Who will replace Froemming?
 

George Steinbrenner was upset with Bruce Froemming's handling of the "buggy" game in Cleveland. The Yankee boss is quoted in the New Jersey Register:

"The umpire was full of [expletive]," Steinbrenner said of the retiring Froemming. "He won't umpire our games anymore."

So who fills in for Froemming tonight?:)

Haha well I don't know about tonight, but Froemming's spot for next year has already been filled by the rehiring of Hallion and Hickox. Tough break for Rob Drake who probably would have been next in line.

Great, now the trolls are encouraging the sniffers.

Based on size alone , it is not surprising that it takes two officials to replace Froemming.

Either Tim Donaghy who has a lot of experience with "bugs" or Mike Winters who is familiar with the {expletive}

That was cruel!

Despite his size, Bruce is still one of the quickest umpires out there. He used to win bets in match races against people who perceived him to be slow afoot.

What did that idiot Steinbrenner expect of Froemming? The UIC of the game was Laz Diaz and he handled the situation just fine. I suppose King George wants to have all the bugs fired! He sure doesn't dictate who works his games. He can buy a baseball team but not the umpires.:(

Steinbrenner comes close to making me appreciate Jerry Jones. Close, but not quite.

steve, you know better than that. the plate umpire in pro ball is not the UIC unless it is a 2 man system. anything other than 2 man and the crew chief is always the UIC.

Hallion and Hickok were re-hired but they did not take Froemming's spot nor is it a lock that they will. I thought based on what I had read when they and Bob Davidson were set to be re-hired that they had a pre-determined order as to "when" they would be officially re-hired. When Terry Craft retired last year, I thought one of the two (Hallion or Hickox) would get his spot. Instead it was Lance Barksdale. Then during the offseason, Hallion and Hickok were officially rehired as part of the WBC/TV mic negotiations. They are considered rovers. Now whether or not they simply slide them onto a crew to fill Froemming's spot, I don't know. I would defer to someone with an inner knowledge of MLB workings.

The crew chief is the UIC for every game? What happened to Rule 9.04(a)? It has always been my understanding the Senior Umpire, or Crew Chief was a separate thing from the UIC, who by rule is the plate umpire.

I did not read that Froemming was named Crew Chief, but I guess it makes sense because he is the senior man, but I've always heard it expressed separately from the actual UIC of the individual game.

That may have been true a few years ago. It isn't now.

Nope, the crew chief is the UIC in mechanics above two man.

9.04a is one of many outdated rules in the book. also, seniority does not necessarily equal crew chief. tim tschida was the senior man on the crew for the sox/angels series, but was not the chief. you may not read anywhere who the chief is, cuz the general public doesn't care. if it isn't announced, you know who the chief of the playoff crew is by him working the plate in game 1 of the series.

Where is Chris Griffin fitting in with all this? Still a year or 2 away?

According to my close friend (AAA crew chief and MLB reserve), he told me in August that 3 MLBers would have to retire for one AAA guy to be promoted. That is, MLB was planning to drop back down to 68. Of course, things could have changed since we last talked...but that's what he said at the end of August.

Chris Griffin is in Quahog. I think you mean Chris Griffith.

Does MLB plan on keeping guys like Guccione/Drake/Hoye around until those jobs open up? These guys have worked a lot of games this year and seem to be pretty much full time MLB reserves, almost like Lance Barksdale was before he was hired.

Yeah. I almost, but didn't, mentioned this at the time a certain play was all over this board. On the play precipitating the Mike Winters incident, Bradley singled to center. Froemming was U2 that game; you get a real good look at him hustling into the infield from his initial CF spot.

A quadriplegic would've been just as quick.

I don't know...no one did at the time of our conversation.

I would be willing to venture a safe guess that Hallion is going to be around full time for a while now. According worldumpires.com's website, Hallion is on the NLCS umpiring crew this year. So, I would think with that assignment, he is back as a full time umpire for MLB.

Ed Hickox worked an NLDS.

These guys were re-hired in March.

But thanks. Your sleuthiness is second to none.

Mr Mets,

I was making a comment about Hallion specific. I already knew that Hickox worked in the NLDS this year.

My comment was opinion based about Hallion. Plus, the comment would hold true to Hickox and Davidson (even though he did not work the post season) as well.

I think the MLB umpire who told me that would be considered someone with knowledge of MLB workings.

jpc2119,

I would think so as well, but some within this forum would probably disagree.

I am not one of them.

Although working nearly full time at the MLB level for a few years now, (over 1000 games since 2000, "Gucce" didn't seem to be real positive about his future this past summer.

I'll ask you the same question I asked lawump- do you know if MLB is going to get rid of the Guccione/Hoye/Drake crowd who has been around for a while for a lack of jobs, or will they keep them around for openings post-Hallion and Hickox? You obviously have very good connections with the MiLB guys (no offense to lawump) so maybe you can share something he doesn't know.

I would say that I got the same impression from my friend. There seemed to be a lot of stress on his part.

I posted what I know.

I wouldn't assume I know anymore than Lawump.

If this is true, what a horrible indictment of the MLB umpires motor capabilities. :eek:

It will be a sad day when Marsh retires. He does such a good job on the field with balls and strikes, mechanics, and handling situations on the field when they come up.

