Protection
 

Adrian Beltre of Seattle was put on the disabled list last week after being hit in the groin by a ground ball while he was playing 3B and not wearing a cup. He wound up with a bruised testicle. It got me to thinking - do you wear a cup while working the bases?

Chris Wright
Brooklyn, NY

That's a little personal don't you think? Maybe try taking me out for a drink or 2 before springing something like this. Or dinner and movie even.

Anyways... no. I am always moving to get away from the ball when it is hit. Players should be moving to get in the way of the ball, and this is the exact reason why most youth rules state you have to wear a cup, even when in the field.

Chris, protection of my family jewels is a personal thing and I will only discuss this with my priest. But thanks for asking.

Yes.

As someone once posted, I even wear one when I watch a game on TV.

I don't wear one when I'm working the bases.

I don't wear one on the bases either.

Yes. It doesn't bother me and I don't want to take one of those "1-in-a-million" shots and then wish I had been wearing it.

I don't wear protection on the bases. However, I was almost convinced after I took a line shot off the thigh in the B position. To date, I still do not wear a cup.

Nope, not on the bases.

Hehehehe
 

Mr Jenkins, it was Dave Heavrelo (ex A's and M's relief pitcher) that turned that phrase.

I always wore a cup on the bases.

I don't, although I guess when I get to the level where such things matter, I'll do as the higher up say and throw one in with a face like the guy from the Enzyte commercials, smilin' Bob.

For some reason, when behind the plate, it doesn't bother me as much because I already have all the other stuff on. On the bases I don't wear long McDavid's, so I enjoy feeling the breeze to the fullest extent.

If you must know...

Maybe you could light some candles... a little soft music...

Throw one in? THROW ONE IN? THROW ONE IN?????

WTF are you talking about?

I don't, but again I'm not trying to get in front of the ball, like Beltre was doing.

Placing a protective unit, also known as a cup, in the sleeve of a compression short or jock strap in a place in which its purpose would be to minimize any harm done, in my case, to anatomical parts that are unique to males. I'm not talking about the missing rib.

Was this slightly less vague? :rolleyes:

Yes.

Perhaps it's a generational thing. I've always put a cup on. I've never "thrown one in"...at least not a cup.:D

I wear a cup any time I'm on the baseball field

At what level does wanting to protect your "boys" at all costs come into play?

And that's juuuuuuuust a bit too much information!:D

No cup on bases. I was middle infielder when I played and I can move away from them now almost as easily as I could move in front of them then. Never been hit (knock, knock, knock). When I get hit on bases I will hang it up.

Not sure, I'll let you know if I get to it! :p

The octogon

I was watching Beltre taking grounders when he first came up with the Dodgers in 1998. He made two absolutely unconscious stabs, including a bad hop right at his jewels. One of his coaches commented on his quick hands: "Where'd you get such quick hands?" His reply was, "I never wore a cup, so I learned real quick." (The conversation was in Spanish, but it was translated by the coach.)

It took a dozen years to catch up to him.

I wear a cup at all times, like Brian said. I too was an infelder--third base and short--and I still move better than most guys my age due to that. But I am also a bright person without a colossal ego that makes me think I can get the center of my body out of the way of any thrown or batted ball like some people insist they can. So it's a no-brainer. I suppose you can get away without one doing youth ball, but at any level of true hardball, it can be a sign of both stupidity and misplaced pride to go without a cup on the bases.

My lone personal experience: My son was pitching in a tournament in Arizona a couple of years back. He walked a guy and then tried to pick him off. His uncaught bullet throw clipped the corner of the bag and deflected directly into the U1's jewels (three-man). The umpire was laid out on the ground, screaming and kicking his legs and rolling in the dirt. He was eventually carted to an ambulance on a groundskeeper's cart and taken to a hospital. After that experience, I no longer felt like a wuss for wearing my cup on the bases. I spend more on Gold Bond each year, but it's well worth it.

No.

Do you think that only the slow and feeble get hit? Weird things happen.

