meaning you do not want players acting as coaches as that can be disruptive to the team.

2. Coaches COACH meaning THEY are in charge of THEIR team.

3. Umpires Officiate meaning they are in control of the GAME.

Pete Booth

[QUOTE]Happy New Year Tee

If you do come out an argue a call do not give that DREADFUL line that all of us have heard many times.

" You know I am a certified umpire with xxx yrs of experience and you were out of position etc. etc. etc."

I am pretty certain most of us hate it when a coach suddenly turns into Steve Palermo "on the spot"

If you do decide and take the job - come back with some stories.

Pete Booth

The Darkest of the Darkside
 

Never let it be said that God doesn't have a GREAT sense of humor and can take us out of our comfort zone.

Hmmmm.....Head Cheese to Head Rat....
Remember - be a good example. Whatever you do, your players will perceive as being acceptable.

JJ

PS Just what DID you do to get this "honor"? I remember when Michael Jordan gave up basketball to ride the bus and play minor league baseball, and rumor had it that was punishment for something or other...for you to switch from umpire to coach you must've done something REALLY REALLY bad...;)

Just curious. How many of you actually were a manager/head coach (assistant doesn't count)?

It's a whole different world.

Manager of 3 teams.
LL Majors 1973
Babe Ruth 1976 - 1977
Senior Babe Ruth 1978
3 great teams, great kids, hard players.

Some answers
 

I guess I am just pretty well known as an umpire (BTW, I did not umpire any games in Senior Adult EVER). Just being old and someone who knows baseball might have made a difference. One of the Major Awards I won this year was from the Active and Old Timers Associaiton. A lot of these players attend that dinner as it embraces all Oregonians that have played professional baseball.

I could never go that way. I am way to committed to umpiring (remember I am going to be named a lifetime memeber of my local group, I will still teach at the statewide three umpire clinic, I am still the Secretary of the Fed State Baseball Umpire Committee, I am still an editorial member of the NFHS Magazine High School Today and that simple statement bothers me more than any other.)

I hope that I can talk to umpires (all of the umpires that will work these games are my brothers for my local associaiton.) Being they are working OBR I will need to be understanding.

Actually these are the best individual players in the +30 league. They are banding together (BTW, they are all going to wear uniforms they already own from past teams -- kinda like the Arizona Fall League All-Stars -- few of them will match).

I cannot picture a "Bobby Cox" moment IF I select to take on this task.

Regards,

I hope that you reflect on your body of work and choose to go out as an umpire.

12 years, all head coach, ages 7-18 (as my kids aged up). Some years multiple teams, head on one team assistant on another (2 sons). Numerous post season tournament coaching opportunities. Only 1 losing season, and career winning percentage is likely in the 75% range.

I actually took up umpiring high school during this time, and always planned to continue umpiring when I hung up the clipboard.

I was also a League Commissioner 3 or 4 years and Babe Ruth District Commissioner for 3 or 4 years during this time.

Tee should NOT go out and talk to the officials as an umpire but as a COACH. Tee can speak for himself but IMO he was referring to the MANNER in which he might come out and talk to the officials and that MANNER is not Bobby Cox like who holds the record for getting tossed. That IMO is what Tee was referring to.

I believe most of us do not want a coach giving us an "umpire lecture" out there on the field similar to us as officials telling a coach how to coach his team.

As I stated in a previous post, each particpant in the game has a separate and distinct function. If Tee does decide to take the coaching job his job is that of a COACH and not an umpire. If he does in fact request TIME and talk to the officials he talks to them in a civil tone (which I believe Tee would) BUT talks to them as a coach NOT an umpire. Obviously it can help your team when you are an umpire and KNOW the rules, BUT the bottom line is you are now the COACH with a different role.

Pete Booth

In was not referring to Tee "going out" on the umpires. I interpreted his post as saying he had not yet decided to take the coaching position. Tee's reputation is based on an incredibly solid body of work as an umpire and I was just voicing my hope that he when he left baseball, it would be as an umpire, not a coach.

Sometimes
 

Maybe I should be smart enough to listen to those who give great advice.

Thanks.

I can't wait to throw Tim out of a game! :D

Quote:
"Tee's reputation is based on an incredibly solid body of work as an umpire and I was just voicing my hope that he when he left baseball, it would be as an umpire, not a coach."
Baseball men never leave baseball.

This practice is not allowed in the SDABL (NABA) league here. The term "uniform" is taken quite literally, and they want their teams to dress alike.

BTW, I just did two SDABL Championships today and have another tomorrow for the 28A Division. Not bad for a league rookie umpire. I was also given high praise after today's morning game for my plate work by none other than the league president and the division commissioner. I'm enjoying umpiring this far more than the high school ball.

Five years of little league with two differents sons, and also two years as a head freshman coach at the high school level. I loved coaching and prefer it to umpiring. However, the time committments at the high school level were just too much for me especially still having kids that play (used to have four, down to one now). Freshman doubleheaders around here are played at 10am so I didn't miss any of my kids games but it was tough to do that and get my hours in at work (I am not a teacher). I loved it though.

I had umpired for several years before I coached high school so I knew how to treat umpires, plus I had worked with some of the guys. I didn't let my kids give umpires any grief or disrespect; if they did they sat. I told them that the umpires would be at least as good at umpiring as they were at playing at this stage in their development so they had no room to complain. I also had a meeting with my parents before the season started and told them that I and the school expected them to treat the game officials with courtesy and respect as well, and if they didn't they would be asked to leave. Had one problem in two years, told the parent to be quiet or they would have to leave and they shut up. No matter how good or bad I thought the umps were at my games, win or lose, I always thanked them at the end of the day for coming out. It isn't easy to find guys willing to work freshman games.