Take a big whiff boys! Ahhhhhh, smells like MLB spirit!!!

While nothing is by any means set, when I had lunch with a couple MLB guys over the summer when they were in town for a Mets series, there was talk of finding ways to hire new guys, including giving the plate guy the next day off and forming an extra crew. These guys didn't say anything about Drake/Hoye/Guccione, but that might not be something they're kept apprised of anyway.

All I know is I'd be frustrated if I was these guys and hadn't gotten a full-time job yet, but I'm sure they'll stick around as long as they can.

Anything new on the news front as far as staff changes for the '08 season are concerned at this time?

This post might set the record for most awfully constructed phrase in the English language.

Ever.

Followed very closely by the one you just posted.:)

How so?

Seriously, guys? Anything new to report on '07 off-season's retirees, their replacements, new crew chiefs, etc.?

Seriously, drop it. It is December, those things are announced just prior to Spring Training.

See you in a week when you ask again.

seriously guy go back to playin on facebook w your kiddie buds or somethin no body here cares.

Nah, he plays with his Joe West doll, complete with a WV logo right on its butt.

New guy
 

Happy Holidays. I am new to this site. I am a high school and college umpire in the Iowa, Illinois, Wisconsin area and a 25 year police officer. Larry Young spoke to our award ceremony last night. Larry would not take a fee but did accept our donation for UmpsCare, the major league umpires charity. I asked him if I could ask some questions and post them on this site. He said absolutely and sends his" best wishes to fellow umpires."
Bruce Froemming--Bruce is retired as of 1/1/08 and will then be working somewhere in baseball, but not as an umpire supervisor
Randy Marsh-- Randy is not retiring next year
Guccione and Drake--Had many good things to say about both. Both are very much in the mix , but face the problem of no openings. Larry predicts both will eventually have long careers in the major leagues.
Larry Young--Was injured in a game in July in Chicago. Three doctors have told him he will not umpire again. Is still on the staff, but is weighing his options which may include a supervisory position with MLB. Wants to work with minor, major , and internationl umpires. Has been umpiring since the age of 13, but has no regrets, saying, "If this is indeed the end of my umpiring career, I was fortunate to umpire at the MLB level for 24 years possessing average ability. I would now like to help some younger MLB umpires reach their dream of working a world series, and help some Milb umpires reach their dream of working in the big leagues."
He received a standing ovation from our members

Thanks for the updates. Too bad about Larry. I have always admired him. I know the feeling of having to hang it up, and it's not much fun. I wish him much success at his next endeavor.

At last count (according to a AAA crew chief last week) 11 AAA umpires were released. Some, no doubt, possess names that are familiar to this board's posters.

Word came out early that this was to be a "house cleaning" year. Some of the names are surprising and some of the reasons were not directly related to on-field performance.

With AA releases, A releases and next year's midseason self-releases, this coming season could easily become a "40 rookie year." There is some thought that PBUC may ask for 50 to look at instead of the 40 that has become more common.

I suspect it will be at least 40. Remember that there are something like 8 new slots for Long / Advanced A 'roamers' for getting folks started on the three umpire system.

I don't mean to pat myself on the back, but I saw this coming back in 1999. Back in 1999 when MLB umpires used their doomed resignation strategy, and 22 AAA umpires were promoted to the full-time MLB staff...a lot of young lower-level pro umpires were thrilled. They were thrilled because there was a lot of upward movement at that time.

However, I remember thinking at that time that this was not going to be good 5-10 years down the road for a lot of the guys who were at the same level as me. Simply put, having 22 new umpires meant that even less openings would occur on the MLB staff during the next decade.

My thoughts at that time have come to fruition. In fact it is worse. With a settlement that MLB reached with some of the resigned umpires, MLB had 70 full-time umpires this year filling 68 slots. (Which everyone here knows).

The writing was on the wall. There are a lot of very, very, very good umpires who could have had fine MLB careers that got let go. It is a numbers game. With only Bruce Froemming having retired so far this off-season, there are still 69 umpires filling 68 spots on MLB's roster.

Frankly, it is also no secret which umpire most AAA umpires consider to be the one most likely to be promoted to the full-time MLB staff when the next vacancy occurs. (As an aside: It is NOT a person regularly talked about on this board...in fact, I don't know if I've ever seen his name discussed on a thread here).

The writing on the wall. It is a sad, but a well known, risk one takes when entering this profession.

(ALSO please don't ask me to post which 11 got let go: I was just told a number...I did not ask for names from my contact...it was a touchy subject and I did not want to pry.)

The word from PBUC is that this is not coming this year, though that was a few weeks ago and could have changed, I suppose. Back then it was said this was more likley to happen next year. It might even become an item for negotiations, which begin after this season, I believe.

I don't think that went unnoticed by many. The issue wasn't so much as just having 22 new MLB umpires, it was more that they were all around the same age....young.

The effect of that will last more than one decade.

In the year 2018
 

After the 1999 "situation," a friend of mine calculated that the year to go to umpire school was 2018. His calculation was based on ages of the MLB's at the time. I did not review his math or assumptions, but found his theory interesting enough to remember it.

Walt

That is what I meant when I said "new"...although, admittedly, "young" is a far more appropriate word.