This sent the wrong message.
 

Worked a HS Varsity game with a guy that most of us have nothing but trouble with, and yesterday was no different.

First, he shows up just in time for the plate meeting (he was scheduled to work the bases).

Two innings into the game, the Home Team Coach calls for time, and informs me the JV umpire has not shown up yet. For this league, we are supposed to split, with the Base Umpire suiting up and working the JV game.

So I call my partner in to join the conversation, which the Visiting Team Coach has also joined in on. The Home Team Coach informs my partner of the situation, and asks him to please work the JV game.

My partner replies by saying he has a College game the following day, and there is no way he is going to work a JV game, just to get beat up, and be unable to work his college game, unless, the Home Team Coach is willing to cut him a check, "on the spot", for his college game fees.

The Home Team Coach then asks him, "Are you saying you won't work the game ?" To which my partner replies, "If you try to make me work that JV game, I'll just leave and go home."

Both coaches jaws are now on the ground. They both look at me, and the Home Team Coach asks me, "Nick, what do we do now ?"

Well, I don't want to see the other game get canceled, so I asked my partner, "If I go work the JV game, will you stay and finish the Varsity game ?" To which he replies, "Yeah sure, I'll go suit up." He immediately runs off the field toward his car.

Both coaches jaws dropped even farther. Both coaches walked me all the way to the JV field, saying how much they appreciated me being willing to work the JV game, and a few choice words about my partner. I didn't say anything bad about my partner to them, his actions said enough.

Then, to top it off...

I'm in the middle of an inning at the JV game, when I hear my partner calling to me. I call time...

He asks me what inning it is, to which I reply, "Bottom 7". "Oh, OK then. I was going to change and come help you.", he says. "Don't bother.", I replied, and turned back to my game. He left.

I reported the incident to our Assignor and Secretary, and went up on the Arbiter and BLOCKED him from being scheduled for any further games with me.

Wow. Just wow. At this rate he won't have any partners left, and that's not a bad thing.

Are yall so desperate for umpires that yall have to put up with this?

You handled it very well. Let's see, you start the JV game 20 mins late and still end just after the varsity? He don't call strikes, either.

Nick:
Maybe your umpire partner thinks he is "too good" to work a JV game since he has a college game the next day. Sounds like a "jerk".
He might be a member of the "AZZ" family and his parents named him Jack! :eek:
Sounds like you handled the situation well.
Sam

Whew!
 

I feel sorry for the college teams that he calls tomorrow ... they will get the shaft of having a poor umpire call their game.

Thanks
David

IMHO he is a wimp.

DG,

"Wimp" is much too nice a word for this guy.

JM

I would not have handled it that way, but it is not his obligation to work a game he was not assigned. I have "helped out" only to get the shaft in the end. This is not most of our primary job or activity. He was assigned the bases (why this is assigned I do not know) and that is what he was there to work. Now I am not for leaving the game he was scheduled, but he does have the right to say no and if he was working a college game the next day that was his right. It might not be what you want to do, but I am not going to be upset with anyone that turns down a situation they were not scheduled to do.

Peace

If it is customary ("For this league, we are supposed to split, with the Base Umpire suiting up and working the JV game.") then he needs to understand and comply with the custom. Or, he can just work his college games.

I was assigned bases for a game yesterday, but my partner called and said he injured his arm in a game earlier in the day when a catcher missed an inside pitch (he was on the way to get an XRAY to see if it was broken). He was trying to get up with our assignor to get replaced but had not gotten up with him yet. I asked him could he work bases and he said he thought he could. I told him no sweat, I will work the plate.

This guy was afraid of getting beat up in a JV game the day before a college game. I broke a finger in the first inning of the first game of a Sunday college DH two years ago and managed to complete both games and go for my XRAY on Tuesday. This guy is a chicken sh*t and I wouldn't accept any more games with him either. Why he is working college games is a big question in my mind.

