Looked in the search but too much info about other things.


No force and a runner is tagged but not with the mit or the ball. Legal or not? Could I just stretch and get him with my other hand or arm or ??? (assuming I do have possession of the ball.)

Oh yeah,Jeeter was WAY out at third last night....
Thanks,
Stu
Indy

Even <i>with</i> a force, the tag has to be with the ball, not an empty glove or hand (or elbow or foot or knee). On a force play, however, the fielder in possession of the ball can touch the base with an empty glove or hand (or elbow, etc.).

Look and search in Rule 2.00 TAG.

Tag of a players must be with the hand or glove holding the ball.


BTW - the fielder knelt ON the bag, not in front of it (mistake) and it left the front edge of the base open.

Had a partner get into a good discussion on a similar play - runners on first and second, nobody out, looper to center that is short-hopped by the fielder (no catch). He throws the ball to third ahead of the sliding runner, the umpire watches the play and calls, "SAFE!". Coach comes out and says, "Why?". Umpire replies, "He got in under the tag." Coach then says, "But he was kneeling on the bag when the runner slid in, and it was a force out." Umpire looked confused, listened to his rear being chewed awhile but did not eject the coach, and ultimately learned to watch the whole play from then on. The safe call, right or wrong, stood. I did say it was a partner, didn't I? :) Yeah, that's it. A partner...

I think this is a "correctable error."
Oops, sorry, I've been on the basketball forum a lot lately.

Damn rights!
 

Ooops! My mistake coach... he's out on the force.

You need to do what is right for baseball not your ego. A short discussion with your partner .. then let him change the call.

I hope I am not correctly hearing what you are suggesting. What I hear is, "Oops, I made a mistake and I now realize it. Let me go talk to my partner, have a discussion and then back away and let my partner 'reverse' the call."

I can see where this would do nothing but needlessly cause your credibility and competency to be questioned for the remainder of the game, as well as go against proper procedures.

We all have mental farts. I was PU and had a fly foul ball right at near the batting teams enclosed dugout. The dugout was silent until the ball was about 25 feet about the fielders head and then they yell together, and loudly, "I'VE GOT IT!" The fielder and I both jumped about out of our skins.

I called interference on the bence and ruled an out. The only problem was that the ball fell on the dead ball side of a 15 foot fence. The coach immediately reminded me of this, I immediately changed my call and we continued the game with no problems.

SC: The play as described is not being questioned because of the umpire's "judgment." I mean, it's not like a banger at 1st or a possible pulled foot that the coach comes out and argues the decision (judgment). This play is being questioned because of (umpire's) failure to apply a "rule."
The rule being that on a force (fly ball not caught) the runner must reach his advance base before the fielder secures the ball (and touches base or runner). This runner clearly did not beat the throw as EVERYONE knows. Imagine this is an elimination play-off game, bottom of the 7th, tie game, winner goes to state championship tourney, loser goes home. Hmmm...

When you misapply or fail to apply a "rule" it CAN be corrected, and rightly so (obviously before the next pitch). An umpire who admits a mistake (even such an embarassing one) and applies the rule correctly will gain respect. Insisting on sticking with your (incorrect ruling) will harm your credibility. IMO

I don't understand your post. It sounds like we are in perfect agreement on the point you made, along with DTTB. It <i><b>is</b></i> a correctable error.

My concern with the post to which I replied is that I believe the poster was stating to have a conversation with the partner and let the partner override you even when you already know you are wrong.

I agree with you. If a mistake was made with rule interpretation that the umpire immediately realized, then just overturn the call right away. There is no need for a "short discussion with your partner .. then let him change the call." First, it is still the original umpire's call. Second, if it's an obvious brain fart, just fix it, as in the example I gave. (And for which I need to apoligize for if it is perhaps considered off topic.)

I think Clark was assuming it was his partner at 3rd making the mistake, and calling for a short conversation with the umpire in the field, and letting the base umpire correct his own call.

I don't think he was advocating what you're suggesting... at least I hope not.

mbcrowder Senior Member
Has understood what I said. Thank you.
My pre-game with any partner consists of "If you feel you have made the right call we will have no discussion. If there is any doubt of your call, or I have doubt of mine, we will have a conference and do what is right for baseball not our egos."

SC: Sorry for the mix-up. I though you meant that there should be no change once a call has been made (right or wrong). I agree that if you know your mistake, then just fix it. However, there ARE times when umpires need to confer about a call. One may not be positive about a rule and the crew can put their heads together to get the right interpretation. I believe this can be beneficial and it doesn't have to involve one umpire "over-ruling" another
Just like you said; go over it in your pre-game.