Parent issues are the biggest problem as everyone thinks that their kid is the next Derek Jeter. In high school, I told parents that I would never discuss playing time with them and I didn't. Of course my philosophy was that everyone played in one game or the other of each doubleheader so that diffused a lot of problems, but I would have some kids play a partial game if I had more than 18 players on occasion. I would discuss it with the kid, never the parent. I miss coaching, and actually loved practice more than the games in some respects. I enjoyed teaching the game to the kids because I love it so much myself. Umpiring is a way for me to stay around the game I love while still being able to maintain as much free time as I want to have.

Yes, but
 

But it is the same game, and a manager is in the same position as an umpire, you are there to facilitate the players being able to play, learn, and enjoy the game. Therefore, Tee can do the job if he wants to do it the right way.

He can't be Bobby Cox, but you don't have to be Bobby Cox to win.

I am still confused Tee, why give up umpiring? I have not heard a good reason yet from you about it! :eek:

No offense intended...but does he need to give us a reason?

G
 

No Offense taken.

I'm unsuccessfully trying to pull Tee's chain a little bit, but I am sad anyone retires from officiating, unless they are physically unable to do it anymore. From what I remember, Tee is retiring for other reasons, which I hate to hear about.

jk
 

John:

I thought I was crystal clear in "why" I retired from active umpiring:

I strongly dislike umpiring games.

Each year for the last four years I have worked fewer games each year in an attempt to enjoy wasting from 3 to 4 hours a day to work games.

Let me explain that last statement:

I feel that umpires need to have both a well thoughtout and complete pregame meeting with their partners. I also believe that there is a great opportunity to teach umpiring by post game conversations. Add to that travel during rush hour in the PDX area the committment of time (mostly away from my job) AND the fact that parents attend games things just quit being enjoyable.

John, I have also made it clear that I am applying for a "Lifetime Membership" with my local association. If I am elected to that prestigious membership then I can do everything if my local group (teach, evaluate, be a board member, etc.) with the exception of umpiring games.

This has to be a "win-win", right? Why on earth would anyone "question" when ANYONE retires at the top of their game rather than waiting until they make a joke of themselves?

As I said before: "It is much better to retire two years too early rather than one year too late!"

Respectfully,

I raise a glass in a toast to you Tee!!!!!! I have read your articles and posts and have gained a better knowledge of the game from them. It's sad to see a great one step away from the game but worse yet to not have him enjoy the work anymore. Have a happy time in your new vocation.

Sorry T
 

I am still in shock you are retiring, so the reasons why never really sunk in. My apologies.

Still, I hope the itch comes back and you scratch it!

I'm getting close myself. For me it's the combination of the hassle of coming back after a non-baseball related injury & not enjoying umpiring as much as the past. I may decide to take this year off (I'm on the shelf until March 1 at best anyway) & just evaluate, then see what happens next year.

You're supposed to coach then retire into umpiring work Tim...you got it bass ackwards!:D

I too will slither through the pipe and come up on the other side of the lines as a rat; RESPONSIBLE ATHLETICS TUTOR.
The day has come, my grand stud asked me (twins now mind ya), "will you coach my bb team"..
I quickly duck into the kitchen and started peeling a couple onions, ya know don't want the boy to see me tearing up a bit. Well ah, hmmm, YES.
No hope a seeing most you guys for a while, class of 2021.
Were going minor LL, don't know yet, coach, machine or live meat, pitching. Can not wait, what April kick off, here in the great NW?
31Yrs blue, 1977-2008, every age of LL, then select in the summers and some summer collegiate.
17* years. 1982-1997, coach (that first year), manager the rest, LL, JR, SR, BR, SRBR.
4 district champs, best we did at state (BR) was a second and a 3rd.
The * was league Pres. 2 yrs of that, finally ran outta of excuses to Momma.
Went to blue full time in 2000, pulled the plug after 08 season.
First thing meet the team, schedule a "parent meeting". I'm doing the talking, my expectations for parent behavior are clearly expressed, with really only three items, practice time, playing time, and reaction to an umpires decision, my job and my job only; coaches and players; extra exspecially sportsman like.
One troubled parent in the stands in all those years..and if I remember correctly it was at about this age group maybe 9-10.
Anyway just warning ya.. come to my field waiting for "come on blue wake up out there.. how can you sleep with all these lights on, your wife know your.."... sorry, you just won't get it from my side, just me whispering in your ear with a lineup card in my hand, "man, 12 for 8, shoot, this kids tough, we teach the kids not to swing at those...
Good luck, call em as ya see em.

Well, since you went from rat to umpire to start with, the transition back should be really smooth!:p

Hell, I was a rat and an umpire at the same time, somtimes the same day.

The first year I umpired, I was also the pitching coach for a team that played in the area that our association covered. One classic moment was after I coached the varsity team, I went upstairs, changed into my gear and was the base umpire for the JV game. My partner and I go to the plate, and as we are introducing ourselves to the coaches, the coach from the visiting team shakes my hand and then does a double take.

“Aren’t you a coach on that team?”

“Yes, but the other umpire had to leave and so I am taking his place.”

My partner had to re-assure the coach that I was indeed certified and pretty much put his own reputation on the line, telling the coach that he wouldn’t have any complaints about how I worked the bases.

I thought it was pretty easy to separate coach from umpire.