NFHS Rules Changes Predictions/Rumors/Desires

[Pantherdreams]

1 - Any support or freedoms they can give to encourage shot clock.

2- Allowing players on the lane to leave on the release, and eliminating the wiping off of made baskets for violations made by teammates on the lane.

3 - Any removal on restrictions or application of as many fashion police items as possible.

4 - 1 TC/PC mechanic.

5 - Lets make "over the back" an actual thing so that players/coaches/fans can acutally properly ask for something.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

5 - Lets make "over the back" an actual thing so that players/coaches/fans can acutally properly ask for something.

So how in the heck are you going to accomplish this? You would need to completely change rules to make the back special and probably would have to define (by changing other definitions) when this could take place. The verticality rules are already clear and in place. I do not want to add a rule that would get screwed up by the wording. And I think this is not going to happen.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by AremRed

I would like:

The goaltending rule to mirror the NCAA-M rule
The ability to put a "coaching box warning", "bench warning", or "coach warning" in the book, for whatever that's worth
Addition of a direct technical foul with no free throws that counts toward an ejection
The NCAA-M "automatic" hand check fouls, not just RSBQ

Mechanics changes:
Lead able to administer sideline throw-in below the FTLE
Lead's area includes primary on 3-point shooter in their corner à la NCAA-W
NCAA-M switching (not popular)
Ability to use game clock for 10 second backcourt count
Emphasis that C cannot initiate a rotation
Emphasis that the "Official Signals" are more like guidelines

These are just off the top of my head, I'm sure I can think of more.

GT....the backboard element is fine for 3-man where you have a C low enough to get a good angle on the timing of the block vs. the board. With 2-man, that is a difficult angle. Even in the NCAA, the C and T are left guessing some of the time. The apex is easy to see and judge....leave it alone.

Direct T, with no shots....what would that be for? What would be worth a T but no shots?

Lead does administer such throw-ins, in two man

All mechanics are already just guidelines. They should usually be followed, but they are still just guidelines.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by APG

Why would you want to get rid of the POI?

APG:

I know that I am "old school" to a degree and that I can be obstinate sometimes when the Rules Committees (NFHS, NCAA Men's/Women's) make rules changes that make no sense.

I do not have a problem with a rule change that makes the game better. What I am against is a change of the rules that addresses a situation that occurs once in 1x10**100 (I am engaging in some hyperbole here.) plays which when this extremely rare play occurs The Rule of Unintended Consequences rears its ugly head.

I don't want to go into detail but I think the Correctable Error rule change about 20 years or so ago is one change that was one that was not needed but the excuse given was it made the game fairer, even though CEs, that while not extremely rare, do not occur so frequently that the rule needed to be changed.

The POI rule is one that makes the rules more complex than they need to be. I am a firm believer in putting the ball back into play in the order that "things" happen. But still, I have not, am not, and will not lose any sleep over the POI rule even though I would get rid of it if I could be the Basketball Czar for a day.

What really fries my tuchus is the TF rule in both the NFHS and the NCAA Men's/Women's (I am not in favor of the change in the NCAA Men's Guarding Rule change of this past season, so see my Basketball Czar comment above.).

The page size of the NFHS and NCAA Men's/Women's rules books are approximately the same size. The TF section in the NFHS Rules is five pages and in the NCAA Men's/Women's Rules is eight pages. The page size of the NBCUSC (forefather/mother of the NFHS and NCAA Men's/Women's) 1971-72 Rule Book is the same size as today, yet the TF section is only two pages long. (I resisted the urge to make the font size the same size as the number of pages, .)

I have a Bachelor of Engineering degree with major in Civil Engineering (specialization in Structural Engineering and Highway Engineering) and a double minor in Mechanical Engineering (specialization in Engineering Mechanics) and Mathematics (specialization in Scientific and Engineering Applications) so I think that I am a fairly intelligent person. BUT my brain just explodes every time I read the NCAA TF section (The NFHS section just makes my head hurt like Charlie Brown's.). The most important rule in engineering design is: KISS (Not the band for you head bangers out there, .). Keep It Simple Stupid! The NFHS and NCAA has not done that and there is no reason for such complexity in the TF section. The TF sections should be no longer that three pages and still accomplish what the Rules Committees goals.

I didn't intend for this post to be so long (who am I kidding, ), but seriously, if I could be Basketball Czar for just one day I would abolish the AP Rule, .

I hope that answered your question. Now I have to wonder if MTD, Jr., and I are going to have a H.S. baseball game to umpire this afternoon. Our game yesterday was canceled because there was one inch of snow on the ground and today the high is supposed to be 45F with wind chill temperatures in the mid-30Fs, and the home school is on Spring Break and we can't get in contact with the AD or HC. Have a good one.

