Well, Well, it finally happened
 

This came from the Basketball Forum, but I had seen it other places too. I was waiting until now, to see if anyone else posted it.

Comments?

http://forum.officiating.com/basketb...e-morning.html

"We finally really did it. You Maniacs! Ah, damn you! God damn you all to hell!"
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Indiana Girl Sues To Play Baseball
November 25, 2008
The Associated Press
INDIANAPOLIS - Being a girl hasn't kept Logan Young from playing baseball with the boys for nine years, and she and her parents don't think that should change now that she's in high school. The 14-year-old and her family have filed a federal lawsuit over an Indiana High School Athletic Association rule that prohibits the Bloomington South freshman from trying out for the high school baseball team because she is female. "In this day and age, a girl should have the opportunity to participate on an equal footing with the boys in high school sports, and the IHSAA precludes that," Fishers attorney Tae Sture said Monday. "Our feeling is, quite frankly, there's no rational reason for it," he said. An IHSAA rule prohibits girls from trying out for baseball if their school has a softball team on the basis that the sports are comparable. But the lawsuit filed Friday in U.S. District Court in Indianapolis argues that baseball and softball aren't really the same sport, so girls should be able to try out for baseball. The suit seeks to have the IHSAA rule thrown out based on the equal protection clause of the 14th Amendment to the Constitution and Title IX, the federal law that mandates equal educational opportunities for boys and girls.The suit, filed by Logan and her parents, Marie-Elisabeth and Russell Young of Bloomington, names the IHSAA and the Monroe County Community school district as defendants.Logan has played third base and outfield in coed community baseball leagues since age 5. She also plays volleyball and basketball.Her family contacted the IHSAA in May to see whether Logan could participate in baseball during the 2008-09 season. Commissioner Blake Ress said she couldn't because Bloomington South has a softball team, the lawsuit said.Ress said Monday he had not seen the lawsuit but that the girl's family and the school had not applied for a waiver from the rule."Last spring we had a girl from Wabash and gave her a waiver to allow her to play," Ress said. "Our intent was, if we had others, we would do that. This (lawsuit) is kind of out of the blue to me."The high school, which has a female kicker on its football team, supports Logan's desire to play and will seek a waiver so she can try out for baseball, said Bloomington South athletic director J.R. Holmes.But the lawsuit argues that a waiver shouldn't be necessary."Softball and baseball are not the same sport, so she has the right to try out," said Sharon F. McKee, the lead attorney in the case. Under current rules, a boy wanting to play softball also would have to seek a waiver, she said. Precedent may be on Logan's side, according to McKee. The West Virginia Supreme Court ruled in a similar case in 1989 that baseball and softball are not substantially equal sports, she said.
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Now I support Title IX as much as anybody else. My two daughters played both high school, and college sports, and were treated the same, and given the same amount of funding, as the guys. But the pendulum has swung too far the other way. Let's say that a young man at Bloomington South is the last candidate cut from the baseball team as a freshman, and as a sophomore. As a junior, he decides that he has a better shot at making the softball team, and wants to tryout. Here's a sixteen year old, six foot, five inch, 225 pound, testosterone filled, muscular, male, who would have an obvious physical advantage over these young women. Providence College lost it's baseball team due to Title IX. Other colleges and universities, have lost mens gymnastics, and other "minor" mens sports. And in some states, young men are more than willing to wear a skirt to play field hockey. When will common sense prevail?

By the way, I hope she makes the baseball team. If boys, in some states, can play field hockey, then she should be able to play baseball.

And this story affects umpires, how?

I personally don't care if girls play baseball or not. I think that if girls want to play with boys, they should be treated equally - right down to the showers and the locker room. They want to be equal, then they should be equal all the way. Typical N.A.G. thinking results in girls being on the team and being "equal" but then they need their own locker room and shower.

The solution is a very simple one. All sports should be coed. No boys and girls basketball, just basketball. No girls softball and boys baseball, just softball and just baseball. Each child may try out for any and all sports they wish.

Well,
 

Every year I try to work one game at a small school we cover. Catlin Gable School starts at least two girls and sometimes more on their varsity baseball team.

Many times girls start when there are still males on the bench.

I really couldn't care less about the gender of players in my game.

All I will say is "some" players smell better than others.

Regards,

In Monterey, Ca I umpired a High School team that had a girl playing 2nd and sometimes SS..and She actually wasnt that bad. I really didnt care that she was playing, She had good hands and a decent arm.

Now on the other hand. can the boys go and try out for the girls sports...i.e.. if a school doesnt have boys Volleyball, can the boy go and try out for the girls volleyball team?

no they can't.

Yes, they can. A quick search shows Mass has specific rules for boys playing on girls volleyball teams. I believe my state (NJ) has had boys playing on girls lacrosse teams in the recent past.

Re baseball: I've umpired several games with girls at the JV baseball level - one even pitched. While not quite studs (oxymoron?) they were certainly at least average ball players for that level.

I recall several stories of boys playing field hockey with girls.

So you do care if girls play baseball.

Re-read my post, Kevin. I don't care if they play. What I care about is that women want to be equal with conditions. That is not equality in my book. Some people think that this is "cave man thinking" (like Ump153 does) but I've been through enough of this "equality crap" in my life and I don't have to agree with it!

Cool its nice to see that in some states boys can play with the girls.... I am all for this if I was a kid I would try my hardest...LOL to play on a girls team.

Knuckleballer
 

She probably never played fastpitch softball.

When I officiate with men, we are either given separate changing facilities or take turns using the ones the men use.

But we draw the line at being given the janitors closet unless the men are also using a janitor's closet.

I guess that's what equality means. And since most schools also have girls locker rooms, it really isn't an issue, is it?

