Crazy rundown

Pirates-Mets

http://m.mlb.com/video/v34094561/nym...n-long-rundown

[ozzy6900]

I have him safe at 3rd. Each time he fell, his feet were within the limits of the 3 feet. There is no rule that says you have to remain erect in a rundown. I would expect a rookie to call this runner out but now a seasoned umpire who understands the rules and the game.

[rbmartin]

7.08 Any runner is out when—
(a) (1) He runs more than three feet away from his base path to avoid being tagged unless his action is to avoid interference with a fielder fielding a batted ball. A runner’s base path is established when the tag attempt occurs and is a straight line from the runner to the base he is attempting to reach safely...

Save yourselves some time and skip to 2:39 on the above video clip.

I guess my question is, on a rundown play is there 1 base path established when the first tag attempt occurs or when a runner changes directions, thus altering "the base he is attempting to reach safely" and altering the player attempting the tag, is a new baseline established?

Having said all this, I think the runner in the above play probably did violate the "3 foot rule" but MLB (and lower levels) seem to give a quite a bit of leeway on this call so the no-call is pretty consistent in my opinion.

[Matt]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

There is no rule that says you have to remain erect in a rundown.

I don't know if I could ever even be erect in a rundown.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by rbmartin

I guess my question is, on a rundown play is there 1 base path established when the first tag attempt occurs or when a runner changes directions, thus altering "the base he is attempting to reach safely" and altering the player attempting the tag, is a new baseline established?

The secodn option -- a new baseline each time

Originally Posted by Matt

I don't know if I could ever even be erect in a rundown.

Well, if she's cute enough it can happen, Oh -- I thought you said rubdown. Never mind.

[jicecone]

There were two tag events and therefore each time the path changes to the time the tag attempt is made. As shown, it is possible to have the feet less than three feet away from the baseline and the body greater than three feet. The rule does not specify which part of the body has to fit within that criteria.

I am with Ozzy on this one.

Although, I wonder how many umpires would be to quick to call this and get it wrong?

[rbmartin]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

The secodn option -- a new baseline each time

I agree. This allows for much more deviation by the runner than most would think.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by Matt

I don't know if I could ever even be erect in a rundown.

HA!!! Now that I look at my choice of words......................

How about "upright"?

[rbmartin]

Another grey area on this play is the phrase "when the tag attempt occurs" .
Does that mean when the fielder receives the throw or when he reaches out with the ball to actually touch the runner? Again, I would lean toward the second option within reason. Obviously if the runner took off into left field, the fielder may never reach out to apply the tag.

[chapmaja]

I have an out on this play. Why? When he goes towards the grass, he has established his baseline on the outfield side of the base. He then turns, takes a full length step towards home plate, pivots, and still slides even farther into the grass. There is no way, from the point he turns (and the defensive player is reaching to tag him) that he stays within 3 feet of the baseline he had established. The view from directly over 3rd base is key. I don't see him staying within 3 feet, unless the umpire rules that a defensive player is not attempting to make a tag until the point where the runner turns and runs toward home plate.

[rbmartin]

Originally Posted by chapmaja

I have an out on this play. Why? When he goes towards the grass, he has established his baseline on the outfield side of the base. He then turns, takes a full length step towards home plate, pivots, and still slides even farther into the grass. There is no way, from the point he turns (and the defensive player is reaching to tag him) that he stays within 3 feet of the baseline he had established. The view from directly over 3rd base is key. I don't see him staying within 3 feet, unless the umpire rules that a defensive player is not attempting to make a tag until the point where the runner turns and runs toward home plate.

I believe you are correct in your assessment that he deviated in excess of 3 feet. It's just not usually called at this level.

[dash_riprock]

Originally Posted by Matt

I don't know if I could ever even be erect in a rundown.

That's the difference between a rundown and a pickle.