Scoring Error at End of Game (help with situation)

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

bainsey wrote
I'm curious about your mechanic. Is there anything else you do to distinguish a 2 from a 3, before and/or after the shot?

What I want to know is: If NO official signaled a 3-pt field goal then why in the world did the Scoreboard Operator add three points to the score?

MTD, Sr.

RookieDude

Huntin' Ref wrote
No, I did do it this game. I was just always told not to do it in the past so I have refrained. Then last year in a MNSHSL playoff game I didn't do it and it was part of my observation report so I did it last night. I think it is a helpful mechanic as long as the observers agree.......

...and the table crew actually observes you.

RookieDude

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
What I want to know is: If NO official signaled a 3-pt field goal then why in the world did the Scoreboard Operator add three points to the score?

MTD, Sr.

...because chseagle wasn't in charge.😉

JugglingReferee

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
What I want to know is: If NO official signaled a 3-pt field goal then why in the world did the Scoreboard Operator add three points to the score?

MTD, Sr.

How many timers do you know start the clock when they think the ball is first touched rather than when you chop in time?

Nevadaref

Huntin' Ref wrote
So, you are saying that if that final shot doesn't go in we can correct the score after the final horn? It is an ugly situation because even the team that ultimately won (home) thought they were tied and the visiting team didn't foul because they thought it was tied as well. No win situation, unless you catch the scoreboard error right away.....

Yep, that's what should be done.

2006-07 NFHS Basketball Rules Interpretations

SITUATION 10: The score is tied at the end of regulation time. During the intermission between the fourth quarter and the beginning of the overtime period, the official scorer advises the referee that A1′s three-point goal earlier in the fourth quarter was recorded in the scorebook improperly as a two-point goal. The referee verifies the mistake. RULING: The game is over and Team A has won. Since the ball had not yet become live in the overtime period, it need not be played. (2-11-11; 5-3; 5-7-4)

BillyMac

AllPurposeGamer wrote
I also fully expect to see Billy tell us about how this is the mechanic in his little corner of Connecticut

Even better, an image.

And for once, it's not just in my little corner, it's for the whole state.

Scratch85

RookieDude wrote
I look at the table and descretely put two fingers near my mid-section.

JugglingReferee wrote
If there's a close play, I always show 2 if a foot is barely on the line.

Me too. If it (the 3) is in my primary, I will discreetly hold two fingers low like the old days.

Huntin' Ref wrote
Well, I can honestly say I can't remember ever signalling "2" before,

You must have missed the old days. 🙂

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
What I want to know is: If NO official signaled a 3-pt field goal then why in the world did the Scoreboard Operator add three points to the score?

MTD, Sr.

This is a trick question . . . right? 😛

Sounds like everything was correct and others have already pointed out the correctable score issue.

And I have no intention of asking about a "corner of Connecticut" or how one goes about getting that pictogram image. 😀

bob jenkins

I'm poinitng at the ground when the shot is taken (shows up on film that we didn't just make s*** up after the fact) AND showing two points to the table as we turn to go the other way.

McMac

I also point to the ground with two fingers and then if made show it to the table and say "two" loud enough for the table to hear. Authorized mechanic? Probably not, but it gets the point across that it is definitely a 2.

jdw3018

I agree with most everyone and would also signal 2, but as the OP noted, it would have been better if (and should have been) caught immediately by the officials. If the shot is close and the players react as if it was a 3, you have to get a glance at the scoreboard to make certain the score is recorded correctly.

CoachNRef

is it possible to over-communicate with the table in these type sits?

bainsey

BillyMac wrote
Even better, an image.

Billy, I'm not seeing this in my book. This is an IAABO image?

FWIW, I've also been holding two fingers while looking at the table (not more than a second or two) after such a made shot. I honestly can't speak to whether it's approved or not.

HawkeyeCubP

Yes, it's from the IAABO manual.

twocentsworth

CoachNRef wrote
is it possible to over-communicate with the table in these type sits?

NO.

I'm not sure why some have said they would be "discreet" in holding two fingers up for the table to see. You want to make sure the table, the players, the coaches, the fans, the video, and your assignor who will watch the game later on video (after the coach calls to complain that "everyone thought it was a 3") sees that it is a two-point shot.

This situation calls for ANYTHING but being discreet.

SCalScoreKeeper

I believe your official scorer could've been of some help in this instance too.I'm going to look for one of three things in this situation-
A.Hands in the air noting a made 3 point shot.
B.Two Fingers at the waist.
C.No signal given (assume a two point basket)

In this case I would've seen the point to the ground mechanic from the trail and once the ball goes through the net said "2,2" so that the clock operator,visiting scorekeeper,and myself are on the same page.This one is tough because it is correctable but there was no dead ball prior to the go ahead basket.If I had a dead ball between shots then I would ask "Hey ____________, just to clarify was the last shot for _______ a 2 or 3? Answer in this case would be a two, we'd make the adjustment on the board and finish the game out.

chseagle

SCalScoreKeeper wrote
I believe your official scorer could've been of some help in this instance too.I'm going to look for one of three things in this situation-
A.Hands in the air noting a made 3 point shot.
B.Two Fingers at the waist.
C.No signal given (assume a two point basket)

In this case I would've seen the point to the ground mechanic from the trail and once the ball goes through the net said "2,2" so that the clock operator,visiting scorekeeper,and myself are on the same page.This one is tough because it is correctable but there was no dead ball prior to the go ahead basket.If I had a dead ball between shots then I would ask "Hey ____________, just to clarify was the last shot for _______ a 2 or 3? Answer in this case would be a two, we'd make the adjustment on the board and finish the game out.

Another good table mechanic would be for the timer/scoreboard & scorer to watch the floor officials, instead of ball/player watching, for the field goal signal if the shot is questionable.

Was the scorer's table court level or a couple of rows up in the stands?

chseagle

JugglingReferee wrote
How many timers do you know start the clock when they think the ball is first touched rather than when you chop in time?

Far too many timers are guilty of either starting the clock too early or about 1-2 seconds late.

constable

HawkeyeCubP wrote
Yes, it's from the IAABO manual.

Hmmm.. I can't find it in my manual...

page reference?

Huntin' Ref

RookieDude wrote
...and the table crew actually observes you.

No, not the table crew. State assigned personnel.

Huntin' Ref

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. wrote
What I want to know is: If NO official signaled a 3-pt field goal then why in the world did the Scoreboard Operator add three points to the score?

MTD, Sr.

MTD, I have no idea. I just got a copy of the game and watched the play. My partners didn't signal a 3 in any way and one of them "mirrored" a 2 when he saw me (but it was 10+ feet out of his primary). Absolutely no reason for the table to put up a 3, just shows they don't watch us like they should I guess......

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