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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 08:14am
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horse collar in EZ

NFHS

Team A is on their own 2 yard line. QB A1 scrambles in the end zone and is tackled by horse collar in the end zone by B1. How is the penalty enforced?
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 08:31am
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My first thought is the run ended in the end zone. The Penalty Enforcement Spot should be the end of the run. In this scenario the I am enforcing the penalty from the goal line with the ball ending up on A's 15 yardline
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 08:32am
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Originally Posted by phansen View Post
NFHS

Team A is on their own 2 yard line. QB A1 scrambles in the end zone and is tackled by horse collar in the end zone by B1. How is the penalty enforced?
NF: 10-5-2, "The enforcement spot for any foul by the defense is the goal line when the run ends in the end zone and would result in a safety."
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 08:45am
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Originally Posted by ajmc View Post
NF: 10-5-2, "The enforcement spot for any foul by the defense is the goal line when the run ends in the end zone and would result in a safety."
This can't be a safety!
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 08:47am
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Originally Posted by GoodwillRef View Post
This can't be a safety!
It would have been if B had not fouled.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 09:01am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoodwillRef View Post
This can't be a safety!
Of course not... another example of the classic FED and NCAA run-on sentence. Throw in a comma - they really mean that if the play WOULD HAVE resulted in a safety (sans the penalty), the enforcement spot is the goal line.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 09:05am
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Originally Posted by mbcrowder View Post
Of course not... another example of the classic FED and NCAA run-on sentence. Throw in a comma - they really mean that if the play WOULD HAVE resulted in a safety (sans the penalty), the enforcement spot is the goal line.
Thank you...it is early but no that early.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 09:35am
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The result of the play is a safety without a penalty. So you tell the team if they do not want a safety then accept the penalty. And based on the overall situation in the game that might not be something we should automatically assume.

Peace
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 10:39am
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Lightbulb Canadian Ruling

Quote:
Originally Posted by phansen View Post
Team A is on their own 2 yard line. QB A1 scrambles in the end zone and is tackled by horse collar in the end zone by B1. How is the penalty enforced?
CANADIAN RULING:

UR before YG is PLS or PBD. The bullets are A's choice first.
  • PLS: Team A 1D/10 @ A-17.
  • PBD: Score the Safety Touch, then Team B's option:
    1. Team B 1D/10 @ B-20.
    2. Team A KO @ A-50.
    3. Team B KO @ B-20.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 10:42am
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
The result of the play is a safety without a penalty. So you tell the team if they do not want a safety then accept the penalty. And based on the overall situation in the game that might not be something we should automatically assume.

Peace
exactly.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 10:43am
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
The result of the play is a safety without a penalty. So you tell the team if they do not want a safety then accept the penalty. And based on the overall situation in the game that might not be something we should automatically assume.

Peace
Yeah, because a team would rather give the other guys 2 pts and the ball rather than replaying the down from the 15 (a 13yd gain with no down counted). Do you even think before you answer? Come up with some reasonable situation where any team would not take the penalty.

Last edited by Just Me; Fri Sep 24, 2010 at 10:46am.
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 11:04am
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Originally Posted by Just Me View Post
Yeah, because a team would rather give the other guys 2 pts and the ball rather than replaying the down from the 15 (a 13yd gain with no down counted). Do you even think before you answer? Come up with some reasonable situation where any team would not take the penalty.
How many posts do you have?

Yes, game situation they might want to take the field position with the two points instead of taking the ball at the 15. Not likely, but very possible which is why you give them the option. I do recall a pro coach took the wind in OT instead of getting the ball. And they lost but the coach wanted the wind so bad and ended up losing. Not our job to think for coaches.

I think officials often assume teams want something only to find out the team wanted the not so obvious option. But hey, forgive me for having dealt with that personally as an official then talking about it only on a forum like some will do.

Peace
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 12:03pm
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I've never had to deal with it personally, but I've seen many a college team take a safety with the lead so they could kick the ball to the other end of the field and play field position. I don't see the difference here. It seems reasonable to me that in some cases taking the safety may be the best alternative. But that's just me
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 12:11pm
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Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
How many posts do you have?

Yes, game situation they might want to take the field position with the two points instead of taking the ball at the 15. Not likely, but very possible which is why you give them the option. I do recall a pro coach took the wind in OT instead of getting the ball. And they lost but the coach wanted the wind so bad and ended up losing. Not our job to think for coaches.

I think officials often assume teams want something only to find out the team wanted the not so obvious option. But hey, forgive me for having dealt with that personally as an official then talking about it only on a forum like some will do.

Peace
Good point JRut...his number of posts stands at 5!
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Old Fri Sep 24, 2010, 12:28pm
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Originally Posted by mbcrowder View Post
Of course not... another example of the classic FED and NCAA run-on sentence. Throw in a comma - they really mean that if the play WOULD HAVE resulted in a safety (sans the penalty), the enforcement spot is the goal line.
Actually, the grammar is correct here, though elliptical. Let me fill it in:

The enforcement spot is the goal line when (two conditions are both met, namely: )
(a) the run ends in the end zone, and
(b) (the play) would result in a safety (if A declines the penalty).

Yeah, that's better.
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Last edited by mbyron; Fri Sep 24, 2010 at 12:33pm.
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