off season brain teaser
 

Ok, in the off season here, i have a lil' brain teaser for you all. I know the answer to this, do you?

Pitcher of team A pitches a perfect game, no body gets on base from Team B(no walks, hit batsman, etc. 27 staight outs anotherwords) But the batting averages of Team B does not change. How could this have happened?

gees
 

Bob Feller threw a no-hitter on opening day.

At the start of the day all the players on the visiting team batting averages of .000 and after the game their averages were the same .000.

Regards,

Good one.

How about this one. How can you have 3 outs recorded on a play with a batted ball without the defense touching it? I think I saw this one here so there will be some folks who know it, but it's a good brain teaser.

It was against the Chicago White Sox in 1940.

Bob

My favorites are:

How many outs are there in an inning? (More of a trick question)

and

In one inning, what are most hits a team can have without scoring a run?

6 for both.

1. The defense has to touch the ball to execute the appeals.
2. That's only two outs.
3. See # 2. You can't get a triple play on this.

How do you figure six for whats the most hits a team can get without scoring a run? :confused:

If im not mistaken only BR would be out and runners return.

No.

The defense doesn't touch the batted ball. It is over the fence.

Three singles (3 hits). Then, a batted ball hits a runner. Runner who got hit is out, runners return to their base or move up if forced and the batter gets credited with a hit. Thus, this can happen 3 times for 3 outs. Therefore, 6 hits.

Pretty Freakin' EASY!
 

Fakeumpire"lilleaguedan" posted:

"How do you figure six for whats the most hits a team can get without scoring a run? "

OK:

Hitter #1 hits a "tweener" and attempts to make an "inside the park home run" . . . he is thrown out at the plate . . . Hit "#1" . . .

Hitter #2 hits a "tweener" and attempts to make an "inside the park home run" . . . he is thrown out at the plate . . . Hit "#2" . . . TWO OUTS!

Hitter #3 hits an infield hit . . . Hit #3 . . .

Hitter #4 hits an infield hit . . . Hit #4 . . . runners now on first and second . . .

Hitter #5 hits an infield hit . . . Hit #5 . . . runners now at first, second, and third.

Hitter #6 hits a ball that strikes R2 betwix second and third base . . . and this, by rule, is called a "hit" . . . Hit #6.

Seems pretty easy too me.

Regards,

I'll take a stab at it just for fun.

R1 and R2. R1 takes off on first move. Towering pop up near second base. R2 begins his retreat to second upon hearing the call of IFF. R1 fails to hear the call and rounds second passing R2. R2 is now hit by the ball before he gets back to second base.

BR out on IFF
R1 out for passing
R2 out for being hit with a batted ball

It's third world as all get out, but it would get the three outs without the defense touching the ball.


Tim.

This was the answer as I heard it, although a HR with 3 missed bases should do it too.

Why not make it easier? Three infield singles followed by three ground balls betwix second and third base that strike R2. You obviously know section 10 exists.

Anyone realize how illogical some of these situations are :confused: It seems you guys added a few things into the equation. I interpreted it as 3 straight singles for that one. No where did it say the anyone had to be out. ;) If they get three staight hits, (no outs), then thats the max. if they could get another hit, it would drive in a run.

fakeump wrote:

"Anyone realize how illogical some of these situations are It seems you guys added a few things into the equation. I interpreted it as 3 straight singles for that one. No where did it say the anyone had to be out. If they get three staight hits, (no outs), then thats the max. if they could get another hit, it would drive in a run."

This ties for the dumbest post EVER on the internet.

DG wrote:

"You obviously know section 10 exists."

I am confused. These answers are rules issues not scoring issues. DG, I have never read one word of Rule 10 and never will.

Regards,

Oh, my.

Try to follow along Mr. Little League, I'll type slowly.

The question asked for the MOST hits without scoring a run. You answered "three". Other posters have demonstrated how six hits could be allowed without scoring a run.

Now, then, regardless of outs, is three equal to or greater than six?

In the real world, the answer is "no." Therefore, "three" is an incorrect answer. Remember, we are looking for the MOST hits.

You bring to mind the old saying, "It is best to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."

In addition to the other answers presented:

Bases loaded. All three runners abandon.

Dear Garth and Tim C., You missed my point. This is exactly why umpires and coaches misinterpret rules. Now, Question was whats the most hits a team can have with out scoring a run- 3, bases would be loaded. Number of outs is irrlevent, so why add in that runners would have to get out. Completly added something in the question that is not there. Three is not an incorrect answer. 1+1+1=3<6 but however the answer 6 isnt 100% correct, but would be 100% correct if outs were part of the equation. Gee, i sound like a math teacher who is teaching mathematical problems. :rolleyes:

I love that answer. This must have happened in the game that Tim C. and Garth decided to coach in. :)

No, you sound like a student who doesn't understand the question.

The question asked for the MOST hits. It neither stipulated no outs or three outs, it asked for the most hits.

Can six hits be allowed without a run scoring? Yes.
Is six the most that can be allowed without scoring? Yes.
Is six more than three? Yes.