Hmm.. JRutledge makes a good point, but I suspect if the other game had been varsity, he wouldn't have raised a stink. It sounds like JV is beneath him. I was just wondering if you guys get stuck with only one ump very often, especially at the varsity/JV levels. Around here, it happens for Jr High games and occasionally for freshman games, but not varsity, unless there's a last-minute emergency. Even then, a replacement would be called in pretty quickly. Since this league had adopted an accepted procedure for splitting the umps to cover both games, it must not be that uncommon. Maybe they need to find a way to recruit more umps. (Maybe a pay raise?) It's not right to have only one ump at that level. It's not fair to the umps and it's not fair to the players.

tribefan,

After I had taken a minute to digest what he said, I also found myself in agreement with JRut's essential point. Which I understood to be that the gentleman had agreed to work a HS Varsity game as part of a 2-man crew and that he was under no obligation as a result to go work a JV game solo.

However, I found his entire attitude "unseemly" for an umpire. Besides all the BS about, "just in time", "getting beat up", "cut me a check", etc., he seems to display a complete misunderstanding of the purpose and role of the umpire in the game of baseball. I think the individual in question does not understand that...

In my opinion, this individual did not represent the league, baseball, or his association very well. Plus, what an a$$hole.

JM

Well there is no such custom that I am aware of where I live. In my state it is about the contract and what that contract says. If someone wants to request you to do something else, that is between you and the school. And it is your right as an umpire to not comply with something outside of that contract. This comes back to what I always say on these boards about what you do in your area might not apply somewhere else.

Whether he was afraid or not is not the issue. I love the "manly" talk that everyone likes to display as if that proves anything. The bottom line he does not have to work a game he was not scheduled. I know I only accept certain levels of games mainly because that is what I enjoy to do. I also do not like to take certain level of games because if and when I get an opportunity at a higher level I will bail on the first game or want to give it back. I do not like to give it back or to ask, so I will not accept games lower than the levels I am used to.

Two years ago I was scheduled to work a varsity basketball game with 3 Person mechanics. I showed up early and was the first varsity official to be on site. When I walked in the door I was immediately approached by someone to work the sophomore game (prelim or JV in other areas) before my varsity game. Without much hesitation I agreed to do the game. When I showed up the game was at half time. So I run to the locker room and hurry up and get dressed to help out an official who was working by himself. I get dressed and the game is about 4 minutes left in the 3rd quarter. I thought they were waiting on me but I was wrong. I then run onto the court at the first opportunity and work the remainder of the game. I was also not in tune to the game or what had been called and it was clearly frustrating to the players, coaches and even me. I finish the game without much of a hitch and continued to work the varsity game that followed. Several weeks later I get the check in the mail from the school thinking I will get both checks or a significant bump in pay. They paid me only $8.50 more than what I worked for the varsity game. I called the school and I was asked them about what I was paid and why? They told me they prorated the amount because I only worked a quarter and a half of the Soph game. Well to make a long story short they sent me about $10 because I was not happy with that result.

Now this was not a baseball game where I can get hit by a ball or a bat. But it made me think how if I did pull a hamstring or turn a knee or got hurt any number of ways trying to run harder to work a 2 man game as compared to working 3 officials, who was going to pay me for my injury? If I would have lost the season or a significant part of the season would that have been worth it? I say no and I will not do that again if that is the appreciation I will be shown. Now my situation is not exactly like this case here, but it is similar in the fact I do not work many lower level games because I want to stay fresh for my varsity and college basketball games. So I think he may have had a legitimate concern because no one here was going to pay any medical bills or suffer the consequences for anything wrong that may take place. He was assigned a varsity game and if he no one showed up to work the JV game, it is not the obligation of the umpires to make it up if they do not want to.

Peace

Maybe it would have been "beneath him" but that is his right to feel that way. I know lower level umpire/officials that feel they are not ready for varsity or college ball. I do know of umpires that are not eager to move up just because they are asked. Some feel they are not ready. And if this story was turned the other way around I doubt seriously that any of us would be using the same hyperbole about this umpire. ;)

It happens very rare to know knowledge, at least not with the organization I work for. Having said that almost all lower level games in this part of the state are assigned with only one umpire (which I personally find as completely stupid, but that is another conversation for another day). It is unusual that most people do not show up for varsity games mainly because everyone does not get those shots. And the consequences for missing a varsity game without a very good excuse can be heavy.

