WORST mechanic in Basketball

rotationslim

The end of timeout mechanic is horrible. It is as if it is designed to make the ref look like a stooge to the crowd. Look at it from the crowd point of view: You jog across the court, and try to communicate with a coach surrounded by players in a tight scrum, so it's like you are right back at the jr. high dance, standing on the wall, being ignored. Then you stand there being ignored for a while, and the coach breaks when the coach wants to break. Why do they have us insert ourselves into the team moment-- seems very counter to good officiating theory. There are some things in it that make sense if you understand the nuance, but to the fans we just look like idiots.

JRutledge

If you say so. Then again I do not care what fans think about anything we do.

Peace

bob jenkins

Improvement suggestions?

Raymond

I have no problems. I hit my whistle loudly and announce "First horn". Half the time, at least in the games I do, there is an AC who acknowledges me and then informs his boss to start wrapping things up.

Raymond

bob jenkins wrote
Improvement suggestions?

No first horn whistle. They hear the horns, so start issuing DOG warnings when they are too slow after the second horn, then T the rest of the game.

(I don't think this needs to be done, but if the OP wants us out of the process, that's the way to go)

LRZ

Raymond, wouldn't the FED remedy for delay following a TO be the drastic ROP, not a DOG warning?

UNIgiantslayers

I've never even thought about it. We always pregame that if a coach delays more than once, we'll use the prescribed procedures to make sure it doesn't happen anymore. I got dinged on an eval this year for staying close to the huddle after the first horn to make sure they broke the huddle on time. He said get in, let them know, and get away-- no need to stick around.

bob jenkins

UNIgiantslayers wrote
I've never even thought about it. We always pregame that if a coach delays more than once, we'll use the prescribed procedures to make sure it doesn't happen anymore. I got dinged on an eval this year for staying close to the huddle after the first horn to make sure they broke the huddle on time. He said get in, let them know, and get away-- no need to stick around.

I will just point out that the specific mechanics on this vary by area and level (some stay in, some leave right away, some stay until the ROP starts, ....)

bucky

In NCAAM they wanted us to go on first horn, stay, and dig them out. Then the subsequent year, they wanted us to go over at first horn, tell them, and get away. When has, under normal TO circumstances, there ever been two teams ready to play at the second horn? Dumb IMO.

I think that coaches/players are numb to first horns, or horns in general. But they do not appear to be numb to whistles. At first horn, a long, loud blast of the whistle usually causes TO activity to cease and players break huddles.

jTheUmp

Had a team a couple of weeks ago that's notorious for being late out of time-outs. Also had an R whose personal pet peeve is teams being late out of time-outs.

R's pregame speech emphasized the "let's be ready to play on the second horn", but sure enough, they were slow getting out of the TO.

On the second TO, this team was going to be on defense, and the throw-in was going to take place right next to their bench. Since I had to be over there anyway to administer the throw-in, I stood right next to their huddle. About a second after the 2nd horn, they were still huddling, so I blew my whistle as hard as I possibly could for about 3 seconds, about 3 feet from the coaches ear.

They weren't late coming out of a TO for the rest of the night. 😀

bainsey

rotationslim wrote
...the coach breaks when the coach wants to break.

Resumption of play?

jeremy341a

If we had/would put the ball on the floor at the second horn with no exception then this would stop real quick.

UNIgiantslayers

jeremy341a wrote
if we had/would put the ball on the floor at the second horn with no exception then this would stop real quick.

qft.

[deleted]

I wish the NFHS had NCAA-length timeouts. I never seem to have a problem with college teams breaking the huddle -- after 75 seconds of hearing their coach drone on they want to get out of there and play again.

The NFHS resumption of play procedure also sucks when you have to use it. I had to whack a coach after I used it on him earlier this year after they were still in the huddle 5 seconds after the 2nd horn after multiple warnings by my partner. The other team was ready to go and so were the refs. I switched tableside a min later and he was yelling in my ear "that's funny", and "you better do that allllll game!" and would not calm down so I just gave him one. The best part was that the other team did the same thing late in the 4th and I put the ball down on them too. 😀

#olderthanilook

What Raymond and jeremy341a said.

I hit my whistle hard with two or three bursts when approaching the huddle. I've noticed there's usually a player or two on the fringe that immediately stand at attention/turn around and look, as well as, an ass. coach that usually looks at me and nods then dives into the huddle.

Most teams are out of there before the 2nd horn.

The most frustrating thing about my experiences on any given night are not with the team. It's with my partner that's not as assertive as I am when approaching the other team.

Grrrrrrr

sj

It can help to mention this issue to the assistants for both teams before the game and ask for them to be alert to help.

bainsey

AremRed wrote
The NFHS resumption of play procedure also sucks when you have to use it.

Not if teams in your area expect you to use it.

Generally speaking, on the second horn, if teams are making a legitimate effort to get on the floor/to the throw-in spot, I'll hold the ball for a few seconds. If they're still huddling with zero effort, I'll look at my partner, whistle, call direction & point, set the ball down, start counting, and prepare for the high-tailing to the ball.

This season, I've only had one game where this was necessary, and my partner and I had to do it FOUR times. (I've never seen that many.) Surprisingly, they all got it in under the five seconds, and at least two were opposite line.

UNIgiantslayers

Has anyone ever had a T after one ROP? If I understand the rule, that's the proper procedure, correct?

bob jenkins

UNIgiantslayers wrote
Has anyone ever had a T after one ROP? If I understand the rule, that's the proper procedure, correct?

I think it's only a T if the team continues to delay during the same event.

That is, you could use the ROP in the first quarter, and again in the second if a team delayed without issuing a T.

UNIgiantslayers

bob jenkins wrote
I think it's only a T if the team continues to delay during the same event.

That is, you could use the ROP in the first quarter, and again in the second if a team delayed without issuing a T.

7-5-1-c says "Following a violation by one team only, if that team continues to delay when authorized to make a throw in, it is a technical foul."

7-5-1-d says "Following a violation by both teams, any further delay by either team is a technical foul."

Case play on this doesn't give a whole lot of clarity re: further delays by one team only. The rule seems ambiguous as to whether this is all further violations or just subsequent throw-ins related to THIS particular throw in. I'd read it as any further delays during the game but I don't make the big bucks so I defer to those with superior knowledge and experience (pretty much everybody in the world).