Six is the correct answer and always has been in the, at least, 30 years that this question has been around. And strangely, you are the only one I've ever met who doesn't understand the question or the answer. Even at this site, in this thread, everyone else understood the correct answer.

God, I feel badly for your teachers.

ok Garth,

You made your point. But there is info added to the answer that stretches the truth a little.

Now back to the original post. :(

Hmm,
 

Dan, it is my opinion that you are being intentionally obtuse, or have a learning disability, or are just being a dickhead.

Here's why:

Your answer of "three" is not a "trivia" type answer. There are three bases so everyone would know there could be three hits to fill the bases with no runs scoring. That is a given . . .

Your contuned defense of the answer of "three" proves you really aren't smart enough to post here . . . or you are a fake and just turning up the heat (BTW, you have confused me on your age: here you say you are 15 but on the ABUA site you say you're 19).

I just think you want to see how much people will accept from you.

Regards,

Tim, im not on the ABUA site. your confusing me with someone else. Im 15.

Nothing was added. The question required knowledge of baseball.

You mean this?

Ok, in the off season here, i have a lil' brain teaser for you all. I know the answer to this, do you?

Yes, I do.

Tim,

I think this is the way it is:

Dan is from Pennsylvania, is 15, uses words that don't exist, such as "supposively," and is trying to fit in here, and is in need of our guidance.

Canadaump6 is from Canada (Dan spells "color" like an American, while CU6 spells it "colour" like a Canadian), is 19, tries to act intellectual and educated, and is a major troll, opening up long-dead threads.

They aren't the same person. It's sort of like Beatlemania. Not the Beatles, but an incredible simulation!:D

The question was:

In one inning, what are most hits a team can have without scoring a run?

The phrase "in one inning" is all you need to read to know that your interpretation is BS. The correct answer of 6 is the correct, reasoned answer to the question, as asked. Your interpretation reveals a SERIOUSLY flawed ability to apply analytical thinking to the simplest of problems.

You might want to consider trading in Little League umpiring for summer school classes.

Isn't section 10 what Corporal Klinger tried to get out of Korea on? No, that was section 8.... never mind...

JJ

At least Tracy follows his new designate.


Tim.

10.05(e) indicates that a fair ball striking a runner is scored a hit. Is this covered somewhere else in the rules?.

There is a way a pitcher could pitch a perfect game in mid-season with no changes in the batting averages of the opponents.

Leadoff guy takes ball 4, and the pitch gets away from F2 and rolls far away. BR makes it to 2B safely but is called out on appeal for missing 1B. The next 26 batters also take ball 4 and the same thing happens. So there would be 27 outs with no one reaching 1B safely, and because no one would be charged with an at bat, nobody's batting average would change.

The guys who have monkeys working at typewriters say that eventually such a game will be played.

In 1964, I saw the Baltimore Orioles score only 1 run against the Yankees on a single, a triple, and 3 more singles.

Key word in your statement, and the reason Tee has never read rule 10, is "scored."

This information did not come from sleuthing, B. O. Plenty! It was just simple observation, which stemmed from reading the posts of both gentlemen.

BTW, how are Gravel Gertie and Sparkle doing lately? Well, I'm off to see my true love, Tess Trueheart. Later!:)

Yes, my point exactly. To know that a batted ball striking a runner is "scored" a hit (the 6th hit in Tee's scenario)is indication there is some knowledge of rule 10, even if he didn't read it as he readily admits. My point was he has some knowledge of rule 10, even though he may not have acquired this knowledge by reading the rule.

It really doesn't hurt to know a little bit about rule 10, even if you don't need it to officiate a game. For those of us who have been coaches in our past and also occassionaly an official scorer at tournaments we must know rule 10. Granted, I haven't needed it much since umpiring only, but still seems useful.

Would this still be scored as a perfect game?

And another question
 

Always before if a player dropped a foul ball it was NEVER called an error until the batter finsihed his at bat -- if he made an out there was no error -- NOW a days they credit the rror immediately -- so if the "Able" hots a foul pop and is clearly erred by F3 -- next 27 hitters retired . . . is that a perfect game?

Rule 10 Questions
 

If I may tag on a question that I wanted to ask a scorekeeper.

Long ago, an error was never charged to a pitcher who didn't cleanly field a batted ball. However, F1 was awarded with an error if he proceeded to make a bad throw.

During the latest WS, a Tiger pitcher was charged with an error after he failed to cleanly field a bunted ball. I am certain the batter-runner would have preferred to have been credited with a base hit. Was this a correctly scored an "error" or the mistake of a certain well-known TV announcer?

The same situation happens frequently when a third baseman charges a good drag bunt and muffs the barehand pickup. It is most frequently scored a base hit because of the difficulty. Even if he makes the pick-up, he still has to throw the BR out.

Hey all,

It shouldn't be considered a perfect game since a perfect game does not allow for any walks.

LomUmp:cool:

No, just a no-hitter.

No, just a no-hitter. Perfect means perfect, as in no mistakes by the defense.