Peace

He was assigned the bases, because we talked the day before and agreed that he would do the bases. It is customary in our association, that we alternate positions. The previous game we had worked, he had the plate, so it was my turn to do the dish.

He does not have the right to say no. It is specifically written in our employment/contractor agreement that in this type of situation, we will split, and the base umpire will take the JV game.

Very rare that we have to work a Varsity game alone. If we do, we get an extra $20 ($78) for the game.

Only one umpire is assigned to JV games. Umpire is paid $7 ($65) more than a Varsity (2 man game $58) game.

Our association does not cover games below JV, due to a lack of umpires.

I think the guy definitely has a bad attitude, since it is the association policy for him to be ready to work a JV game. He should have his gear, and if the policy is for the base umpire to go work the JV game, then so be it. If Nick would have been on the bases, it would have been his duty to step down to the JV level.

Out here, we have no such asinine policy. If there is no umpire for the JV game, that's tough caca. The folks here want 2 umpires on their Varsity games, and they would just either cancel the JV game, or play it as a scrimmage with the catchers calling balls/strikes/fair/foul, and the base coaches calling the plays on the bases.

Thank goodness my state had the wisdom to require two umpires at every game at every level. This would never happen here.

But I've lived in places where we would work solo and I can say this situaion wouldn't happen there, either. We'd pull umpires from lower level games to cover varsity, but not JV/Freshman. Let's face it, JV/Freshman are developmental levels and the varsity game should not suffer for a lower level game.

I think that is a dumb policy. And to say he has no choice is also not being realistic. He might have to suffer consequences, but no one "has to do" anything. And in my area the JV game would just be cancelled if the umpire wanted to work the varsity game. As a matter of fact I do not know of a situation this has ever been requested. The varsity game is what is important and needs to be played because of all the ramifications associated with it. There are no JV playoffs and these can be played almost anytime. Also most conferences do not play for a conference title either for JV and lower level games. That would just be tough titty for the JV game around here.

Peace

Now you've done it. Now someone will come here with hands wringing saying that the JV game is just as important and someone else will say "Think of the Children!!!!"

:D

http://www.runemasterstudios.com/gra.../smilielol.gif

Peace

I disagree with the aforementioned.

In my association just like many others Varsity is scheduled first meaning 2 Umpires ALWAYS and then JV on down. However, s*** happens.

In the case presented, the BU will get paid or I should say should get paid the Varsity FEE since he was scheduled to do a varsity game, so money should not be an issue.

In HS, teams travel and in some instances many miles. So you have 2 JV teams ready to play and say one of the teams traveled some 40 miles or further to play and now you do not want to umpire and basically tell these teams to GO HOME.

I realize this type of situation is an area by area "thing" but if the Home coach approached you I do not see how any Umpire organization would frown on the splitting of duties as was done in this case.
Also, IMO no one is "too good" that he/she cannot do a JV or even a modified game once in a while.

IMO, Nick handled it very well. He did not cause a scene and even though this umpire was reported to the association (which I agree with) he did not "rat him" out either. It was the arrogance and audacity of the BU which were his downfall.

Pete Booth

Maybe if we took the attitude that people have the right to do what they want to do considering they are leaving their jobs and families to do so, then we would get rid of the "arrogance" attitude that prevails these websites when people exercise their right. It is my right to decide what I want to do when I take games. Like Jake Plummer, if I do not like the circumstances I am put in, I can quit. Most people this is an extra-curricular activity. No one is getting rich off of officiating and certainly not paying all their bills by the money we make. It is not arrogant for someone to say I did not sign up for this and I choose to pass. Do not give me we are out there for the kids and it is our professional duty. People sacrifice a lot to work any sporting event and I have a lot of choice. Maybe this is why there is a shortage of umpires and officials across the country. I know if the numbers we up around here every game might be assigned with umpires. But because the numbers are so abysmal anyone that umpires can get opportunities they cannot get in other sports.

Peace

He signed up with an association that has rules and then did not abide by them when he chose not to work the plate at the JV game. He lost his right to choose when he accepted the game.

