advice for the 90'
 

when i worked the 90' for the first time, I was taught to play the B&C positions close to the pitchers mound. How do you guys work it? I feel im too close, and in the way of the SS throwing the ball to 1st. Should i play it back more, closer to the infield dirt?

i think you should not use the word play anymore.

Too close?
 

I've seen umpires play too far back more often than too close.

I prefer to work closer to the mound also, ((in B)
and I never feel that I'm in the way of F6. The only time that should come into play would be if F6 charges a slow grounder and on that play i have plenty of time to move a couple of steps toward the mound.

When I use position C (usually in 3man mechanics), I prefer to stay back. Some of that is because of F6 and also I feel that I have a much better look at the play at second from that position.

Play around with it to see what works best for you.

Thanks
David

I don't know about the rest of you, but we train our umpires to not move left or right if a fielder asks them to move. We ask that they take a step toward the plate.


Tim.

Infield diagram
 

Each individual has his own preference. I was taught to start about halfway from the mound to 2B and then make an adjustment. Visualize the correct position using the following diagram.

http://www.nfhs.org/core/contentmana...%20diagram.pdf

It should help determine where you prefer to stand. I asked a similar question and GarthB pointed out that there is no exact place to stand.

No matter where you start, you will be in the way of some throw from F6 to F3 if you don't move. It's just a starting point -- you have to move slightly differently on every play to end up in the correct position and to not be in the way.

There's nothing magical about positioning with such inflexible precision. One or two steps either way is not going to have any significant impact on BU's responsibilities. It's an easy courtesy to extend and is just one more example of knowing which end of the stick to pick up. And it surprises me that an entire association thinks it's a big enough issue to actually provide "training" that addresses it.

If you're positioned properly you accomplish what the fielder wants by taking a step or two forward just as well as you would moving laterally.


Tim.

What he is getting at is that umpires are taught to move a step forward or backward, instead of sideways when asked to move "one left" or "one right" by an infielder. Moving left or right potentially puts one out of position. If you move a step forward or backward, you clear the fielder's vision without affecting your position adversely.

You should care what the fielder wants, by the way. You want them to make their plays, and you sure don't want to be in their way. The shortstop and second baseman are playing the game, you are just umpiring it. Don't get in their way, and let them do their jobs.

I am trying to remember the last time F6 asked for a step, and I can't. Usually, it's R2 who asks for a step right. I have always given the players the step if they ask for it, and have never been out of position on the next play because of it, at least that I can remember.

I have to admit, I'm a bit confused by that mechanic myself. If I'm on a direct line between, say, F4 and the plate, and I move along that line, I'm still goping to be in F4's way. I don't think, but I haven't tested it, that moving one step is going to change my perceived size relative to the plate either.

I think, though, that the point is that we all (?) agree that the umpire should move a step or so to accomodate the players.

Bob:
 

It is now trained at higher level clinics that when an infielder, or runner, asks an umpire in "C" to move:

"Hey Blue can you move to your left?"

Is for the umpire to move forwards (that means towards the plate NOT forward towards the pitcher) and that moves the umpire from a direct line between the fielder (runner) and F1.

This new mechanic accomplishes two things:

1) It moves the umpire foward which begins to open the angle to third base and gets him out of a direct line and DOES NOT move him into a disadvantagous position further from the potential play at third and,

2) Hard to believe but, much like the Gerry Davis Stance, the "size" prospective of the umpire also changes. i.e. the umpire appears smaller in your rear view mirror.

Bob, I was very skeptical of this when it was first mentioned to me . . . I now are a firm beleiver in the mechanic.

Regards,

First off, Tee did not suggest "moving toward a baseline." What he did say was that he agreed with me, that you take a step straight forward toward the plate, staying on the same line between the edge of the mound and the plate.

I was saying the same thing, not suggesting to move towards the pitcher. You can move a step to either side if you want, but I was saying, as Tee did, that modern training teaches the "step forward" mechanic.

You are right in that if an umpire is properly set with his hands on his knees, then the fielder and the runner should have no sight line issues. I am very seldom asked to move also. I try (hard as that is :rolleyes: ) to make myself as small as possible when in the infield, so as not to impair anybody's field of vision.

Did you mean "B" when you said "A"? Trying to picture it in my mind. Thanks.:)

Good idea, because we are more important than the game. Players need to play around us.

Well, that's what's being taught these days. Deal with it.

The physics on this is similar to the rising fastball physics ... it don't work.

Hehehe,
 

I'm sorry it does work. Try it before you throw out the bath water.

The logic is about the move towards the plate . . .even if you do it with "stick figures" on a napkin you'll see that the move towards the plate opens the fielder/runner sight line to F1.

I respect anyone's right to disagree . . . I just am dissappointed when people disagree without trying something first.

Regards,

Tee,

I've taken the time to draw this up, and i'm not seeing how your method works:

http://www.geocities.com/kugamonste/field.JPG


If the umpire (X) would move towards the plate, that would be in the runner's (R) same vision line illustrated in green.

Is my drawing and assumptions accurate? How would moving towards the plate solve the problem?

Different question
 

Tee's mechanic opens up a view of the pitcher to the blocked player. Your diagram makes it clear that you are asking how to open up a view to home plate.

Absolutely. The runner needs to see the pitcher, not the plate. He can and will take a bigger (secondary) lead-off once the pitch is delivered, and will make his own view of the plate, and the position of the umpire will be a moot point.

Boss:
 

Great drawing (I wish I had your internet skills). . . but it is not what we are talking about . . . HOWEVER, others can use it to uncover "the magic move", by now understanding that we are trying to see the pitcher and not the plate.

So move your runner a little towards third base so the BU is between him and the pitcher . . . now move the BU "forward" (towards the plate) and . . . viola . . . see what we are saying.

Again, thanks for the illustration as all can use it to now discover that what some of us are saying is EXACTLY correct . . . move forward (towards the plate) and the view opens, grasshopper!

Regards,

Ah yes, makes perfect sense now!

Not exactly!
 

Not exactly. The runner only needs to see F4. He has a coach that watches F6 for him. (At least that's the way it is in all the baseball that I've seen or played or umpired)

There is no way a runner is going to be watching F6 or he is easy prey for the pickoff from F4.

The runner then releases toward 3rd as the pitch is made. There are lots of different names - walking lead, etc.,

Thanks
David