No, just a no-hitter. Perfect means perfect, as in no mistakes by the defense.

A perfect game is a game in which no batter reaches 1B safely. The following do not break up a perfect game:

1. Errors charged on dropped foul pops.
2. Apparent extra-base hits, including over-the-fence home runs, on which the BR is subsequently called out on appeal for missing 1B.
3. BR reaching 2B or beyond on an error, ball 4 passed ball, or ball 4 wild pitch, and then being called on out appeal for missing 1B.
4. Batter being HBP or being awarded 1B on ball 4 and then refusing to advance to 1B and being called out.

However, in case #2 and case #4 (and the "error" play in case #3), the batter is charged with an at bat.

As soon as a batter reaches 1B safely, the perfect game is over. Until then, it's a perfect game.

Always before if a player dropped a foul ball it was NEVER called an error until the batter finsihed his at bat -- if he made an out there was no error -- NOW a days they credit the rror immediately -- so if the "Able" hots a foul pop and is clearly erred by F3 -- next 27 hitters retired . . . is that a perfect game?

I'm 58. It's been an error as long as I can remember. No waiting to see what happens. If Abel hits a foul pop that F5 drops, and then hits a foul pop that F2 drops, and then hits a foul pop that F3 drops, and then strikes out. Score 3 errors and a strikeout. And if Dale Mitchell had done that on October 8, 1956, Don Larsen would still have been credited with a perfect game.

E1 on F1 not fielding a bunt cleanly, if there was a good chance that fielding it cleanly would have resulted in an out (almost always the case for F1). Bunts fielded by F1 are often sacrifice bunts.

F5 muffing a bare handed attempt on a good drag bunt is often ruled a base hit because there was no chance at getting an out on a well placed bunt. There is no chance fielding it with glove so bare handed is the best chance and not often a good one. If there was a good chance, or he had time to glove it, but tried bare handed instead, then E5.

JMHO as a long ago scorer at a number of tournaments.

Sadly
 

PWL is correct . . . an error was NEVER creditied on a dropped foul if the batter was then retired.

And that is a fact.

Ooops, that maybe another Rule 10 comment.

T

Baseball stat guys have gone back and disavowed games that were one time no hitters or perfect games. The reason for this being that the game didn't go the requisite nine innings.

That's true, and there used to be a "perfect game" that Babe Ruth started where he walked the first batter and then got thrown out of the game. Ernie Shore relieved, the runner was thrown out stealing, and Shore then retired the next 26 batters. That game still appears on some lists of perfect games, but I believe it was (much later) officially declared not a perfect game.

But a dropped foul pop, whether or not scored an error, has no bearing on a perfect game.

It's an error now, 10.13(a). And yes, another Rule 10 comment, although perhaps past tense and not present tense.

I don't know when it changed, but it's always been an error in games I scored, right or wrong at the time. If you drop an easy foul pop, E goes in the book immediately.

An error prevents an out. Seems logical to me.

Wasn't that when he was still with the Red Sox? It would still qualify as a no hitter. You should remember when six Astro pitchers combined for a no-hitter against the Yankees.

The game was on June 23, 1917, when Ruth was still with the Red Sox.

Many sources include it in lists of perfect games, but I believe that official recognition was removed. It still qualifies as a no-hitter, but I don't know whether the credit goes to Shore alone or it is considered a Ruth-Shore no-hitter, in other words, a no-hitter by multiple pitchers.

As long as I can remember, a fumble "which prolongs the time at bat of a batter" has been an error. I would be interested to know when that rule was established.

I assume this is because it could still be recorded as an error and the batter still makes an out and F1 still only faces 27 batters. That makes perfect sense to me.

I never knew this, but I now understand that I was wrong...

This is from the Wikipedia definition of a perfect game. (Emphasis mine):

Since 1991, a perfect game has been defined by Major League Baseball as a game in which a pitcher pitches a complete game victory that lasts a minimum of nine innings and in which no opposition player reaches first base. Thus, the pitcher cannot allow any hits, walks, hit batsmen, or any opposing player to reach base safely for any other reason—in short, "27 up, 27 down."

By definition, a perfect game must be both a no-hitter and a shutout. Since the pitcher cannot control whether or not his teammates commit any errors, the pitcher must be backed up by solid fielding to pitch a perfect game. An error that does not allow a baserunner, such as a misplayed foul ball, does not spoil a perfect game.

Several pitching performances regarded popularly as perfect games do not qualify as official under the present definition, among them weather-shortened games that featured no baserunners by one team and games in which a team reached first base only in extra innings.

I've seen two outs happen this way. You could have three.

Sacks juiced. a) B1 hits an infield fly (out 1). b) F6 loses ball in the atmosphere; the rock drops to the ground, fair and untouched. c) R2 stays put, and R1 passes him (out 2). d) 3B coacher grabs R3, who has strayed off the bag, and shoves him back to the sack (out 3).

I was doing a game where a, b and d actually occurred. Double play--no one touches the horsehide.

And a nice tension convention afterward.

ace