Here, all games are assigned 2 officials, JV and Varsity. Occassionally we have two games at same site, JV first and V second, and the officials would work both, but never two games at the the same time at same location. I know of no umpire in our association that would accept this "DH" and arrive and refuse to do the plate game for the JV game because he has a college game the next day.

This is quite a different situation than the original post. If you accept to work a double header with those circumstances, then chances are you know what you are getting yourself into. Unless you are assigned to works the plate on each game, I am sure there are umpires that prefer not to work the plate for various reasons that might not be discussed openly. I bet working something the day after or the day before might be part of that willingness to work the plate at any given time.

Peace

There's something that trumps having the right to do what one wants, and that is the expectation that people live up to the agreements they make. If the umpire in question has voluntarily accepted membership in his association, and the association has agreed on a protocol to follow when a game (even a JV game) is uncovered, then that umpire is bound by agreement to honor the protocol.

The arrogance in this situation is not with the posters in this thread; it is with the umpire who breached his agreement with his association because he considered umpiring JV ball to be beneath him.

I agree if that is the policy that is in place the umpire has more of an obligation to follow it. But just like anything in life, not all policies are well written or followed. Better yet is this a policy talked about or understood by all members? Is this in the constitution of the organizations? Is this policy on the contract? I trust that Nick is not lying or misrepresenting the story, but there are two sides to any story. And this is a very local issue because this would not be an issue in my state. My state has made it very clear that all contracts assigned are with the school. And if the contract you have with the assignor says you are to work a game at a particular time, the school is responsible for what takes place. In other words I would not have to work a game I was not assigned at any level if it was not on the contract.

There my not be arrogance with the posters in the thread. It is arrogant to expect such a policy applies across the board and that everyone would look at this situation the same. Because when I read this originally I was trying to see what the big deal was? I have no problem with an umpire not wanting to work a game they were not assigned. I also would not want to belong to an association that has such a policy. Then again that is my opinion.

Peace

What I like about our area is if you do a solo game and there were two umpires scheduled YOU take home both game checks. I have not ever been stiffed by a partner but there were a few times I wouldn't have minded if they hadn't showed up.:)

While I don't do baseball (foot/basketball), I agree with Rut here. I have my own policy: I don't work unassigned subvarsity games. I have in the past and this year, I did an extra varsity tournament game, but my days are numbered in basketball as far as working 2 man games period. It isn't arrogance, that sub varsity is beneath me, or even that I've paid my dues. Its that I value my time both monetarily and otherwise. Also, I think some schools try to take advantage of the situation.

Well said. When he joined the association, he made an agreement. The code of ethics for baseball umpires (2007 NFHS Umpires Manual, pp. 6-7) also has a few things to say about this situation:

1. Honor all contracts regardless of possible inconvenience or financial loss.
7. Give your complete cooperation to the schools you serve and to the state association which you represent.
13. Keep in mind that the game is more important than the wishes of any individual player or the ambitions of any individual umpire.

I Agree With That
 

What I Dont Like Is Calling Games With Fellow Official When The First Thing That Comes Out Of There Mouth Is Who Am I Going To Throw Out Of The Game First. Yes There Are Time When It Is Nesseary But Only When The Time Has Come For You To Do That!

Here is my response to what you just posted.

#1--He honored the contract and showed up. He was assigned a varsity game, not a JV game.

#7--Cooperation with a school does not mean do anything they want. If the school said we want to pay you $20 and the contract says $60, would that be acceptable too? Last time I checked the school does not have the right to take advantage because they make a request.

#13--One again the umpire was scheduled to work a varsity game. His obligation is to that game, not any other game that might be added or requested to do by the official. I guess if the school said we were moving the game a couple of hours earlier, the officials are supposed to just throw out their personal interests because the game was moved.

I think you really you have little understanding of the code of ethics. Officials are not at the beck and call of the schools to do what ever they like. They have the right to make requests, but we have the right to refuse those requests. There is a reason there are contracts to not only protect the schools but to protect the officials as well.

