LL only--7.13 miasma
 

R1, R3. R3 takes a legal lead after pitch. Ball is returned to F1. R3 moves back toward sack, then darts toward home again to draw a throw.

F1 is having none of it. He and F2 get ready for the pitch. F1 is on the slab, and R3 is standing a couple of feet off the base, both feet planted, making no move to return.

As F1 winds up, R3 returns to the pad, and stays there until B1 hits an infield grounder which is muffed.

When the dust clears, R3 has scored, R1 is on third and B1 is safe at first.

Now, you tell me what I did. I'll check for responses and tell you the outcome later today or tomorrow.

Ace in CT

Flag R3 for leaving early.

Because the ball was hit within the infield, the "poof" rule comes into effect.

R3 removed from bases, R2 to 3rd, R1 to 2B, B-R to 1B.

No run scores.


Try a hard one next time.

From here I see three options.

1. You judged the runner left early and ended up with R3, R2, and R1.
2. You judged the runner merely returned late and ended up with R3, R1 and a run scored. (But, you didn't do that, or you wouldn't have posted, I'm guessing.)
3. You called Williamsport for a ruling on another poorly written rule. (You probably didn't do that either.)

So, I pick door #1.
mick

Ummm..Rich? Looks like your "poof" was R2 appearing from nowhere...

Still, no run scores on R3 leaving early, bases now loaded.

:) <font></font>

Well, I hope you did nothing on this play.

Was R3 in contact with the bag when the pitch reached the batter? If yes, no flag. If no, drop the flag.

It's as simple as that folks.

Kyle:

The runner has to be in contact with the base at the time the ball is pitched or he's violated 7.13. In fact, a literal interpretation of 7.13 would suggest he needs to be back in contact as soon as the battery is set.


Tim.

Well, they say the poof is in the pudding!:)

Nice job, but I ...
 

.. and I picked door #1.

I have always used this interp. Pitcher ready + beginning his motion + runner off bag = hanky.

Sold it without too much tension, especially after ensuing batter hit a grand salami.

Ace

Rich... is this the Reverse Poof effect, where you are allowed to invent a runner and add him to the equation? Who the heck is R2? :)

No poof needed, as we have room for the BR. If the bases had been loaded, then poof comes into effect.

Bases loaded, let's play

The literal wording of 7.13 can be misapplied to mean a whole lot. The intention is to keep the runners from getting a head start. Period. If a pitcher sees a runner walking back to the back, and starts his motion, it's nothing. The runner can't leave before the pitch reaches the batter. Having the battery set only applies if the runner decides to take off. If he's not in contact during the motion, but gets back before the ball reaches the batter, we're in compliance with the letter, and the intent of the rule.

Again, JMHO and YMMV.

Try getting this one passed a protest committee. The rule is abundantly clear that the runner must be on the bag at the time the pitcher is ready to deliver the ball. There's no wiggle room here. If he's returning when the ball is delivered he's in violation. I was of the same opinion that you are until Andy Konyar responded to an e-mail I sent him last Summer. He set me straight in a hurry.


Tim.

Using the book, or Andys words, you can drop the flag if a runner raises his foot off the bag at any time between when the catcher faces the pitcher, to when the pitch reaches the batter.

I choose not enforce that interpretation, but there's enough fuzziness in the wording for us all to be right. Thus the real problem.

As you can probably tell, I don't lock-step to everything that Andy sez.


Kyle

Thats right. Why go by the book or apply the rules the way the UIC for the largest national youth baseball organization suggests when you can make your own stuff up. Give me a break, Kyle. It's no wonder why other umpires call all LL umpires Smitties.


Tim.

Easy now big guy.

The book states "When a pitcher is in contact with the pitcher's plate and in possession of the ball and the catcher is in the catcher's box ready to receive delivery of the ball, base runners shall not leave their bases until the ball has been delivered and has reached the batter".

A strict translation means if any runner is not in contact with a base when the pitcher and catcher are set, the umpires will drop their flags. We know that's not correct, but that's the way it reads. If we went by the letter of the wording F1 and F2 would race to their spots in order catch runners off base.

We all know the intention of this rule. And yes, there are widely varying translations to the above wording. Some go by the actual intent of the rule, and others by gospel of the green book. Third party edicts from Andy should be taken as seriously as the "a few stickers on a helmet are okay" statments from last year. (read: not very)

The intent is to keep the runner from gaining an advantage to the next base. But if an umpire is going to drop his flag because the battery is set before he gets back to the bag, or he momentarily lifts his foot off and on the base during the windup, who's the Smitty? I'm going with the spirit in which the rule was written, and not poorly crafted words that made it into the book.

That's what happens when one is half asleep after spending the day with a power washer trying to clean up after 6 1/2 feet of water invaded the house.


Anyhow, as the original post said the runner was just standing there and didn't return until after the pitcher started his windup, it is most definitely a flag throwing situation, the bases end up loaded with no run scoring.

Speed Rulez
 

If the pitcher and catcher decide to rush the game along, I for one will do my best to encourage it. I will also ask my partner to do the same thing. Hour and a half time limit set for the game. One side decides to rush a pitch every 12 seconds or less. Hey, runners beware. As a result, the game ends in 1 hour 10 minutes. Umps now have an extra twenty minute rest period before the next game. Time for that soda and hotdog.:D

Please note
 

Even though the rule doesn't spell out what the off-base runner is doing, I flagged him because he was standing flat-footed off the base, making no attempt to return, when F1 was beginning his pitch.

This, for me, amplifies the violation, causing the hanky.

Ace

Ace ...................
 

FWIW, I think your application of this rule is spot-on. I know you'll probably sleep alot better tonight knowing I agree with you.:D :D :D




Doug