I thought of another: I didn't see it happen, but I got the story from many brothers, and the guy himself: The single most athletic and youthful and skillful umpire in our local JUCO and H.S. associations got drilled in the thigh by a ball that glanced off the pitcher's foot. He had a bruise the size of a football. A few inches up and he loses or bruises a jewel. He's an ex-D-I and professional player and was extremely proud of his mobility and skills---until he got drilled by a ricochet. He also never wore a cup on the bases---until he got drilled by a ricochet.

I just can't imagine a single benefit to going without one on the bases. A barely discernible degree of added comfort is worth risking one of the most painful injuries one can suffer on a diamond?? ... I simply don't relate to that level of totally needless risk-taking.

Others, however, do relate. It really simply is a risk-reward calculation. So some have made a choice based on their assessment of the risk (probability of occurrence) relative to the discomfort or whatever. We all make these choices every day in every aspect of our lives. Should I drive 60 instead of 55? The risk of death is higher at 60 than 45. Hell at 5 mph, its probably damn near impossible to die in a car wreck...

Everyone has his own subjective taste and preferences for things like risk. So it might also be more than "a sign of both stupidity and misplaced pride to go without a cup on the bases. " In fact, it likely is something else.

Unless, of course, the other car is doing 70.:D

Welllll as long as we are getting close up and personal. I started wearing compression pants this year with the cup holder sewn in. Couldn’t stand the feel of it. Seemed like I was always adjusting, if you know what I mean. Went back to the strap. Much better because it floats and yes I do wear one on the bases. I'll bet you my next game fee that Beltre does too.

The risk is worth the reward. And the reward is ... ??

Equating it to doing something necessary like driving is specious as hell, but it was entertaining to read. Risk-reward calculation ... that's some funny stuff.

He said the reward was not having to put up with the "discomfort or whatever".

The driving thing makes sense. If you drive faster you get there quicker but it is more dangerous. Some people wear smaller chest protectors which don't protect as well. They understand that the protection isn't as great as a West Vest model but they prefer one which is cooler and lighter. They don't think the extra protection is worth having to deal with the heavier and hotter chest protector.

Of course it makes sense ... to you.

There is virtually nothing that can happen to us on a baseball field that is more painful than a jewel shot. A dull thud to the chest and the resultant soreness to the general chest area due to an inadequate soft shell is not even in the same area code as a jewel shot.

Oh, I'm sorry; that car thing really isn't a specious comparison. It's quite cogent, actually. Wow, you opened my eyes!

Okay, LDUB, now what do you think?

I guess I have different idea of what constitutes "floating".

I used to wear a compression short in which only the top of the cupholder was sewn, or attached. It floated, meaning it moved around considerably, especially behind the plate.

I now wear compression shorts in which the cup holder is sewn on all sides and stays firmly in place. I wear this both behind the plate and on the bases.

Regarding "risk/rewad"...anyone making the decision not to wear a cup on this basis, IMO, does not fulliy comprehend the risk. Losing a testical is a real and PAINFUL risk.

Try the Shock Doctor compression shorts. The cup stays where it belongs and floats along with your movements.

The point of the car example was less one comparability with a shot to one's gonads and more one of illustration about risk-reward trade offs; after all life is full of trade offs we all make every day.

Anyway, while maybe not more painful, a line drive to one's carotid artery could have more dire consequences, ie death. I choose not to wear a mask and a throat guard while I work the bases for lots of reasons you may or may not find humorous, but I risk death. (A man was killed recently at Lynchburg College in Virginia, when a batted ball struck him in the neck.) I find this trade off acceptable, however. I'm guessing, as do you. So, as humorous as you may find this example, it again makes the point that everyday choice often times requires trades of risk vs. reward.

And again, what exactly is the "reward?" I find no difference in mobility wearing one or not wearing one. At the HS level and up, I'm putting one in.

For all of you guys that are adamant that everyone wear a cup on the bases, you can come and check the rest of us before games if you're that worried about it. They're our balls, not yours, so who cares?