MTD, Sr.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If you cannot get JUCO and other small colleges to get a person to run a shot clock properly, without constant corrections, I do not think they will find consistency with 800 or so schools. I never want to see the shot clock at high school either. Not unless you have someone that is trained more to do the job. Often it is a kid or someone that would rather text message to a friend in the stands. No thanks!!!!

Peace

We heard all these same types of comments as we were putting the shot clock in...guess what - it wasn't (and isn't) as big a problem as you think it is.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

We heard all these same types of comments as we were putting the shot clock in...guess what - it wasn't (and isn't) as big a problem as you think it is.

Well that is great, then make it a state adopted rule and I hope my state does not adopt the rule.

But most of all this is going to be a cost issue. Schools that can barely afford athletics as it is will have to take on another expense. And in many cases will have to put in something in different gyms. Schools are having a problem getting uniforms for all their sports and now they will have to add thousands of dollars for a device? And yes not every school is funded the same way across the country. Many school districts are funded by property taxes and that means some schools have much more money than the other based on the community and house prices. I think that is one of the reason the NF is not going to touch this rule anytime soon. I am sure it is much worse in some other states.

Peace

[grunewar]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

But most of all this is going to be a cost issue.

I know here in VA, you pay your taxes, THEN you pay ~$100 for the honor of having your child participate in a V sport, and THEN you have to pay again at the game to see them play. Nice (sarc).

Yep, cost will certainly be a discussion point for shot clocks.

[Pantherdreams]

Originally Posted by grunewar

I know here in VA, you pay your taxes, THEN you pay ~$100 for the honor of having your child participate in a V sport, and THEN you have to pay again at the game to see them play. Nice (sarc).

Yep, cost will certainly be a discussion point for shot clocks.

Can't disagree that in some situations it would be a cost that might be difficult to bear in some situations but its not a huge cost.

You can get individual clocks for less 300 and a decent package with two clocks and the wireless device to run them for less than a thousand.

If the high school kids run a summer day camp for elementary aged kids and charge them 50 bucks a pop and give them a 5 dollar tshirt and a week of basketball you've got them paid for.

You are talking about half the cost of 1 set of nice uniforms.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

...
If the high school kids run a summer day camp for elementary aged kids and charge them 50 bucks a pop and give them a 5 dollar tshirt and a week of basketball you've got them paid for.

You are talking about half the cost of 1 set of nice uniforms.

How many HS in one area do you think can do this? You need customers for a camp. And if there are 10 camps going on in one area, not every camp is going get enough money.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

We heard all these same types of comments as we were putting the shot clock in...guess what - it wasn't (and isn't) as big a problem as you think it is.

The bolded portion means it is still a problem. And we, at least around here, do not need the added headache. Not just a question of compentent table personnel, also competent officials.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

The bolded portion means it is still a problem. And we, at least around here, do not need the added headache. Not just a question of compentent table personnel, also competent officials.

You work NCAA games, right? How often do you have shot clock issues in a game?

It isn't any higher (and quite often is lower) per game than any of the college games I work.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

The bolded portion means it is still a problem. And we, at least around here, do not need the added headache. Not just a question of compentent table personnel, also competent officials.

This is my concern. All it takes is one major problem with the shot clock and someone is going to complain they were screwed. And I do not feel most HS officials honestly can keep themselves from further problems. At least not where the learning curve it would take to solve the issue. Yes, I realize many states do this already, but we have a larger state than many and I do not want the headaches trying to solve basic clock issues that some kid will screw up. Heck we have enough problems with trying to solve book issues, not we want to add that to someone that does not know the basic rules that a shot clock would apply?

Peace

[JetMetFan]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This is my concern. All it takes is one major problem with the shot clock and someone is going to complain they were screwed. And I do not feel most HS officials honestly can keep themselves from further problems. At least not where the learning curve it would take to solve the issue. Yes, I realize many states do this already, but we have a larger state than many and I do not want the headaches trying to solve basic clock issues that some kid will screw up. Heck we have enough problems with trying to solve book issues, not we want to add that to someone that does not know the basic rules that a shot clock would apply?

Peace

I have to agree with Jeff here. I work with a shot-clock in my GV games and without one in most of my BV games. The headache comes from worrying whether the kid - and 99% of the time it's a kid - operating the shot-clock is paying attention or has even been trained properly. We still do the ten-second count in my GV game by hand because NYS didn't want to take it for granted that the shot-clock operators would reset/start the thing properly.

The only positive for me is I can solve shot-clock problems in my NCAAW games in a heartbeat because I'm so used to checking the thing from my HS games.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

... time-out requests having to come from a player.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

1 TC/PC mechanic.

Agree, but let's not forget that all team control fouls aren't exactly the same as all player control fouls.