Peace

Hmm... You are absolutely right, with one small exception. When he joined the association, he knew their policy. If he didn't want to work under those conditions, he should not have joined that association. I'm not saying the policy is good or bad... personally I don't like it. But he knew that in this particular association, there's a reasonable likelihood that he would be asked to move to a JV game. The question isn't, "Did he have the right to say no?" Of course he did. This is America! The question was whether it was ethical to say no. The answer to that question is debatable.

Moving the game time or changing the pay rate are completely different scenarios.

From the original thread

[QUOTE]When the official signed up to umpire for THIS league and there are no Umpires who showed up for the JV game, then the BU according to the Protocol established is suposed to do the JV game.

IMO it's cut and dry. The only comment I would have that would not be fair is if the offficial was paid the JV rate. That I disagree with, but as long as this official was paid the Varsity Fee and probably 1/2 extra for working solo I do not see a problem. It's not like he had to travel to do the JV game.

This association also has cause to suspend this official for not abiding by the association requirements as Nick indicated in the original thread.

If this official STRICTLY wants to umpire Varsity games and is unwilling to accept the protocol that when no umpires show-up for a JV game the BU is required to suit up and do the JV game, then he should either join a different association or make this perfectly CLEAR to the assignor.

If this official did that, my guess is that his assignments in the future would vastly decrease.

Pete Booth

I am glad you know what he knew or not. I for one do not want to debate what he knew. I am simply saying that your reference to the code of ethics is misplaced and has little to do with this particular situation. These references had nothing to do with the willingness to work one level from another level. Also the code of ethics has little or nothing to do with a specific association policy.

Peace

Your statement does not apply throughout the state. Our organization is the assignor for many northwest suburban conferences. We do not have written contracts with the schools although some have now gone to the voucher system for direct payment. However; what governs us is our organization. If we are missing an umpire at the site, we are supposed to call the assignor for direction as far as splitting up. But we are not obligated to do so. If you want to stay in good graces with the assignor, you do it. Nobody ever has a problem with it.

For those who do work under contracts be careful about the wording to make sure there is language about you being an independent contractor. If not, it could be assumed that you were an employee for tax purposes. At our clinics, there are always questions about the topic. Basically what we've been told is that if any agreement has restrictive language that can dictate your actions, you may wind up being considered an employee. I'm not trying to give legal advice because I'm not an attorney - if you're not sure, ask.

I am so glad that everyone knows what he signed up for and all the policies associated with that organization. I am glad you know that even when from the very beginning of this thread nothing was stated about such policy or why he did not have the right to refuse the JV game. But I did hear a lot of "He was chicken" and "He should not do what the school asked" bull crap. I know when people join the organizations around here I know for a fact they do not know everything about the organization from top to bottom and all the policies involved. If this is such an important policy, I am sure Nick is going to tell us how they spend several meetings with prospective members to go over this very important policy.

Either way you look at it; there is nothing wrong in my book for officials having a preference as to what levels they do. For all we know maybe, just maybe he works a majority college schedule (like a lot of people sometimes do) and his over all focus is on that level. You might not like it, but that is the way the world works. Not everyone is umpiring for all levels with the same passion and expectation as you and others here might want us to. My season basically ends in May/June because I have other things in my life I want to do after that point. I bet the next thing you will tell me is the assignors want me to work games after the HS/college season is over, I do not have the right to refuse those games because an association has me as a member.

Peace

I am not telling you what your organization says, I am telling you what the IHSA says and what they will do and how they will handle the situation if there is a violation with a contract. Understand that if you are working HS games in Illinois with IHSA Member schools, you are subject to their rules and regulations that may preclude those of a local association. Also remember that most associations are recognized by the IHSA and have to follow IHSA policies or they will not be able to do many things under the IHSA umbrella. This information was stated at a meeting Dave Gannaway had with assignors at the IHSA Official's Convention and he made it very clear what rights the assignors had and did not have as it related to the contracts they make with the schools. Now we also know in reality that may not apply in practice, but if a school wants to hold your feet to the fire or you want to say the contract was violated, it is not the assignors the IHSA will pay attention to in the dispute or fine for that matter.

