Going out of bounds: 9-3

BigT

wyo96 wrote
I cannot find the rule reference (or case play) for not calling a violation when a player goes out of bounds when bumped.

A1 is running the baseline, gets a little incidental contact that causes him to take a step or 2 out of bounds, comes back in and catches the pass. I know this is not a violation, but 9-3-3 just says "A player shall not leave the court for an unauthorized reason".

Is there a past interp I am missing, or is just applying the judgement that contact makes it "authorized"? Can someone direct me to the correct place?

Had a coach make a big deal about it this weekend.

Did he nail a three? Did he gain any advantage? Coach I skipped on the block because it didnt affect the play. Ok coach we are moving on. Or hey just say ok and keep refereeing. I think you did the right thing. If I have a player run out I warn them to stay in bounds. If they get a wide open 3 I call out of bounds on them. Coach asks I say it is a T but I dont want to call it. They normally let me move on.

BigCat

wyo96 wrote
I cannot find the rule reference (or case play) for not calling a violation when a player goes out of bounds when bumped.

A1 is running the baseline, gets a little incidental contact that causes him to take a step or 2 out of bounds, comes back in and catches the pass. I know this is not a violation, but 9-3-3 just says "A player shall not leave the court for an unauthorized reason".

Is there a past interp I am missing, or is just applying the judgement that contact makes it "authorized"? Can someone direct me to the correct place?

Had a coach make a big deal about it this weekend.

The player did not leave the court "voluntarily" is the word used in case plays. If i shoot layup and continue OOB because of momentum i have not left court for unauthorized reason. 7.1.1b and a few others in that area.

A player bumped OOB is not voluntarily leaving..and thus "unauthorized."

Adam

"Authorized reason" is not really defined, but it's generally understood as "on purpose" (with some other requirements as well). Don't go looking for reasons to call it, as it should pretty much call itself, and you're not going to want to call it even when it does.

If this situation applied, as UNI notes, you should get the foul on that bump.

Adam

Coach is probably making a big deal for one of two reasons.

1. He was reading the rule book on Friday and discovered something.
2. Someone called it that way recently and he thinks *that guy* was right and you were wrong, especially now that it would have benefited his team.

billyu2

wyo96 wrote
I cannot find the rule reference (or case play) for not calling a violation when a player goes out of bounds when bumped.

A1 is running the baseline, gets a little incidental contact that causes him to take a step or 2 out of bounds, comes back in and catches the pass. I know this is not a violation, but 9-3-3 just says "A player shall not leave the court for an unauthorized reason".

Is there a past interp I am missing, or is just applying the judgement that contact makes it "authorized"? Can someone direct me to the correct place?

Had a coach make a big deal about it this weekend.

What would you do in these two situations?
1. A1 is holding the ball high looking to pass when B1 bellys up with a little
incidental contact that causes A1 to take a step (or 2) with his pivot
foot?
2. B5 places his hand on the hip of post player A5 who does not have the
ball. A5 then receives a pass and B5 continues to keep his hand on the
hip of A5.

BigT

billyu2 wrote
What would you do in these two situations?
1. A1 is holding the ball high looking to pass when B1 bellys up with a little
incidental contact that causes A1 to take a step (or 2) with his pivot
foot?
2. B5 places his hand on the hip of post player A5 who does not have the
ball. A5 then receives a pass and B5 continues to keep his hand on the
hip of A5.

1-DOG
2-I would say hands...if he controls the ball or slows the player I am ready to call a foul depending on how easily he scores...

UNIgiantslayers

BigT wrote
1-DOG
2-I would say hands...if he controls the ball or slows the player I am ready to call a foul depending on how easily he scores...

In 1, I don't think it's during a throw-in.

wyo96

billyu2 wrote
What would you do in these two situations?
1. A1 is holding the ball high looking to pass when B1 bellys up with a little
incidental contact that causes A1 to take a step (or 2) with his pivot
foot?
2. B5 places his hand on the hip of post player A5 who does not have the
ball. A5 then receives a pass and B5 continues to keep his hand on the
hip of A5.

1: It is not incidental if B1 causes the travel. FOUL.

2: Not relevant to the OP, but talk him out of it or foul.

The key to the OP is I deemed it incidental, so what happens next.

I understand that each official may have a slightly difference tolerance for IC.

Camron Rust

BigCat wrote
The player did not leave the court "voluntarily" is the word used in case plays. If i shoot layup and continue OOB because of momentum i have not left court for unauthorized reason. 7.1.1b and a few others in that area.

A player bumped OOB is not voluntarily leaving..and thus "unauthorized."

I would be careful about voluntarily. Momentum is the natural result of a voluntary action. The player voluntarily chose to take a layup that would carry them OOB after releasing the shot.

It is close, but not really accurate.

Adam wrote
"Authorized reason" is not really defined, but it's generally understood as "on purpose" (with some other requirements as well). Don't go looking for reasons to call it, as it should pretty much call itself, and you're not going to want to call it even when it does.

If this situation applied, as UNI notes, you should get the foul on that bump.

This would be closer, IMO.

It is a violation when player chooses (or volunteers) to go OOB as an independent act.

Adam

Camron Rust wrote
It is a violation when player chooses (or volunteers) to go OOB as an independent act.

I like this distinction. It verbalizes the way we approach it. Otherwise, a player leaping out of bounds to "save" the ball would be considered to be violating the rule. That's obviously not what the rule is meant to address.