For anyone interested, the Nutty Buddy doesn't move hardly at all if worn properly. I wear boxer briefs, then the cup, then a regular jock strap over the top of it, then plain compression shorts with no pocket on the top. It's how they instruct you to wear it and it works very well.

You find no differnece; others do. That's the choice (i.e., "risk -reward") they make.

Like you, I choose to wear one.

Yeah!! Besides, real men go commando!!

:D

Another example could be the use of a hockey style mask. A standard mask as well as a hockey mask offer the same level of protection for a shot to the face. The hockey mask also protects the top, sides, and back of the head while the standard mask does not. Many people do not use the hockey mask even though the protection to the top, sides, and back of the head is far superior. For one reason or another many people prefer the standard mask. Parts of the head are left unprotected but the chances of getting hit in those areas are so low that many people don't feel the need to protect them.

It is the same thing with wearing a cup. For one reason or another many people don't like wearing one. They understand that the odds of them getting hit in the cup are so low that they don't feel the need to wear it.

Sorry to ride you, Tony.

I realize that there are other shots that could kill you or knock you cold, but they are all less painful than a split jewel.

Anyway, I cruise the L.A. freeways at between 75 and 80 m.p.h. every single day. I have taken street bikes up to 125 m.p.h. on the coast highway or the canyons and have woven through cars at 90 m.p.h. on freeways. And I have done performance driving in commercials. I absolutely love racing and driving the hell out of a good car. It's a riskier thing than going the limit, but I weigh it and do it.

I would still never go onto a baseball field to perform any function whatsoever without a cup. There is no measurable reward.

You find no reward; others do. That's the choice (i.e., "risk -reward") they make.

The issue is SOLELY about the degree of pain and damage a shot to the jewels causes. The odds of getting hit are irrelevant. If you get hit, it is intolerable, and can be horrifically injurious. If it were ankle or shin protection we were discussing, then that risk/reward thing and odds of getting hit would be relevant. There is ZERO tolerance to a jewel shot. So odds on getting hit are irrelevant.

The exit speed of a 90 m.p.h. fastball struck by a big slugger with a metal bat can reach 115 m.p.h. even at the H.S. level. I would say that a foot or head can move in time to avoid being struck. The center of one's body cannot.

Never suggested that there was a measurable reward, merely suggested that we make trade offs based on subjective evaluation. That's why we have aphorisms like "to each his own." The things that you do that are risky have no measurable reward either. They don't need to measurable.

As for what is the reward? Bob is right, just because you don't see a "reward" doesn't mean there isn't. Eg, a reward may be "I don't feel like a dork when I don't wear a cup on the bases and I do feel like a dork when I do." You don't have to agree with anyone's preferences, just understand that he has them and they may be different than yours.

Do you wear a cup when you walk down the street? I assume you don't. Of course you may get hit by some very fast moving hard object and it would be horrific as you say, but the odds of it happening are so so low that you don't do wear the cup. You've made the decision that the odds of getting hit are low enough for you to not wear the protection. Other people make that same decision on the baseball field when they chose to not wear a cup.

So you had rather endanger your life plus the life of others by driving recklessly on the highway, but you make a big deal about whether one should or should not wear a cup on the bases. Interesting.

Some people do. Not me, but some people.

Do you get along with anybody when you umpire baseball games?

Did I say that I drive recklessly? No, I said that I drive fast.

I don't. I drive with high-level skill and training. I have no accidents, and one ticket in 20 years.

If you are so devoid of skill that going 80 is reckless, then by all means, go slower and stay out of the way.

Some yokels would have a hard time driving out here in SoCal. We change tires at 70 MPH.;)

:D

A guy who drives the speed limit on the Southern California freeways is known as a road hazard.

Do you wear a cup when you ride? I mean, what happens if you get tossed from the bike... you could end up with a busted nut. One leg goes on one side of the street sign, the other goes on the other side. Ouchies.

I guess there is no measurable reward for wearing not wearing one to sleep either, you know, just in case...