Peace

I had a similar situation to this - except it was a 15 year old game. The league has two fields, on opposite sides of town. It was playoffs - 4 teams left. The league decided to switch their games around last second, not tell their assignor, and hence we had a field with 2 umpires and a field with no umpires, about 20 mins apart. Via cell phones, the coaches at our field begged one of us to go. He was literally opening up his own wallet, which didn't go over well with me in front of about 100 spectators.

My parnter and I talked, and we figured out that a) neither of us were obligated to go b) didn't want to leave each other stranded (always have 2 umpires around here) and c) both had places to be at night (other game would have started an hour late). We then discussed what we would tell the coaches, he suggested saying that he didn't have his plate gear (which I thought may cause a bit of a stirup), so instead we were truthful with them except for reason c. Of course, the coaches accused us of reason c.

It got so bad that we came back together, and sought out a solution. I went to my car, got my phone, and gave them the assignor's number. We started up our game and the assignor told the coaches, basically, to shove it, it was the leagues fault for not notifying him and he also defended us really strongly for our decision to stay on our field (from what he told me later that night).

Thoughts?

First of all what you say is ultimately up to you. You have every right to refuse to work a game you were not assigned. You also do not have to explain why you refuse either. All they can do is ask and you have every right to refuse for what ever reason you give them. If you want to say "I have to wash my hair later" that is your business.

I think people forget that this is an extra curricular activity for most of us. We are independent contractors. We do not have to do anything we do not feel comfortable with or we did not original sign up for. I think calling the assignor was the right thing to do in the end. You are not cattle to be herded in any direction they wish.

Peace

[QUOTE=PeteBooth]From the original thread

We get paid $58 for a 2 man Varsity Game. I was paid $65 (standard rate) for doing a 1 man JV game.

[quote=nickrego]...And does the Varsity ump gets both of the $58.00 checks?

I assign umpires for a 44-team league that plays most of its games at 1PM on Sundays. At the pre-season umpire meeting, I made it clear that umpires sign on to work the game at the scheduled starting time and if, for whatever reason, the start of the game is delayed (the usual is that they want to push back to 2PM for weather reasons, mainly cause nobody showed up early to work the field) they are under NO OBLIGATION to stay and work.

Any association that would expect any more from the umpires values the business more than it values the members.

We didn't lie, my partner brought that up as an option and I nipped it in the bud.

They could have told them they had a family issue and that would have been fine with me. It is not the business of the league to know every little detail of why someone does something or not. If they want to change the schedule at the last minute and expect umpires to just fill in without consequence that is the league's problem. What they tell them is more of a moral issue than an ethical issue. Not everything needs a complete and total explanation.

Peace

Tuss, give them nowhere to go. I'd have probably said the MAIN reason for not doing the game an hour later is that I have someplace I have to be.

This kid of mixup happens regularly around these parts. Managers forget/neglect/willfully fail to keep the assignor/scheduler in the loop and it isn't the Umpire's responsibility to pay for that mistake. If an Official is willing and able to help then so be it. If not, then that Manager is responsible.

If there IS a shortage of Officials in your area, then the Managers should know this already and take pains to be sure to keep the right people informed just so this sort of thing is averted.

Don't know what this is about Mr. Tyler -

We chose not to discuss the gear situation, because a coach may know that all umpires should ALWAYS have their gear in the car in case of a no show, injury, etc.

And I feared if I used reason c they may just think we were lazy, which would cause more of a stir up.

And yes, I'm being truthful, why would I lie to a group of umpires abou this?

I understand reason c (i have someplace to be tonight) may have been good enough for the coaches, but it also may not have been and prompted more questions (what do you have to do? etc.) The point was that it wasn't my game that they wanted covered, which was the message we gave.

Kapeesh? (spelling?)

Capiche. From the Itailian, "Capisci."

Merci. (french)

Oui, je sais. J'ai étudié le français pendant cinq années. Bien que j'en aie oublié, je me rappelle assez pour enseigner le français I et II dans le lycée supérieur.

Stow it Flo! -- Mel from Alice.:)

Hutsay Upsay , as they say in some neighborhoods

Haha clean it out with Orbit; I prefer to use cough drops.

[QUOTE=mick]Nope, he got $78 for a single-man Varsity game.