Rita

Well, if you want to impose limits on yourself in this one life, you are free to do so. I have no problem with your opinion. Just admit the truth of your exclusive stance.

That statement shows rather vividly that you indeed care that women not be allowed to play baseball alongside men. By proposing the unworkable requirement of having a woman dressing and undressing alongside men reveals your bias against the concept, and is the genesis of your being accused of having Neanderthal thinking.

I have coached some very good girls on baseball teams, but I have never seen one playing on a "boys" team above the age of 12. Above 12 is generally the age at which physical attributes swing toward the males for baseball at least.

I can think of only one word to describe a six foot, five inch, 225 pound muscular male trying out for the girls softball team, and I disagree that he is testerone filled. He has none.

I have not thrown my .02 because I wanted to hear other thoughts. Frankly, I don't care that much about a girl playing Baseball, except she will be totally physically outmatched if not this year, next year. The problem as I see it for an umpire is this, when she gets thrown at, or she gets run over at 2B, or gets treated like any other player, her and her family's first response is going to be to sue the school, or player, or umpire. Further, what if the coaches decide not to play her?

This kind of garbage is just garbage. She and her parents run to court to get a long-term and fair rule changed by some governing body. And right behind them are the other trial layers and supposed do-gooders who are so tightly wound up in their anti-male feminism that they will inflict themselves on every part of society. And the way Title IX has destroyed men's college athletics is coming to HS athletics, and the same results will happen.

I've spent 30 years officiating sports on the HS level, and for the most part, it has been a great run. We are now at the point that it sems obvious in the near future some trial judge and special interest group will find a way to destroy it. That should bother any official. The only way men's sports is going to survive in the next 20 years is to go to the European club sport model, which is hideous.

DG, I agree to a point about your post, but let's say he came from a family where men's FP was a big part of the life of the family, and until 20 or 30 years ago there were still a lot of men's FP players. There are still some places in the country where men's FP is a serious game, and it is a fun game to umpire, as opposed to girls FP, IMO. Does that mean this kid who want to play FP instead of the local keg league when he gets older has to play against men until he is physically developed enough to play with them? Will he have to go to court too?

See the problem? A female can win a suit and be loved and showered with kudos because she went to court and won her place on a boys team in a boys sport. But if a guy who loves FP SB tried to play on a team, he is an object of shame. It is another example IMO in how our society is being feminized.

I guess you don't have daughters. Maybe you should move to Saudi Arabia where the women can't drive..... Just a thought.

In the 1984 Olympics, I watched a team of studs like Mark McGwire, B.J. Surhoff, Will Clark, Cory Snyder, Barry Larkin and Shane Mack get their asses handed to them by a Japanese team with a bunch of little guys who were built like Ichiro. It was astonishing how a bunch of little finesse guys could beat a powerhouse like that.

So I can see how a woman could finesse her way onto a club and contribute just fine. It is an occasional exceptional gal who brushes with greatness enough to compete at the same level as guys ... the Michelle Wie of baseball, if you will. For people like us to have the door closed seems inappropriate and based almost solely on bigoted thinking.

However, I do not have a stomach for the social and legal nonsense that JKumpire alluded to that often arises from issues like these. I also laugh at specious contentions made about the overall equality of male and female athletes ("The WNBA is just as competitive as the men's NBA, so why don't they get paid like the men?").

We are legally and socially equal, but not physically. A woman who makes it in competitive baseball will do so with a style of play that is based on guile and finesse, along with a huge share of character and determination. It will be a rare and remarkable woman who'll do it, but it can happen.

You know what? I happen to have two daughters who agree that if you want equality, it should be equality all the way! they played softball and girl's basketball. Neither would dream of playing baseball as they both said that men are barbaric when it comes to sports (that's their opinion, not mine).

Now you can take your statement and shove it where the sun doesn't shine, there Gordie! And so can the rest of you out there!

Often you will see that along with narrow-mindedness also comes extreme defensiveness. Since your views are obviously biased and knee-jerk in nature, it is unlikely that anything close to a majority would agree--even in the relatively conservative legion of umpires. I am sorry that you think that your narrow brand of thinking goes on in anything close to the majority of people, because it does not. Your being defensive about it to the exclusion of all others, and in the process, to the exclusion of intelligent debate, is quite common among those who form their beliefs in that manner, and serves to prove that your stance is weak. Your narrow, little world that includes and considers only your experiences, has yielded an unrealistic and somewhat backward picture for all of us to see.

After spewing that crap, you were bound to get lit up. Take it with a whole lot more grace.

[QUOTE]Jk I hear you but there are frivilous lawsuits throughout this country.

In LL there were parents who sued EVERYBODY over the following incident.

Their child was playing the field and couldn't catch. One day a fly ball was hit his way and it hit him in the head. I can't remember the status of all injuies the kid sustained but it wasn't life threatening etc.

The parents sued the coach saying that the coach did not properly teach their child how to play the game. They sued the umpires, and the entire BOD.

That's the last I heard about it because most lawsuits in this country are settled out of court hence no official record. I am not saying this case was settled but as mentioned there was no official record hence no more info available other than what was said on the news.

There was a recent case about the parents suing LL Incorporated over the use of the metal bat.

If people are going to sue they are going to sue whether it's a boy or girl playing. That's the world we live in and why insurance costs are high and we have to belong to an association to keep the costs down.

We treat a female on the playing field no differently. It's akin to someone's race. We would not treat an Hispanic player any differently then an Afro American Player or a Jewish Player, etc.

if someone is going to sue they are going to sue and it doesn't matter if they are male or female.

I see this type of issue more of a problem for the team members than umpires.

Pete Booth