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-   -   Which rules do you enforce (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/53396-rules-do-you-enforce.html)

johnnyg08 Thu May 28, 2009 10:23am
I think I remember reading it in PBUC. I post it tonight when I have the book to reference.

bob jenkins Thu May 28, 2009 12:02pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyg08 (Post 605139)
I think I remember reading it in PBUC. I post it tonight when I have the book to reference.

It is in there. But, your previous post said it was in the rules book. They are not the same thing.

johnnyg08 Thu May 28, 2009 12:09pm
I did say that. I suppose it's more of a mechanic since it's not in the rule book.

cbfoulds Thu May 28, 2009 02:58pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by PeteBooth (Post 604895)


Francona was referring to the fact that Met third base coach Manny Acta grabbed Sheffield after Sheffield rounded thrid base thinking that the ball was an HR to begin with.
Does Manny have 2 jobs? A new/old job? A son/ dad working for the Mets?
The Washington Nationals still list him as their Manager.

Given the way the Nats' season is going, I suppose there could have been a personnel change I missed in the papers.

justanotherblue Thu May 28, 2009 05:39pm
hmmmmm, rumor has it, same umpire that dumped the announcer a couple years back....enough said:rolleyes:

As far as the OP, I try to rule with the book not by the book, for instance, one of the rules I generally ignore unless a coach complains is 6.1.3. Pitcher using the set position with no runners on base. By the book rule, an illegal pitch shall be declared and a ball added to the count, for the pitcher not coming to a complete stop. I have a hard time awarding the offense when no advantage is gained by the pitcher by not stoping completly with no base runners.

KJUmp Thu May 28, 2009 07:46pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbfoulds (Post 605228)
Does Manny have 2 jobs? A new/old job? A son/ dad working for the Mets?
The Washington Nationals still list him as their Manager.

Given the way the Nats' season is going, I suppose there could have been a personnel change I missed in the papers.
Razor Shines is the Mets 3B coach.

KJUmp Thu May 28, 2009 07:54pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue37 (Post 605095)
Great question.

I am a firm believer in situational ethics, and I am a firm believer in situational officiating. I take the following into account: The age of the participants, the skill level of the participants, the score of the game, the history between the teams, the presence of an observer, and most importantly, the expectations of the league and the assignor.

I do not want this post to get too long, so I will stick with one example, balks. The older the player, the better the skills, the closer the game, the tighter I will call the balks. If the teams want balks called tighter or if my assignor wants balks called tighter, I will oblige. The presence of an observer impacts how I call. I am fairly strict to start with, and am even less likely to let something slide if an observer is present.

It has been said that our customer is the game itself, and, in part, that is true, but the game does not assign me, and does not write my checks. I try to ascertain what my assignor and the leagues want called and how they want it called, and adjust to those expectations.
Blue: IMO you hit the nail square on the head in the first two sentences of your post. The league/assignor is our customer...give them the type of umpired game they want.

Dave Reed Fri May 29, 2009 12:51am
johnnyg08 and bob jenkins,
Actually the rule regarding when to give the pitcher a new ball after a home run is in the rules:

Rule 3.01(e) Comment: The umpire shall not give an alternate ball to the pitcher until play has ended and the previously used ball is dead. After a thrown or batted ball goes out of the playing field, play shall not be resumed with an alternate ball until the runners have reached the bases to which they are entitled. After a home run is hit out of the playing grounds, the umpire shall not deliver a new ball to the pitcher or the catcher until the batter hitting the home run has crossed the plate.

On the other hand, I didn't find it the PBUC Manual!

Thanks for pointing out the rule--I had completely forgotten it.

tballump Fri May 29, 2009 04:22am
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyg08 (Post 605101)
How many of you wait to give the pitcher the ball until the batter/runner crosses home plate? Sometimes I wait, sometimes I don't. What is your rationale for doing so? The PBUC and MLBUM says to wait until the runner crosses home plate before giving the pitcher a new ball.
Rumor has it that in the old days, a pitcher was given the ball before batter/runner crossed home plate, the pitcher got PO'd (maybe runner said something) and drilled the runner as he was headed home (or maybe another base). So, PBUC and MBLUM wait.

ozzy6900 Fri May 29, 2009 06:29am
Quote:
Originally Posted by tballump (Post 605364)
Rumor has it that in the old days, a pitcher was given the ball before batter/runner crossed home plate, the pitcher got PO'd (maybe runner said something) and drilled the runner as he was headed home (or maybe another base). So, PBUC and MBLUM wait.
That is not a rumor, that is the exact reason why the pitcher was not allowed to have a ball until the BR crossed the plate! The rule was penned into the book in the late 1880's because the players were getting rowdy and the fans were leaving the games.

Remember, in the late 1800's, it was not proper to have public altercations in mixed company (ladies & gentlemen). the ladies left the game pretty much and that is when the "on field fighting" started. For the most part, ladies of any respect, would not attend a baseball game from about 1893 on into the 20th Century. Women that did "hang around" or attend games in that era were not "Ladies".

johnnyg08 Fri May 29, 2009 08:00am
Well, I think my version of PBUC has it written on page 31. Check there. When I checked MLBUM, I didn't see it in there though. (I may have missed it though)

DG Fri May 29, 2009 09:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnyg08 (Post 604900)
Another one...if neither teams says anything about the "gorilla arm" do you just let it go until the other team asks you to enforce it?
The gorilla arm was an interpretation from 2005. It has never made it to the rule book or case book, and I dare say there are few if any coaches who know about it and very few umpires. I have never seen it called by any of my peers. I have never heard it mentioned during a game by anyone. So I don't call it. There is my answer to Pete's question.

SanDiegoSteve Fri May 29, 2009 11:33pm
Another one...if neither teams says anything about the "gorilla arm" do you just let it go until the other team asks you to enforce it?
I apologize for being really dense here, but I don't recall the term. Can someone tell me what "gorilla arm" translates into?

DG Fri May 29, 2009 11:37pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve (Post 605615)
Another one...if neither teams says anything about the "gorilla arm" do you just let it go until the other team asks you to enforce it?
I apologize for being really dense here, but I don't recall the term. Can someone tell me what "gorilla arm" translates into?
From the 2005 Interps:

SITUATION #5: While in the set position, F1 has his pitching hand down in front of his body, swinging slowly as he gets the sign from the catcher. RULING: The use of this “gorilla” stance in the set position is illegal. A pitcher, for the set position, shall have his pitching hand down at his side or behind his back. (6-1-3)

Paul L Fri May 29, 2009 11:58pm
The gorilla arm was a trademark of the late Rod Beck, at least when he was closing for the SF Giants back in the mid-90's. AFAIK, no one complained, including the umpires.


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