Enough time to turn... which would be my first reaction anytime a ball is hit towards me and I have no time to decide how to get out of the way. Its just instinct. Nobody is going to stare at the ball and decide to step right or left if there is no time to do so. In fact, turning, for a skinny guy like me, would result in less times getting hit to begin with, and certainly take jewel shot out.

Now, on the play someone discussed where the ball clipped the bag and kicked up, yup, could happen to anyone. So could alot of things...

To each his own, I say.

To each his own, and best of luck with those skills on a deflected bullet at the jewels. The worst case I ever saw was on a deflected throw.

Lets change your post just a bit.

Given that death is likely worse, even in your estimation, than a jewel shot and the probability is not important as you stated earlier, I don't understand why you wouldn't advocate wearing a mask and throat guard on the bases. My argument in this case as in the other is about assessing appropriate trade offs (subjective to the assessor alone) and making the appropriate choice or for short risk-reward decisions.

You didn't have to say recklessly, you described it. I suppose you tailgate when a car is going slower until you can get around it.

What are you? A Hollywood stuntman. It just takes but one time and they will carting you off to the morgue. Hopefully, you won't be taking someone else with you.

My driving skills are fine, thank you. I love it when a car flies by and all they do is beat me to the next red light.

I have been knocked cold (not in a baseball setting). Let me tell you: You barely feel a thing. :D Even a brushing of the jewels with a cup on hurts more than a clean one to the chin.

Degree of pain was the point, not catastrophic injury. Also, earlier in this debate, I clearly emphasized how much easier it is to move one's head (or foot) out of the way than the core of one's body. You simply have a markedly poorer ability to avoid getting drilled in the midsection than the head or neck. I boxed (mostly sparred, really) in addition to playing baseball. It is a simple fact that avoiding or slipping a head blow is drastically easier than dodging a blow to the midsection. So let's not talk percentages on that one, because it truly is different in terms of ability to dodge such a shot. The other thing that makes a head or neck blow easier to dodge, slip or cover up from is that the arms and hands work to cover up one's face and neck more completely, and again, markedly more quickly than when fending off a blow to the jewel area. And like I stated more than once, you can be Ozzie Smith and you will be able to do absolutely nothing about a deflection.

And this is one of those posts that I rush to type and post so that my wife or daughter doesn't walk in and look over my shoulder and read it, and turn it into one of those this-is-what-you-old-umpires-talk-about humiliations.

LOL. You get that too? My wife would ride me good if she read this one.:D

I suppose it's preferable to having no woman around. :)

The fact is that your brain is smart. It knows when you aren't getting out of the way. Its the reason a batter turns, a boxer leans, or a biker (moto or bicycle) lays the bike down.

If a ball is coming at me, my brain will know if I'm screwed or not. If not, I'll dodge dive dip duck dodge.

If I am screwed, I'm turning. And hence, not getting hit in heart, ribs, stomach, balls.

Deflection, you're right, but if its deflected I'm screwed regardless.

The head coach from the University of Pittsburgh got nailed a couple of years ago by a foul ball while standing in the entrance to the dugout, of all places. He lost a testicle. If that happened to me, I'd be wearing a cup anytime I was on the field, or in the dugout, or making a trip to the mound, or filling out my lineup card before the game, or getting a soda in the clubhouse....
Yep, I wear one on the field...

JJ

Stuff happens. Then our hats should be helmets to...while BU

Just wait.

I have not worn a cup on the base and will not... how in the hell so some of you guys get hit with a ball... so you know you can move out of the way?...

Hmmm,
 

I do not know one single (or married for that matter) D1 umpire that HAS NOT been hit at least once when working inside.

41 years I was hit ONCE and boy did that heat seeking missle find me no matter where I went.

Ask RichMSN he took one square in the wallet!

I wear a cup on the bases. Why? Because I want to and they're my jewels to protect. I don't care if anybody else does or not but that's what works for me.

This reminds me of the debate I see between those that carry a concealed weapon and those that don't on other forums.