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-   -   Out or continue at bat? (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/102765-out-continue-bat.html)

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sat Jun 24, 2017 08:41am

Out or continue at bat?
 
NFHS Baseball Rules.

B1 is at bat with a x-2 count. B1 squares to bunt and holds the bat, motionless, in the strike zone. F1's pitch strikes the bat on the knob and ball eventually becomes a foul ball. Is B1 out?

What say you?

MTD, Sr.

scrounge Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:17am

Out, of course. The definition of a bunt:

2-8-1: A bunt is a fair ball in which the batter does not swing to hit the ball, but holds the bat in the path of the ball to tap it slowly to the infield. If an attempt to bunt is a foul ball, it is treated the same as any other foul ball, except that if the attempt is by a batter who has two strikes, such batter is out as in 7-4-1e.

By holding the bat motionless, was he holding the bat in the path of the ball? That's exactly what he did - it couldn't have hit the bat if it wasn't in the path of the ball. Now if he tried to pull it back or give SOME indication that he was taking evasive action? Different story. But if he's just going to stand there like a goof? Learn to bunt better, enjoy your short walk back to the dugout.

Rich Ives Sat Jun 24, 2017 07:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by scrounge (Post 1007214)
Out, of course. The definition of a bunt:

2-8-1: A bunt is a fair ball in which the batter does not swing to hit the ball, but holds the bat in the path of the ball to tap it slowly to the infield. If an attempt to bunt is a foul ball, it is treated the same as any other foul ball, except that if the attempt is by a batter who has two strikes, such batter is out as in 7-4-1e.

By holding the bat motionless, was he holding the bat in the path of the ball? That's exactly what he did - it couldn't have hit the bat if it wasn't in the path of the ball. Now if he tried to pull it back or give SOME indication that he was taking evasive action? Different story. But if he's just going to stand there like a goof? Learn to bunt better, enjoy your short walk back to the dugout.

The ball hit the bat. On the knob. No way was it an attempt to tap the ball.

Foul ball.

thumpferee Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:47pm

Are we all this bored?

Mr DeNucci, please read ur other OP, illegal player!

Mbilica Sat Jun 24, 2017 11:54pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Ives (Post 1007218)
The ball hit the bat. On the knob. No way was it an attempt to tap the ball.

Foul ball.

Unless he was holding the bat by the barrel![emoji12]

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

bob jenkins Sun Jun 25, 2017 07:14am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 1007213)
NFHS Baseball Rules.

B1 is at bat with a x-2 count. B1 squares to bunt and holds the bat, motionless, in the strike zone. F1's pitch strikes the bat on the knob and ball eventually becomes a foul ball. Is B1 out?

What say you?

There's some element of HTBT in this. If the ball had barely missed the bat -- would the umpire have judged it to be a strike (on the "swing")? If so, then it's an out. Otherwise it's just a foul ball.

Mountaincoach Sun Jun 25, 2017 06:35pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Ives (Post 1007218)
The ball hit the bat. On the knob. No way was it an attempt to tap the ball.

Foul ball.

And if the same ball hit the same bat on the same knob and shot out into fair territory, what are you going to call then? Foul ball?

The situation described in the OP is very simple--batter is OUT. Attempt and intention has nothing to do with it.

Rich Ives Sun Jun 25, 2017 08:06pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach (Post 1007243)
And if the same ball hit the same bat on the same knob and shot out into fair territory, what are you going to call then? Foul ball? No - it's a batted ball - play it.

The situation described in the OP is very simple--batter is OUT. Attempt and intention has nothing to do with it. It does on a bunt because you are out on a "3rd strike" bunt that goes foul but not on just a plain batted ball that goes foul. A bunt is a batted ball INTENTIONALLY MET. No intent, no bunt.
Still a batted ball.

Understand the difference.

LRZ Sun Jun 25, 2017 08:47pm

Intent requires the exercise of judgment.

Mountaincoach Sun Jun 25, 2017 09:31pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich Ives (Post 1007246)
Understand the difference.

Can you quote that in the rule book? The "intention" part? Just trying to learn here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LRZ (Post 1007248)
Intent requires the exercise of judgment.

Agreed. If a player presents a bat over the plate and makes no attempt whatsoever to pull back or disengage from the pitch, that's quite a bit of intent.

Rich Sun Jun 25, 2017 09:40pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach (Post 1007251)
Can you quote that in the rule book? The "intention" part? Just trying to learn here.



Agreed. If a player presents a bat over the plate and makes no attempt whatsoever to pull back or disengage from the pitch, that's quite a bit of intent.

In softball, that's enough intent. In baseball, it's not.

Matt Sun Jun 25, 2017 09:46pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach (Post 1007251)
Can you quote that in the rule book? The "intention" part? Just trying to learn here.

It's only an out if the ball is bunted foul with two strikes. The definition of bunt is that the ball is intentionally met with the bat. Any other contact with the bat is played fair or foul as the case may be.

Derek007 Sun Jun 25, 2017 09:58pm

dont think intent has anything to do with it. Have you ever seen a batter duck from a pitch and have it hit his bat. It happens all the time, most cases a foul ball but certainly no intent to hit the ball.

Matt Sun Jun 25, 2017 10:32pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek007 (Post 1007256)
dont think intent has anything to do with it. Have you ever seen a batter duck from a pitch and have it hit his bat. It happens all the time, most cases a foul ball but certainly no intent to hit the ball.

See my post above yours.

Rich Ives Mon Jun 26, 2017 12:22am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek007 (Post 1007256)
dont think intent has anything to do with it. Have you ever seen a batter duck from a pitch and have it hit his bat. It happens all the time, most cases a foul ball but certainly no intent to hit the ball.

It matters on a bunt. See my response above.


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