BigCat

Camron Rust wrote
I would be careful about voluntarily. Momentum is the natural result of a voluntary action. The player voluntarily chose to take a layup that would carry them OOB after releasing the shot.

It is close, but not really accurate.

This would be closer, IMO.

It is a violation when player chooses (or volunteers) to go OOB as an independent act.

Voluntarily means "own free will." case plays say momentum is not voluntary. Therefore not unauthorized. I might be able to choose better words but I use, and always recommend to others that they use, the words from the book. Here, the book uses voluntary/voluntarily. I think if I was sitting at a table with folks having 10 minute discussion I'd get to describing it as independent act etc. Telling a coach in 5 seconds I'm going to say " he didn't leave "voluntarily." Look it up rule 7 case book."

BillyMac

9.3.3 SITUATION A: A1 receives a pass while in the restricted area of the lane.
A1 passes the ball to A2 outside the three-point line. In order to get the three-second
count stopped, A1 steps directly out of bounds under A's basket. RULING:
A1 is charged with a violation for leaving the court for an unauthorized reason.
(9-7)

9.3.3 SITUATION B: A1 and A2 set a double screen near the end line. A3 intentionally
goes out of bounds outside the end line to have his/her defender detained
by the double screen. RULING: The official shall call a violation on A3 as soon as
he/she steps out of bounds. The ball is awarded to Team B at a designated spot
nearest to where the violation occurred.

9.3.3 SITUATION C: A1 and A2 set a double screen near the end line. B3 intentionally
goes out of bounds outside the end line to avoid being detained by A1 and
A2. Just as B3 goes out of bounds, A3's try is in flight. RULING: B3 is called for
a leaving-the-floor violation. Team A will receive the ball out of bounds at a spot
nearest to where the violation occurred. Since the violation is on the defense, the
ball does not become dead until the try has ended. If the try is successful, it will
count. (6-7-9 Exception d)

BigCat

BillyMac wrote
9.3.3 SITUATION A: A1 receives a pass while in the restricted area of the lane.
A1 passes the ball to A2 outside the three-point line. In order to get the three-second
count stopped, A1 steps directly out of bounds under A's basket. RULING:
A1 is charged with a violation for leaving the court for an unauthorized reason.
(9-7)

9.3.3 SITUATION B: A1 and A2 set a double screen near the end line. A3 intentionally
goes out of bounds outside the end line to have his/her defender detained
by the double screen. RULING: The official shall call a violation on A3 as soon as
he/she steps out of bounds. The ball is awarded to Team B at a designated spot
nearest to where the violation occurred.

9.3.3 SITUATION C: A1 and A2 set a double screen near the end line. B3 intentionally
goes out of bounds outside the end line to avoid being detained by A1 and
A2. Just as B3 goes out of bounds, A3's try is in flight. RULING: B3 is called for
a leaving-the-floor violation. Team A will receive the ball out of bounds at a spot
nearest to where the violation occurred. Since the violation is on the defense, the
ball does not become dead until the try has ended. If the try is successful, it will
count. (6-7-9 Exception d)

Go to 7.1.1 and look at those plays.

BigCat

Adam wrote
Coach is probably making a big deal for one of two reasons.

1. He was reading the rule book on Friday and discovered something.
2. Someone called it that way recently and he thinks *that guy* was right and you were wrong, especially now that it would have benefited his team.

Or...he's just an ass.....

BillyMac

BigCat wrote
Go to 7.1.1 and look at those plays.

7.1.1 SITUATION B: A1 blocks a pass near the end line. The ball falls to the
floor inbounds, but A1, who is off balance, steps off the court. A1 returns
inbounds, secures control of the ball and dribbles. RULING: Legal. A1 did not
leave the court voluntarily and did not have control of the ball when he/she did.
This situation is similar to one in which A1 makes a try from under the basket and
momentum carries A1 off the court. If the try is unsuccessful, A1 may come back
onto the court and regain control since A1 did not leave the court voluntarily and
did not have control of the ball when he/she did.

7.1.1 SITUATION C: A1 blocks a pass near the sideline and the ball goes into
A1’s front court. A1’s momentum carries him/her out of bounds. He/she immediately
returns inbounds, secures control of the ball, dribbles, shoots, and scores.
RULING: Legal. (4-35-1a; 7-1-2; 9-3)

7.1.1 SITUATION D: A1 jumps from inbounds to retrieve an errant pass near a
boundary line. A1 catches the ball while in the air and tosses it back to the court.
A1 lands out of bounds and (a) is the first to touch the ball after returning
inbounds; (b) returns inbounds and immediately dribbles the ball; or (c) picks up
the ball after returning to the court and then begins a dribble. RULING: Legal in (a) and (b). Illegal in (c) as the controlled toss of the ball to the court by A1 constitutes
the start of a dribble, dribbling a second time after picking up the ball is
an illegal dribble violation. (4-15-5; 4-15-6d; 4-35; 9-5)

BillyMac

If a player gains an advantage not intended by rule, then I'm calling a violation when he goes out of bounds.

I've only had one of these in a game. I'm the lead, A1 goes around a low post screen, and in doing so intentionally goes out of bounds, almost running into me. It surprises me, so I say to myself "I'm calling a violation if he does this again". After a foul switch down the other end, we're back with the same team on offense, but with my partner as the lead. A1 again goes around a low post screen, and in doing so intentionally goes out of bounds, almost running into my partner. He calls the violation (with no input from me). The coach requests an explanation. When my partner explains the violation, the coach looks at my partner like he's from Mars.