Fair/Foul Two Man Crew Situation (From a Dad)

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by GA Umpire

No coach should ever do this or any parent. Only fellow umpires that this umpire KNOWS is an umpire. Otherwise, go to the UIC and let him know so he can explain the rule to the umpire if the umpire is willing to listen to anyone.

Do not approach the umpire with a rule book b/c nothing good may come of it.

Why not? I can see not doing that during the game, of course, but what is wrong with approaching someone who kicked the living sh*t out of a rule in the game in a nice manner to enlighten them of the rules after the game? Of course you wouldn't do it beligerently and you have to use a bit of tact, but you shouldn't leave that umpire ignorant of a rule so he can go out and ruin the next game he works.

I hear people talk of the "UIC," which sounds like a LL term of which I am pretty unfamiliar. Out here we work in associations, and have no "UIC" to go run and tell. If you don't straighten the umpire out right there on the spot, he is liable to never know that he has misapplied a rule.

[GA Umpire]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Why not? I can see not doing that during the game, of course, but what is wrong with approaching someone who kicked the living sh*t out of a rule in the game in a nice manner to enlighten them of the rules after the game? Of course you wouldn't do it beligerently and you have to use a bit of tact, but you shouldn't leave that umpire ignorant of a rule so he can go out and ruin the next game he works.

I hear people talk of the "UIC," which sounds like a LL term of which I am pretty unfamiliar. Out here we work in associations, and have no "UIC" to go run and tell. If you don't straighten the umpire out right there on the spot, he is liable to never know that he has misapplied a rule.

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm. I don't know. Maybe this is why. How should I have handled this I think this conversation has been gone through before and nothing good came from it as you can see.

UIC, assignor, or whatever you want to call them. They are the ones to inform so they can inform their umpires. Do not approach an umpire with a rule book in hand even if the game is over. Nothing good may come of it. And, instead of testing to see if this may be the exception, handle it the same way every time and nothing like what happened in the other thread will happen.

Leave to the umpire's assignor(or whoever is in charge) to inform them. Not just some Joe Blow off the street who the umpire has no clue about. B/c that person may not have any clue of what they are talking about. And, like it or not, even if the game is over, approaching the umpire with a rule book is trying to show him up. Only difference now is he can't kick your a$$ out of the game and send you home packing. That is just cowardice at best. Leave it to a Rat(and this applies to anyone trying this same tactic whether it is a parent/player/coach/umpire) to do that.

[DG]

When I was coaching I showed an umpire the rule only once. We were playing a team whose coach was not one of my favorites and his son was pitching. My son broke up a no-hitter in the 5th, but was called out for not reporting, after the other coach complained. I discussed what I thought teh correct rulling should be with the PU and he said "show me". I guess he did not think I had a rule book. After I showed he reversed the out and allowed the hit. The other coach said he would protest. I told him good, go ahead. It cost $50 to lodge a protest in the league and if not upheld the $50 went to the league. I would not have shown the rule book if he had not asked me to.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by More Cowbell

You guys are my bible for all things "official." I'm a proud dad who apprecitates the men in blue, and I want to make sure I know what I'm talking about when something comes up. Here's the scenario tonight; I would appreciate any feedback and please forgive any butchered terminology:

My son's Junior Division Little League team (FED rules I think) playing horribly but hanging in 3-0 to first place team with a two man crew. Lead off batter hits shot down the line, PU signals audibly "foul" while the BU is pointing fair. Ball was untouched as it went down the line and past first base. All players kept playing the ball as fair. BR ends up on third. Umpires confer and BR is sent back home and "foul ball" stands.

From what I've read, the PU has the call until the ball passes first base, then the BU has the call. I didn't hear the explantion the umpire gave the coach, but does his "foul" call kill the play even if it wasn't his call to make? The defense did not react to the foul call, nor did the runner. Our team is out of the playoff hunt, but is this something our manager could/should have protested?

To be fair, I must admit that I didn't agree with several call the umpires made all game, but I know those were judgement calls and that's how games go sometimes.

Many Thanks in advance!

Hey, I love your user name! I'm a huge fan of Blue Öyster Cult, and that's the only thing (Don't Fear) The Reaper needs more of!!!

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Hey, I love your user name! I'm a huge fan of Blue Öyster Cult, and that's the only thing (Don't Fear) The Reaper needs more of!!!

And yet, you've never commented on my signature.

[DonInKansas]

I've booted this one before. Watched a ball draw chalk down the line, brain said safe, yet somehow I found my arms up and "FOUL" coming out of my mouth. The OC comes down the line and must have seen the sheepish look on my face because all he asked me was "you know why I'm here, right?" I replied with "Yeah I know, but once it's called foul, it's foul forever."

Fortunately it was summer ball and not JUCO league play or he'd have probably watched the rest from the parking lot after letting me know about my ineptitude a lot more forcefully.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by waltjp

And yet, you've never commented on my signature.

I apologize profusely for not noticing it before. I'll meet you at the Four Winds Bar and buy you, Miss Carrie nurse and Susie dear a drink.

[More Cowbell]

Yeah More Cowbell has taken on a life of its own. I've lurked here for some time, and I find your posts, SD Steve, quite interesting. I guess I'm "Anaheim Johnny" to your SDS.

Thanks to all for the input and anecdotes. Keep on educating the uninformed masses. MC

[SanDiegoSteve]

Welcome aboard, Johnny!