Gorilla Arm
Yes, I did a search...
I've seen this twice already this year, but nobody is calling it. Man on first, RH pitcher leans in to get his sign and has his glove on his knee and his right hand dangling in front of him with the ball. Do you balk this? I don't see an advantage at all as everyone in the park knows where the ball is. I could see it if he was changing his routine, one time the balls in his glove, the next time it's in his hand, etc, that would show intent to decieve. This was just part of his normal routine. He did the same exact thing on every pitch with runners on. In fact, he never threw over to first, not once, so he certainly did not gain an advantage. Also, nobody said a word, so it seems to be an accepted practice. Do you guys let this ride, or do I need to nut up and bang this as soon as I see it. |
Our assoc wants this called.
But I warn once, maybe twice, before I do. |
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It's legal in OBR and NCAA. Last year, FED issued an interp that it was illegal. There is some concern in some states that FED didn't really mean "gorilla arm" when they wrote this. As long as R1 can tell whether F1 is set or not, then it's legal. |
We had this last night in a game...true gorilla arm. Home team pitcher comes out in top of second, just after they scored two touchdowns in the bottom of the first (yup, 14 runs) on a completely overmatched team. He was really hyped up, and working quickly. First batter gets a bloop single. F1, in the stretch, is really amped up now, and has the non-glove hand (with ball) swinging like a pendulum. First pitch a foul ball that hits the fence and comes out between the plate and mound. Partner and I (I'm BU) converge...he acts like he's getting the ball and checking it, I'm "dusting" off the rubber. We remind F1 he's not in the major leagues and his arm can't be swinging like it is, or it will be a balk.
So, warned him in this situation, with a game that was totally out of hand already. The opposing pitcher, who had only begun pitching (ever) two weeks prior, already had an illegal pitch called on him, and honestly, we let him get away with probably a dozen total just because he absolutely didn't understand what we were trying to tell him. However, in most situations, we're calling balks on the "gorilla arm." |
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I agree with what Tim said in the other thread (April, 2005). Call it, call it, call it until the NFHS changes the rule. And if you fear that you will get flack from the coaches, make copies of the sketch out of the illustrated rule book and hand them out. While you're at it, go back and read the NFHS Points of Emphasis on "Umpire's Professionalism." |
Is that "comic book" online anywhere? I'd like to see that.
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It's available on the NFHS website.
2007 Baseball Simplified & Illustrated Item #: BASI07 Retail Price: $6.95 Details: The baseball rulebook is brought to life and clarity given to difficult situations with the use of over 150 large, clear illustrations. http://www.nfhs.com/index.asp?cmd=sh...I07¶m_1=61 |
The issue of "gorilla arm" came up three years ago in a Big Ten series. One coach complained that the umpires were not balking the involved pitcher (the umpires said no deception was involved, and since the NCAA rule book did not specifically cover this interp, the Pro interp was used). The umpires involved wrote the whole thing up to the NCAA rules folks, followed up several times, and this year's NCAA book contains an interp. Only took three years.
JJ |
What is the NCAA interp?
Thanks for the info Tribefan |
PA state rules interpreter said to me when i asked him about the gorrilla arm:
"It's great you're reading your rules like you are- but if you call that you're just asking for trouble. Theres a time when you need the rule book, but then there's times where you need to leave the rulebook in the car." |
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I guess there are times... but not many. We can't be cherry-picking which rules to ignore and which ones to enforce. That will only lead to trouble. Having said that... I think the new rule that came out this year (NFHS) about base-coaches leaving their boxes is rather silly. It's going to be difficult to watch the coach and the pitch at the same time. |
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Varsity 4-A game last night with an experienced lefty on the mound. First inning, with R1, he starts the gorilla arm swinging. I balked him immediately. Of course, the coach comes out of the dugout and asked what he was doing wrong. I told him that with the ball in hand, he could put hand behind back or at side. He gave me the "not trying to deceive anyone" argument. He told pitcher to put hand behind back. Third inning, same scenerio. I called it again. After that, no problem the rest of the way. Pitcher told my partner that no one had ever called it on him before. He said he did it because he saw it on tv.
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NCAA and Pro now "officially" agree by interp that the "gorilla arm" is legal. There is no intent to deceive. Once we get FED on board things will be better. Any guesses how long THAT will take? :D
JJ |
Gorilla arm is in the same catergory as the white around the Rawlings logo.
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I seen the gorrilla arm a few times when i first started a few years back and never felt comfortable calling that a balk in the first place, so lucky thing i was able to talk to my state interpreter at a clinic last year and bring it up on how he wants it enforced. Oz, what is your philosophy on why this rule should be strictly enforced? |
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My opinion - it is the stupidest thing that I have ever heard of. My son used to do the gorilla arm to "get the blood going". It is not a deception at all - but as Tee impressed on me, it is a mechanical flaw that is prohibited (for now) by the FED rulings. |
Mr. PWL, you are correct about the OBR rule; however, it has never been interpreted that the arm or hand need be stationary in those locations.
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See Oz, my philosophy is: i equate the gorrilla arm to holding in football. If holding in football occurs away from the play and had no effect on the play, it's not going to get called. Likewise for the gorrilla arm- if it had no effect on the play (ie- wasn't trying to deceive the runner), then i don't think it should be called. I think my state guy is thinking along the same lines. |
How can you equate the pitcher to someone holding away from the play in football. Nothing happens until the pitcher releases the ball. All eyes are on him at the beginning of the play. The rules say hand behind back or at side. How can you then say it is o.k. to swing the arm in front of the body. That is a direct and open violation of the rules that you are paid to enforce. You can not pick and choose which rules you will enforce. Do you call a ball fair if it was just a little bit foul?
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For not calling the gorrilla arm balk, i'm not going to get marked down on an evaluation, so i'm choosing not to enforce it because it's a rule that absolutely does not need strict enforcement. I like to let them play more often than not so i'm not going to call a violation which nobody was effected- much like holding away from the play in football. |
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