Player does not sit a tick...or does he?

bucky

AremRed wrote
Correct, you can always pull back a player. If you pull them back before the beckon then they don't have to sit a tick. If they have been beckoned then you can still pull them back but they would then have to sit until clock ran.

Yes, in layman's terms for subs, one is never required to "play a tick", only requirement is to "sit a tick."

packersowner

AremRed wrote
Correct, you can always pull back a player. If you pull them back before the beckon then they don't have to sit a tick. If they have been beckoned then you can still pull them back but they would then have to sit until clock ran.

And in this case, a timeout can't buy your way back in, correct?

bucky

Raymond wrote
The clock legally starts upon B1's deflection.

Just to further an extra thought....

More specifically, B1's legal deflection. Had B1 kicked the ball, then the official should not have chopped time, the clock should not have started (if it did then reset to previous time), and the sub (A1) could not enter.

frezer11

packersowner wrote
And in this case, a timeout can't buy your way back in, correct?

frezer11 wrote
I don't have my rule book handy today, am I correct in saying that a timeout does NOT buy his way in either? That's only an injury situation correct?

bob jenkins wrote
Yes.

Correct, same situation I was curious about earlier.

BillyMac

Under what situation may a substitute legally enter the game without sitting a tick?

A player who has been replaced, or directed to leave the game, shall not re-enter (with rare exception) before the next opportunity to substitute after the clock has been started properly following his, or her, replacement. In other words, a player who has been replaced must sit a tick of the clock, however, a player doesn’t have to play a tick of the clock.

sdoebler

BillyMac wrote
Under what situation may a substitute legally enter the game without sitting a tick?

A player who has been replaced, or directed to leave the game, shall not re-enter (with rare exception) before the next opportunity to substitute after the clock has been started properly following his, or her, replacement. In other words, a player who has been replaced must sit a tick of the clock, however, a player doesn’t have to play a tick of the clock.

Are there a list of exceptions? I had an interesting play where B2 committed a foul and the table informed us that it was his fifth foul and he was replaced. After shooting 1 of 2 free throws the table informed us that it was actually his fourth foul and he was not disqualified, and the coach put him back in. Is there a rule available that lets him enter the game as no time has run off the clock?

so cal lurker

BillyMac wrote
Under what situation may a substitute legally enter the game without sitting a tick?

A player who has been replaced, or directed to leave the game, shall not re-enter (with rare exception) before the next opportunity to substitute after the clock has been started properly following his, or her, replacement. In other words, a player who has been replaced must sit a tick of the clock, however, a player doesn’t have to play a tick of the clock.

IIRC, if no other sub is available and a player can't continue. E.g., the team is down to 6 eligible players, the sub takes place, and before the "tick," a player is injured, blood is discovered on a player in the game, or a player fouls out or is ejected. The team doesn't have to play short.

BillyMac

so cal lurker wrote
IIRC, if no other sub is available and a player can't continue. E.g., the team is down to 6 eligible players, the sub takes place, and before the "tick," a player is injured, blood is discovered on a player in the game, or a player fouls out or is ejected. The team doesn't have to play short.

Bingo. Is there any other exception? I can't think of one, but there are a lot of really bright officials on the Forum who may come up with another exception.

BillyMac

sdoebler wrote
... B2 committed a foul and the table informed us that it was his fifth foul and he was replaced. After shooting 1 of 2 free throws the table informed us that it was actually his fourth foul and he was not disqualified ... Is there a rule available that lets him enter the game as no time has run off the clock?

Since he was replaced, I don't believe that he may reenter until he sits a tick.

Camron Rust

sdoebler wrote
Are there a list of exceptions? I had an interesting play where B2 committed a foul and the table informed us that it was his fifth foul and he was replaced. After shooting 1 of 2 free throws the table informed us that it was actually his fourth foul and he was not disqualified, and the coach put him back in. Is there a rule available that lets him enter the game as no time has run off the clock?

This is a perfect time for 2-3.

The substitution wasn't a choice and was forced based on a scorekeeper error. I'm letting that player back in.

That scenario is not one considered by the normal expectations the rules are written for.

bucky

BillyMac wrote
Since he was replaced, I don't believe that he may reenter until he sits a tick.

I have always allowed the player immediate reentry into the game when they were subbed out due to official/table error/miscommunication. I have had it twice this season in fact. Both times, table informed us it was the player's fifth foul when it actually wasn't.

BillyMac

Camron Rust wrote
This is a perfect time for 2-3. The substitution wasn't a choice and was forced based on a scorekeeper error. I'm letting that player back in. That scenario is not one considered by the normal expectations the rules are written for.

Agree on two statements, that it's not a normal exception, and to let the player reenter under 2-3 (and purpose and intent).

BillyMac

bucky wrote
I have had it twice this season in fact. Both times, table informed us it was the player's fifth foul when it actually wasn't.

Thirty-seven years and I've never had this happen.

Twice in a partial season? What kind of table crews are you working with?

sdoebler

BillyMac wrote
Thirty-seven years and I've never had this happen.

Twice in a partial season? What kind of table crews are you working with?

That is the table not the crew I believe

bucky

BillyMac wrote
Thirty-seven years and I've never had this happen.

Twice in a partial season? What kind of table crews are you working with?

Both situations involved home scorers that had inadvertently given the wrong player a foul based on similar numbers. Example: Foul was on A21 but foul was recorded on A12.

It did not involve inexperienced scorers, two-handed reporting, or errors by the officials. The visiting score book provided input and it was resolved. In both cases, it was fairly obvious what occurred and the home scorers admitted the mistakes. Those involved mostly laughed it off and everyone was understanding about allowing the players to return. Home scorers just had brain freezes.